aurfalien Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 (edited) Hi, I'm getting a good feel for brush painting Tamiya Acrylics which seem to need 1:1 thinner mix. However I just don't like them as brushing should be fun. I recall using some unknown brand painting lead D&D miniatures about 35 years ago and painting was a joy to me. With Tamiyas, well not so much, but then again I am very new to modeling. I've spoken to various ppl at my LHS who both use and love Vallejo for brush painting and feel its superior to Tamiya Acrylic bottle paints. Plus the built in dropper cap is a great idea it seems. Any thoughts or consensus? Thanks in advance. Edited April 25, 2015 by aurfalien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fseva Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 I've spoken to various ppl at my LHS who both use and love Vallejo for brush painting and feel its superior to Tamiya Acrylic bottle paints. Plus the built in dropper cap is a great idea it seems. Any thoughts or consensus? I have used 2 of their metallics, and they go on as smooth as butter. However, I have a feeling that it's because they put a little bit of detergent in their paint, to help break surface tension and make it flow better. The big problem with this is that the paint does not seem very durable - probably because to get the detergent in, they had to eliminate something else. I have had to wait until after my engines are installed to paint the tranny - when I painted the tranny before finishing the engine, through handling, the paint always started to wear off, and I'd get show-through to the previously applied colors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southpier Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 ... various ppl ... love Vallejo for brush painting and feel its superior to Tamiya Acrylic ... thoughts ...? ... agree. thin with & clearcoat after with proprietary Flat/ Gloss/ Satin Varnish as needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwrass Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 Just asking???? I don't use any of these products and am not a big fan of the Water based Acrylics (However I am open minded) My question is: Any of you who use food dehydrators to help with curing? How much doe's it help? Most things I have read are positive. As Frank had mentioned durability and handling problems, I have experienced this problem with oil based products too (I think we all have) Be it oil based or water based if the product hasn't dried long enough you are going to have handling problems. Just as mineral spirits or turpentine can be classified as solvents for oil based products. Detergent or Window cleaners could be classified as solvents for water based products. I have the oil based products down to a science! Really curious about the bottled water based products. Peace Jimmy "RASS" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragline Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 I have about 50 bottles of Vallejo and I love them. They do need a matt or clear varnish but that's not a big deal. The trade off is super fine pigments that flow fantastically. I've airbrushed them, hand painted them. I've practically dipped parts in Vallejo with great results. They are a superior paint to Tamiya and almost everything out there. Get a set and see what all those Maschinen Kreiger, Armor builders are raving about. Of BTW, Their gold set [Old Gold, Gold, Silver and Copper] are to die for. Their powders are the best in the business. I could go on. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferrarijoe Posted April 26, 2015 Share Posted April 26, 2015 I agree Vallejo paints are great. I use their model color for brushing. Great self leveling. And just started using model air paints also. Had no durability issuies. I did my 1/16 Russian tank with model air colors, sealed with future than used enamel washes on it with no problems. No pull up with masking tape. You can go to their website and pull a chart to find what colors match other brands. Like if you need tamiya x-56 you can find their version. They make good washes too. I've heard good things about their primer but haven't tried it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 26, 2015 Author Share Posted April 26, 2015 Wow, very very nice feedback, thank you very very much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 27, 2015 Author Share Posted April 27, 2015 (edited) Curious though, I've found that with Tamiya I must without exception, mix close to 1:1 with either Tamiya Thinner or 99% Rubbing Alcohol and then do about 3-4 layers for a nice outcome. That is unless I'm doing very very fin detailing like nuts, bolts etc... With Vallejo, how many layers does one need and must you still thin without question? Edited April 27, 2015 by aurfalien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southpier Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 to spray, i use a 2:1 paint/ proprietary thinner mix with happy results. i'm new to airbrushing so do as much as i can with it, then pick out small details x brush. two coats sprayed is the norm for me. touch ups of the same color x brush get the same thinned mix for conformity, but if i'm just painting details i'll usually use 1 coat full strength. never sprayed the metallics, but have heard then need to be thinned way down which i assume is a direct effect of the pigments' properties. there's a gazillion youtube videos about Vallejo Painting both military & wargammers have used them for eons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 27, 2015 Author Share Posted April 27, 2015 Oh, thanks southpier, I was more interested in brush painting methods. For spray, I use rattle cans for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fseva Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 (edited) Just asking???? I don't use any of these products and am not a big fan of the Water based Acrylics (However I am open minded) My question is: Any of you who use food dehydrators to help with curing? How much doe's it help? Most things I have read are positive. As Frank had mentioned durability and handling problems, I have experienced this problem with oil based products too (I think we all have) I use a food dehydrator, and it really speeds up the curing process of hobby paints, which is great because the paint isn't soft and won't take fingerprints. However, the new automotive paints (acrylic enamels and acrylic lacquers) do NOT like the food dehydrator! I suppose it's logical, that they have been formulated for air-drying, but I think what happens is that it instantly dries the outside layer, which makes it more difficult to cure the inside layers, leaving the finish soft. Regarding durability of Vallejo paints - it's very possible that I was expecting the metallics to be more durable because they dry very shiny. However, now that I've read comments about the paint requiring a topcoat, that they wore off too easily - I never thought they would NEED a protective finish! Edited April 27, 2015 by fseva Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fseva Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 99% Rubbing Alcohol and then do about 3-4 layers for a nice outcome. Sorry to go off-topic here, but the best I've found (and it's really cheap at the local drug store) is 91% - where do you get your 99%? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 27, 2015 Author Share Posted April 27, 2015 Hi fseva, I find it at Vons and will post a pic later tonight. I think it runs me ~$3 for 16oz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 27, 2015 Author Share Posted April 27, 2015 So my LHS will credit me for my 30 or so Tamiyas towards the Vallejos. Later this evening I will seriously ponder this idea. I mean my paint jobs finally look how I wish them but with great effort in thinning, mixing and multiple coats. Based on a few YouTubes, the Vallejos seem perfect out the bottle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwrass Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Frank, I was wondering if the dehydrators liked anything but water bourn. Based on my suspicion and your experience. You have answered many of my questions. Thank you!! Jimmy "RASS" Brian: Sorry!!!! I didn't mean to highjack your post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 (edited) Hi jwrass, no problems at all. I mean you are adding to the discussion. And I know you have oils down pat, they flow better and have more pigment. When I used to water color and do oils, I always liked oils better. At any rate, the Vallejos seem like the very best of acrylic based model paint. Perhaps worth a shot? Edited April 28, 2015 by aurfalien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 Hi fseva, Here is the bottle, SafeWay brand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 Curious, when applying Vallejo paints for brushing, and I'm assuming you are using there model paint line with the white caps, do you thin or retard them in any way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southpier Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 see #9. i've only used retarder to spray, and it took a week not to feel sticky. now i just thin, and everything works fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 (edited) So I went down to my LHS and we feel that its prudent to try a few before exchanging my entire Tamiya set being 33 some odd paints. I'm really looking forward in trying em out and will do so on an entire body, yep that's right you heard it here first Since I am getting in a good spot with Tamiyas, I will also try em on a large swath of body to see. What I've learned with Tamiya Acrylics; 1) Stir the bottle gently rather then shake. I even used bee bees to agitate and all that did was introduce tiny air bubbles. Not to mention create a mess in the bottle cap, yuk! 2) Thin with about 1:1 Tamiya Thinner in a palette. I was starting to use 99% alcohol but will keep with Tamiyas Thinner until I've mastered it. 3) Apply about 4 thin coats letting each dry well. 4) Use a high quality brush as the bristles hold the paint well and stroke lines are reduced substantially when compared to seemingly softer synthetic brushes. I'm using an Artist Loft Firenze brush for this which is very very cool. With a Michaels coupon its not to much damage. I'll prolly get a few more in various sizes. ** Brush care is critical, I dip my dry brush in the thinner working it in and then slowly work in the paint. I clean it with water, then 99% alcohol then back in water so no residue is left. At any rate thanks to all for the replies, very helpful as usual and one that I've come to expect from this high quality forum! Edited April 28, 2015 by aurfalien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fseva Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 Hi fseva, Here is the bottle, SafeWay brand. Hmmm... no Safeway in the area... but I did see it was available at Amazon, and CVS. So, I should be all set! Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fseva Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 see #9. i've only used retarder to spray, and it took a week not to feel sticky. now i just thin, and everything works fine. Retarder is meant to retard drying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southpier Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 you really shouldn't use the word when trying to define the word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aurfalien Posted April 29, 2015 Author Share Posted April 29, 2015 (edited) I was thinking that using a retarder with Tamiya Acrylics would be a very good idea. Thinning it with there's or 99% alcohol causes it to dry faster so a retarder would be cool. I'm going to start farting around more with FlowAid as it doesn't seem to have alcohol but I did notice that it can strip Tamiya Acrylics so it must right? Still, can't wait for my Vallejo sample pack to arrive. The amount of noodling needed in getting Tamiya to brush well seems pretty time consuming, not to mention clean up time. Edited April 29, 2015 by aurfalien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fseva Posted April 29, 2015 Share Posted April 29, 2015 you really shouldn't use the word when trying to define the word. Oh, well I suppose I should have said, "Retarder is used to slow down drying time..." Better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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