Cato Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 What follows is a look at a stillborn project. Ultimately abandoned when the urge to build the Pocher Rolls Royce became too powerful. Indeed there is a long history to it but the task to 'get it right' became more tedious than fun. Back in the late '90's, I bought the Italeri 1/16 Gullwing, a kit reputed at the time to be a quality effort. As was my custom, I bought two at that time, one to build and one to back-up. I left one NIB and built the first. I did not use extensive reference then, just basically built OOB and to my taste. Never, but almost completed, it went into storage while I diverted to other projects. The design of the door inner and outer panels forced the doors to sit above the roof when closed. I only noticed after paint-you had to address that warp problem by constructing the interior beforehand. So disappointment set in. Early last year, I dug it out as Skip Jordan is most expert in classic Benz. And he has volumes on this car. He complimented my build but immediately pointed out what now are glaring errors, never noticed by me while building the first. Altough Italeri has many nice details, beautiful thin chrome moldings and engine detail, they got major stuff wrong with the coachwork. Seen here in the first build, there are enormous humps in the fenders over the front wheels. Then there are the too deep rockers under the doors, with no taper forward as the 1:1. And of course the door / roof warp issue learned from the first build. More>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 25, 2014 Author Share Posted July 25, 2014 With the help of excellent photos and advice from Skip, I attacked the NIB virgin with Dremel and 220 grit. Using the 1st build, I tried the techniques to get the shapes right. I ground nearly 3mm from the fender tops, working hard to keep them rounded and even. The straightedge shows 3mm lower on driver side: I loved the color scheme from the first build (Testors British green ENAMEL and Sand acrylic for the cockpit) and indeed, used the interior (with the newer IP, more carefully painted and detailed) as a core for newer techniques like embossing powder and accurizing the seats. I even used the original chassis and engine (not complete or detailed yet) because I had a nice satin black finish already and the wheels and tires were done. So this saved build time which I used to correct things you shouldn't have to. More to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DynoMight Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 That color is pretty sharp on that. Hope to see more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 (edited) One thing I discovered while reviewing the body issues ( a "d'oh!" moment for me) is that Italeri apparently derived the main body from their 300 SL roadster kit. The coupe and roadster may look the same, but they're not. Besides the obvious door differences, Mercedes made a number of modifications to the design when they came up with the roadster (after the Gullwing): According to Mercedes expert Dennis Adler in his definitive book, "300 SL," the roadster has more pronounced front fenders and a larger grille, for a more modern and aggressive look. Plus, if you compare the "eyebrows" over the wheel wells, you'll see that the roadster's are more curved. And like the roadster, the Italeri Gullwing doesn't have a full body pan. Everything in Italeri's Gullwing engine bay is the same as their roadster, but there are differences between the 1:1 cars. All of this is carried over into the Italeri Gullwing. Hopefully, Cato will show the outstanding work he's done to fix some of these issues. Generally, the 1/16 Italeri roadster is very accurate, except for a wrong windshield shape (easy to fix). The 1/16 Minicraft Gullwing is more accurate than the Italeri, with a one-piece body shell without the separate nose and tail valances like Italeri or their other mistakes, and includes a complete space frame (a bit hard to fit). However, the window trim is molded on and needs foiling, unlike Italeri's separate chrome trim, and there is no firewall. Italeri's engine has crisper detail, and is crisper overall. Italeri's interior is more complete. Edited July 25, 2014 by sjordan2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 26, 2014 Author Share Posted July 26, 2014 With doors that expose much of the cockpit when up, the glaring errors of the seats ruin an otherwise nice interior. Reference photos shows the seats as having side bolsters that wrap around the back. These are lower than the pleated leather of the seat back. To get closer to real, I sanded the seat sides flat and made new sides from .010" sheet. Also made a simple rectangular separate back: http:// The carpeting was done with brown embossing powder and the seats painted to match the original core cockpit scheme. Tiny PE rivets simulate trim screws on the side panels and door bottoms: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 26, 2014 Author Share Posted July 26, 2014 You can see the complete inner door panel waiting to join the outer door skin. That's where the big trouble is. Both parts have different curved shapes, making the door sit proud of the roof or body side. No amount of warp-removal techniques worked, primarily because the A and B pillars are so thin and delicate: The hard part... As nice as many aspects of this kit are, the complexity of the tooling to get the body panels to mate causes a major problem. The doors and their separate interior panels have two different contours. When you join them together, there will inevitably be a warp causing the door assembly to not mate flush with the body work. The only solution I could see is to mount the doors in the open position. I wanted to at least have one side closed to show the beautiful lines of this classic. So I settled on that compromise after a TON of work to try to get flush fits. Here is the body work in Fine White primer, after seam filling, cutting down the front fenders and trimming the rocker panels. I joined the door outers to the body with tape and white glue and sanded like a maniac to get them flush with the roof and body sides. There are some very thin areas on those door edges. Amazingly, after taking out 3mm from the front fenders, there is still substantial plastic left there. Even after sanding, you can see the passenger side door above the roof with the door side flush to the body. And that's without the inner panel glued to the door: Seen here, the 2mm trim off the bottom of the rocker and the taper going forward to the wheel opening. This gives the model a lower, correct scale look: Having decided the passenger door must remain up, I began the paint process. When building kit #1 in the '90's, I fell in love with Testors British Green (non metallic) - unfortunately enamel. It was not available in lacquer (my preferred medium due to much shorter drying time) so I went ahead using the standard enamel caution; let it dry! Fast forward to kit #2 and I amazingly found Testors still makes the exact color today. I found that the spray can atomized the paint nearly as well as a Tamiya so I did not decant to airbrush. I have no dehydrator so again I would wait long periods between coats and further work. Seen here is a mist 'guide coat'. The primer was sanded with 1200 first and this color coat was sanded lightly also with 1200 looking for low spots. Fortunately, I had pretty flat body work after primer so no filler needed. The beautiful contours of the design are clearly evident here, faithfully reproduced by Italeri: More soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 The details are just spot-on. The engine finishes are perfect, and few modelers get the interior panels and screws right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 26, 2014 Author Share Posted July 26, 2014 The details are just spot-on. The engine finishes are perfect, and few modelers get the interior panels and screws right. I had help from a very knowledgeable enthusiast... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cien1986 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Incredible.... but i find the engine bay slightly different with monogram... may i know what you are using for carpet? Is it flocking powder like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 "The carpeting was done with brown embossing powder". It is a finer material than model flocking. It is sold in craft stores for the scrapbooking hobby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaymcminn Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Beautiful work, Cato. I don't get why it's so hard for manufacturers to get the 300sl right in any scale. It seems like they all have pretty substantial issues. Can't wait to see more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Beautiful work, Cato. I don't get why it's so hard for manufacturers to get the 300sl right in any scale. It seems like they all have pretty substantial issues. Can't wait to see more! I've seen most if not all of the Gullwing plastic kits, and there are, indeed, next to none of them without issues. I haven't built the 1/25 AMT version, but it looks better overall than many, though lacking a certain amount of detail. The only Gullwing model of any kind that appears to have gotten just about everything right is the pricey 1/12 diecast from Premium Classixx, averaging about $350. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 The end...for now? Ultimately, putting so much effort into (for me) an unfixable project is sad. So I used the opportunity to improve my techniques for the looming Big Rolls build. Yes, I can build it and display it with the one door up but I did set out dreaming of operable doors. The hood and trunk operate just fine. I'm in love with the form of the design and that door askew just broke my heart. Having gone so far, I challenged myself to do the best paint I ever did since the rest of the body was perfectly prepared. The same effort and techniques will work on the Rolls, so it's not a total failure. After the guide coat was sanded, I applied medium coats of British green with plenty of dry time between. I avoided dust mites so I was lucky-I have neither spray booth nor dehydrator. Between coats, I dried it in a large plastic storage box-inverted-and elevated an inch above the table surface. That to gas out and protect from dust. After 2 weeks, I tried a light sanding with 3600 grit wet. Indeed all color sanding was wet. I let that sit another week and was satisfied that the enamel had truly dried. Then the enamel clear, just two fairly wet coats. Again 2 weeks of patient dry time. (I had begun to organize the parts of the Rolls and plan where I was going to work on that monster). I'm amazed that after all the grinding and cutting (fenders, rockers), I had no visible scratches. I took a lot of material out to get the shape right-a draw-back with this kit. Bondo made the front and rear valance seams disappear. The only places where it was needed. Oh, and I filled the antenna hole... Then I spent a day doing all the grits (wet) , 4000, 6000, 8000 and 12,000. Had to be very careful not to break those edges and corners. The Enamel Gods had smiled upon me-no catastrophes! Finally Meguiars Ultimate compound and NXT wax. I was pleased and got what I wanted, but knew it wouldn't sit on my desk to enjoy everyday. So that's the end of my tale of woe. A special thanks to Skip for his support and resources during the build. Wrapped in microfiber cloths and secured in a storage box with all its subassemblies, it sits once again in my basement. If I survive the Rolls, I may peek at it again someday... Thanks for watching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 You've got all the major stuff done. Why can't you just put on the glass and chrome and mount it on the chassis, and call it a day? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 You've got all the major stuff done. Why can't you just put on the glass and chrome and mount it on the chassis, and call it a day? :lol: Because every square inch of bench space plus two work tables and part of the floor is covered with 'Pocher's Revenge'... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blunc Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I agree with Skip, it should go back up on the bench to be finished after the Rolls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 Because every square inch of bench space plus two work tables and part of the floor is covered with 'Pocher's Revenge'... Honestly fellas; I appreciate the encouragement but I tell you no lies: "> "> Besides, my head is totally consumed by the Rolls. I have near 600 hours in since mid February. Harry will kill me but I've gone 'all in' on engine detail using Haddock's drawings and it's all scratched and far beyond what Pocher gives you. That's why I haven't updated that thread-been working and figuring every day and don't yet have 'photographable' progress to show yet. But I will soon as I'm just completing oil and vacuum lines on the block. Besides, being a hacker with little talent always adds time to my builds... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggie Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Amazing work on the gullwing model, 1A! Also nice hobby room P.S. don't forget to finish the 300SL & good luck with the Rolls, Regards, Rok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twokidsnosleep Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Hey man, your pictures have walked away...nooooooo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Hey man, your pictures have walked away...nooooooo Sorry, just saw this Scott. Sadly, in the recent mayhem here, I accidentally deleted the album of those shots. The model is packed and stored in the basement and still looks the same. The interior was done and the chassis mostly done. Don't think any of them helpful to you for a build. 'Mercedes Jordan' (Skip) will help you with reference I'm sure. Here is the only shot left of it on my PB album: ">http://s679.photobucket.com/user/Aframe/media/Album%201/PA310010Small_zps5b3659d7.jpg.html'> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Sorry, just saw this Scott. Sadly, in the recent mayhem here, I accidentally deleted the album of those shots. The model is packed and stored in the basement and still looks the same. The interior was done and the chassis mostly done. Don't think any of them helpful to you for a build. 'Mercedes Jordan' (Skip) will help you with reference I'm sure. Here is the only shot left of it on my PB album: ">[/quote I don't have the missing pictures. The sad part is that you can't see Cato's amazing work at sanding down the fender humps and fixing the wheel well eyebrows. He has made such progress in fixing this kit that I despair about it not being finished. You need to go back and read this entire thread to understand the issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinkbig Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 We're doing the Gullwing in eighth scale right now. Eaglemoss has issued the model, that will take about two years to be completed. Parts seem to be be fairly fine until now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted February 21, 2015 Author Share Posted February 21, 2015 We're doing the Gullwing in eighth scale right now. Eaglemoss has issued the model, that will take about two years to be completed. Parts seem to be be fairly fine until now. Please post your progress in a WIP thread here in Big Boyz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinkbig Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 Hi Cato, that will take it's time. Like mentioned, the kit is offered part by part in a subscription. Won't start the built, until the last piece is on my workbench, but I am setting up the cornerstones already. It will be a graphite-grey car with blue and white plaid upholstery, Rudge wheels, no bumper horns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cato Posted February 21, 2015 Author Share Posted February 21, 2015 Understood Michael. My Rolls has entered it's second build-year and it's NOT a subscription. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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