Harry P. Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 One thing about the Spotlight Board is that to see what's new, you merely have to scroll down the page. You don't have to click on "View New Content" and sift through all of that or go through the thirty three different categories that we have here. When you post a build or a question, you don't have to worry about it being moved to another section of the forum. There is no wrong place for a build,question or whatever there. When I was working on my S/S build, Tom Carter (the owner of the board) was the first in line among others to help me get the details right. That would never happen here. Plus, Tom sells models at great prices! It's true that that forum has no categories, no order or organization... it's just every post one after the other, regardless of topic. That's one way to do it. We don't believe in that sort of arrangement here, we do things very differently. Ok, so I have to ask... if that forum is everything you want a forum to be, and this one is not, why are you here? I'm not trying to be a wise guy, I'm seriously asking. There are a lot of model car forums out there. If you like one of the others so well and you don't like this one so much, why are you a member here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 So........ moderaters aren't allowed to participate unless theres an infraction by one of the members? Aren't they members also? Isn't it fair that they get the same benefits as any other members? Just sayin....................... Moderators are held to a higher standard than the board posters. Paid or volunteer, they have agreed to represent the board owner and what ever they post is under the badge of "moderator" so it is representing management. They are free to post as modelers, and I've really enjoyed looking at some of Harry's builds, but they need to keep in mind that what they post reflects on the board owner who has given them authority. The main reason this board exists is to sell a magazine. The role of a moderator is to provide a pleasant experience for the board user, ie- the magazine customer. Tick us off and it reflects poorly on Model Cars and people stop buying the magazine. The goal is just the opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ok, so I have to ask... if that forum is everything you want a forum to be, and this one is not, why are you here? I'm not trying to be a wise guy, I'm seriously asking. There are a lot of model car forums out there. If you like one of the others so well and you don't like this one so much, why are you a member here? This is amazing! Within the confines of this one thread BOTH moderators have told multiple customers that they should go elsewhere! It seems you gentlemen are out of line with the main goal of the board. To retain and gain customers for the magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 This is amazing! Within the confines of this one thread BOTH moderators have told multiple customers that they should go elsewhere! It seems you gentlemen are out of line with the main goal of the board. To retain and gain customers for the magazine. I think you need to read my question more carefully. Nowhere did I say he should leave. Heck, I don't want any members to leave. But when someone tells us how much better another forum is, and they complain about this one, isn't it a fair question to ask them why they choose to stay on a forum that they don't like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ok, so I have to ask... if that forum is everything you want a forum to be, and this one is not, why are you here? I'm not trying to be a wise guy, I'm seriously asking. There are a lot of model car forums out there. If you like one of the others so well and you don't like this one so much, why are you a member here? Soooo... Harry, Roger says that there are merits to the other board's format and you ask him why are you here? That's the equivalent to telling him to go elsewhere. Go back to my post number 11 which seems to have started this entire thing.. everything that I've stated there is the format of IP Forums, nothing against Model Cars or the moderators. Simply stated facts / observations / opinion. There is good and bad in each board and format. For instance, the big short coming of the Spotlight board is that all that great information runs off the end and is lost after two weeks. Both of you guys jumped in to defend little points, that in the grand scheme of the boards true mission, really don't matter at all. The boards of the hobby shouldn't be in competition but should all compliment each other and work together for the purpose of moving the hobby forward. Quite frankly hobbyists can subscribe to both Model Cars and Scale Auto magazine while buying kits from Spotlight Hobbies, and participate on all three boards. There needn't be any quarrel there. I stand by my comment that the moderators are here to make this a pleasant experience for the customer and not to make it unpleasant by challenging folks and over regulation. There's no profit in that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Soooo... Harry, Roger says that there are merits to the other board's format and you ask him why are you here? That's the equivalent to telling him to go elsewhere. No, that's me asking him a very simple question. If he likes the way another board works, and he dislikes how this one works, then why does he choose to be here? That's a completely logical and pertinent question that has absolutely nothing to do with telling him to leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinfan5 Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 I stand by my comment that the moderators are here to make this a pleasant experience for the customer and not to make it unpleasant by challenging folks and over regulation. There's no profit in that! Tom, I am going to ask you a few questions, please do not mistake them or what I say as attacking you , I am not in anyway doing that, but first, you are the one that is challenging Harry and Casey, not the other way around. Second, do you watch Tv shows you dont like?, eat food you dont like?, I doubt it, so if you dont like the way MCM is laid out, then why stay?. Third, I am not sure what other forums you are on, but if so, do you complain about how they are laid out as well? Fourth Spotlight Hobbies forum is a joke, and leaving it at that. Fifth, Do really except the forum layout to be change because you dont like it?, I dont like some of it either, but I deal with it, and find the sections I want to read, the forum can not be laid out to suit everyones wants and desires. Continuing to complain is just pointless . Again, I am not attacking you, so please dont think I am , but again, I am a trouble maker here so many will think I am, I am a member on 12 other forums, not all hobby related, three are from the same IP Board software, the rest are all different , all laid out differently , I have learned the layouts, and I move on with my life, liking them or not, its that simple . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Johnny Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 OK, let's say half of the posts in that topic are pure fluff, not adding any real value to any member of this forum. Than still leaves 81 pages of people building, sharing, and inspiring others with their building. I'll gladly take people positively participating in this hobby and forum any day, all day, over the opposite. But Dr Cranky makes up about half of that himself! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 But Dr Cranky makes up about half of that himself! One thing you can say about Cranky... he's very enthusiastic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAGNUM4342 Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Harry's question is valid. Maybe it could have been worded differently, but it is very difficult to divine tone or inflection when it's written word rather than spoken face to face. This is why many times I will use caps to emphasize a particular word in hopes that the meaning or inflection is better understood. "WHY are you here?" "Why are YOU here?" "Why ARE you here?" "Why are you HERE?" As you can see the meaning changes with the 'tone' of each sentence. But the typeface itself is not the real issue. The fact remains that we have three or four VERY DIFFERENT people with VERY different mindsets, trying to ride herd over several hundred people at any given time, all with THIER own mindsets. I don't know the artist or the song, but there's a song out there that goes "you can't please everyone soya, got to please yourself". Most of the moderation team are not out to please everyone OR themselves. They are however attempting to please the majority. An insurmountable task if there ever was one. No matter what goes on there are going to be those who feel they are being slighted in favor of others and lets be honest here...NOONE likes to be slighted. There have been many, MANY times I have been unhappy with the moderation team and actually took my leave of this place for an extended period because of certain so called "moderation". I DO NOT agree for one moment with one particular moderator, while at the same time there's another mod that I almost always agree with. Is it a "personality clash?" Maybe so. There's another mod yet, that I have had no problem with, and honestly no interaction whatsoever! Bottom line is, the moderation team here could use a little tempering. They need to STOP and THINK before typing in, every bit as much as those of us on the other side of it are expected to. Harry- You know already that Jacen and myself hold you in fairly high regard. However, maybe your question could have been posed in as calm a 'tone' as the rest of your post. In cases where the bulk of the typeface is in bold such as mine is here, the caps emphasise a word without giving the feeling that yelling is taking place. In a situation such as yours where 99% of the typeface is standard, but the question of "why are you here?" is in bold, it gives the impression you are shouting or angry. Thus is the spark that ignites the tinder already in place. I also feel that as well as presenting themselves more diplomatically, the moderation team could take the time to explain themselves more. Again, without calling out any names, it has been my experience that some mebers of the team will take the time to contact members and let them know WHY a post was moved/deleted/edited. Is this a pain in the proverbial posterior? Sure. Does it diminish the amount of time they have to enjoy,relax and post in topics they enjoy? Sure it does. However...that goes with the territory. It's a job like any other and if you don't enjoy it or don't want to do it because you can no longer enjoy the site as a member does...then quit and let someone else mod. I sincerely hope this makes sense to as many as possible, and that the thread wasn't locked during this long rant because I will truly be upset at the wasted typing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Harry- You know already that Jacen and myself hold you in fairly high regard. However, maybe your question could have been posed in as calm a 'tone' as the rest of your post. In cases where the bulk of the typeface is in bold such as mine is here, the caps emphasise a word without giving the feeling that yelling is taking place. In a situation such as yours where 99% of the typeface is standard, but the question of "why are you here?" is in bold, it gives the impression you are shouting or angry. Thus is the spark that ignites the tinder already in place. Good point. I wasn't "shouting" or angry... just curious. But I see what you mean about the tone of a written post being misunderstood. I've always tried to be careful about that... trying to word my posts so there can't be any misunderstanding of intent. But it doesn't always work. It's something we all (me included) need to keep in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAGNUM4342 Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 I tend to post in the thread that seems most appropriate. If it's a 1/16th scale dragster...I say it can go to either thread, but dragster (in my mind anyway...and it's fragile so let's not mess with it! ) is where I would post a drag kit no matter the scal because to me that overrides the big boy. If it's the Super Charger kit by MPC, even though it has drag elements I would put that in Big Boys. It's a slippery sucker ain't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny K Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 I believe that guys only go to some of them and if you post in others, your post is overlooked. That's sort of the purpose - it allows one to look at those things he's interested in and not waste time on the ones he isn't. I would personally prefer more categories to fewer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Ok, so I have to ask... if that forum is everything you want a forum to be, and this one is not, why are you here? That forum isn't everything I want a forum to be. But, neither is this one. I was just saying that that forum has it's good points and good people just like this forum. When I first visited there, I didn't like it very much. But, after I got used to it, I began to like it and started posting finished builds/projects there. Spotlight isn't organized. No one could deny that. But, this forum is overly organized and way too busy. That's the major problem with people posting in the "wrong" sections. A perfect example is when you posted your 1910 double decker bus in the "Pickups,Vans, SUVs and Light Commercial" section. To you, you felt it belonged there even though a double decker bus isn't considered light commercial by any standard. Most people here post their builds/topics where they think they belong. But, the difference is that you can move their posts/builds where you think they belong,but no one can move your posts/builds where they think they belong. It's like "do as I say, not as I do". The day I feel I need to PM you before I post a topic will be the day I ask Gregg to delete my membership for good and you'll never have to ask that question again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 This forum is "overly organized?" The whole point of being organized and having specific categories is to make it easier for members. Easier to find the things you're interested in, and easier to avoid the things you're not interested in. If, for example, you have no interests in model trucks, you can completely ignore that section. Or if you like to read about other peoples tricks and tutorials, you know exactly where to find them. I don't see how an organized forum is a problem. But apparently you do. To each his own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAGNUM4342 Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 I'm going to go right now and dump all my model kits out on the bench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornpatch Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 "Overly"?...read as TOO organised. How on god's green earth can something be too organised?? Man !!!!!!!!!!!!! You sure wouldn't ask that if you knew my wife. Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 Fourth Spotlight Hobbies forum is a joke, and leaving it at that. Fifth, Do really except the forum layout to be change because you dont like it?, I dont like some of it either, but I deal with it, and find the sections I want to read, the forum can not be laid out to suit everyones wants and desires. Continuing to complain is just pointless . I was going to let sleeping dogs lie but Jonathan asked me questions directly... First, your post loses all credibility when you refer to another forum as a "joke". Nowhere in any post I've posted anywhere do I resort to name calling. That's an insult to everyone who enjoys that board. In fact, there are many people here who post in both forums. Go back to my post 11. I have not complained. I simply stated what I see as a shortcoming that pretty much is human nature. I have been a member of this board since 2007 but haven't been active. A few months ago I made a resolve to get active on this board to expand my friendships in the hobby. My very first post on this board got moved by a moderator! Why did I post in an incorrect spot? Because when you first see the board in your browser, you see just the "General" and "Model Cars". The first category there is "On The Work Bench" so I posted my camper project there. Harry moved it to "Trucks, On The Workbench Pickups, Vans, SUVs and Light Commercial". Not a problem with me, I saw my error and will post where it belongs... or does it? There is no section for campers and trailers! But why did I post where I did? Simply because I didn't know if I scrolled down there was a lot more categories there. Human nature, and what a newbie to the board will do until they figure out the format. And that's all I said! I never said anything should be changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 18, 2013 Share Posted January 18, 2013 This forum is "overly organized?" Wrong choice of words. It certainly isn't overly organized. I should have said overly categorized. There are thirty three different categories here. Isn't that a little much? That's why new members have trouble posting builds/topics here. Sure the members who have been here a while have no problem. But, try looking at it through a new members eyes for a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Wrong choice of words. It certainly isn't overly organized. I should have said overly categorized. There are thirty three different categories here. Isn't that a little much? That's why new members have trouble posting builds/topics here. Sure the members who have been here a while have no problem. But, try looking at it through a new members eyes for a second. I think the average new member can figure things out in a few minutes. It's not a mystery... we have certain categories for certain things. Every category has a detailed description as to what should go there. And if anyone has a problem figuring things out, all they have to do is ask, either publicly or via PM to me or Casey. Most online forums follow this same format, so unless a person has never seen another model car (or any other) forum before, I don't think this one should pose any sort of problem for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XJ6 Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 (edited) Or look at it from the point of view of an old Dharma and Greg episode. Greg attempted to stall some members of the department of water and power. Greg: "Water...power...I don't know how you keep it all straight." he said with a smile. The DWP lady replied... "Everything is CLEARLY marked." ???? Edited January 19, 2013 by XJ6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uncle potts Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 They are free to post as modelers, and I've really enjoyed looking at some of Harry's builds, but they need to keep in mind that what they post reflects on the board owner who has given them authority. Tick us off and it reflects poorly on Model Cars and people stop buying the magazine. So if thats a problem for the owner, he'll deal with it. Seems to me thats up to him to to decide when that lines been crossed, not you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 So if thats a problem for the owner, he'll deal with it. Seems to me thats up to him to to decide when that lines been crossed, not you. Simply stating standard Business 101. The goal of any business is to make sales and please the customers. You cannot disagree with that. This board is total expense and generates no income. It's only purpose is to make the users happy enough to patronize the magazine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 I think the average new member can figure things out in a few minutes. It's not a mystery... Harry are you that out of touch with your users? I'm pretty computer literate. I write fortran and hmtl faster than most folks can type. I have managed computer issues for Fortune 100 companies. And here's what I see as a few very simple issues... First, I have a major problem that the first topic under General is "Read The Rules First". Isn't that a bit heavy handed and intimidating? Maybe "How To Navigate The Board" would be more appropriate. Oh, yes! There is no instruction under the topic now! Only rules and threats! So.... What is missing is the navigation primer. Yes, a lot of it is IP Board's software, but you moderators can add posts that would explain stuff here! For instance, very basic. Every user is given a rank. Where is this explained? I haven't found it. I took a quick look through a few posts. For example I have found people called "member" with 10 posts. I see "regular" with 40 posts. "Friend" with 150 posts, I saw someone with 311 posts called an "Avid Poster" and I guess the top rating is "MCW Ohana" which I only know it means family because Greg said that in his editorial in a recent magazine issue. Why isn't there an explanation of the ranks and the plateaus anywhere on the site? Next... simple navigation. I posted previously that even as someone fairly well versed in the web, it took me a while to figure out that if I clicked on the topic, it took me to post 1, but if I clicked on the little dot or star, it would take me to the first unread post. I still haven't figure out the difference between the dot and the star. Why isn't there an explanation on the site? Next... I saw someone post today that they wanted to modify the title of a thread they had started. A moderator responded and explained how it was done which is fine, but why isn't that in a tutorial? I know I stumbled on to it myself. But how many people on this board haven't been savvy enough to figure it out on their own? Simply put, there's a lot of positive things that the moderation team, that has the knowledge, could help the members with that would help their user experience! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XJ6 Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 It all ok....Calm Down...Futurabat....Go build a model or something....The score is with harry....not you my friend.....So chill out....Darn what are you doing applying for the Moderator Postion....you all over the place... You a Good Guy.....But Relax a little.... But hey...do what ever really tickles your fancy... Cheers.....Don aka XJ6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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