163 replies to this topic

[Rob Hall]

I'd rather the model companies stick to photos of the completed kit on the box art rather than inaccurate illustrations or photos of real cars (which inevitably seem to have equipment not seen on the kit).

[Casey]

And you're right, more advanced model builders are capable of making the mods to the kit to make it look like the illustrations. BUT, the basic, 'average' modeler isn't, and he's the one hosed by box-art that that portrays an idealized version of the contents.

I might agree if the box showed only sketches and artistic renderings, but does anyone who is considering buying the kit and looking at what's on the box NOT even look at the side panels? The odds of such a scenario are infinitesimally small.

I bet all of us at one time or another have purchased a kit which was not quite what the box artwork advertised, and we're still building. Will it scare away a few potential modelers? Probably, but I don't think the number who would be turned off would be enough to cause any significant dent in our numbers. I'm sure a few would even take the opportunity to do some customizing and kitbashing, so those people may even things out in the end.

[Draggon]

If there was a pic of the built model on the box I bet it wouldnt sell. Sorta funny though, that the built model looks so much like the real thing. But, hey, nothing that smaller wheels and a bunch of lowering cant cure!

[tooltas]

lowering can help wider tires and rim on back

[Ace-Garageguy]

I might agree if the box showed only sketches and artistic renderings, but does anyone who is considering buying the kit and looking at what's on the box NOT even look at the side panels? The odds of such a scenario are infinitesimally small.

I really don't mean to seem argumentative, but in my experience, the vast majority of people don't look at all the pix, instructions, disclaimers etc., no matter WHAT the product or service being discussed. Just on this forum, how many times are the same questions asked over and over and over when even a cursory search of the site (or the net) would give the answers? Granted, doing a simple data search is more effort than looking at the "built" version on the box, but it's still only a few key-strokes, and it very often seems to be just too hard.

I'm NOT defending a lack of effort on the part of a prospective buyer of a kit, but the fact remains, the idealized version on the top is NOT what the average builder gets by gluing the parts together. And we here on this forum are not really the average buyers. I'd bet we're more involved, more skilled, more motivated and more knowledgable and certainly more vocal about the hobby than the majority of kit purchasers.

PS. I probably WILL buy the kit at some point, because I like Firebirds, the stance of the rendering is spot-on, and I'd like to build one that sits like that. But I know already, it's gonna take a LOT of rework to make that from what's in the box, and I probably have a little cut-and-paste cred by now.

Edited by Ace-Garageguy, 14 October 2012 - 10:40 AM.

[Hawk312]

I might agree if the box showed only sketches and artistic renderings, but does anyone who is considering buying the kit and looking at what's on the box NOT even look at the side panels? The odds of such a scenario are infinitesimally small.

I have to agree with this. I remember buying my first kit at the age of 8, which was an `83 Trans Am annual kit. I remember looking at the sides to see what was in it. And I know as I continued building throughout my childhood, I would always look at the side. I always wanted to see what was included in the box. I also have a child now that, when she sees stuff in the store that she wants, she will examine the box until we pry her away from it. And, in the case of a child, they will probably be accompanied buy an adult who will want to know what their kid is getting.
I also think if someone is willing to make a purchase based on a cursory examination of just the box cover, I doubt they are going to be that concerned it if rides a little high, or doesn`t have the correct interior or engine. Ditto for a child who is excited by the box art only...they will probably want it regardless just because it is a Foose "looking" car. I remember how many of those lousy, warped, dis-proportioned, inaccurate MPC Knight Rider kits I loved. Remember the "mudder" tire tread on those things?? But I think alot of us loved them back then because it was "KITT."

I bet all of us at one time or another have purchased a kit which was not quite what the box artwork advertised, and we're still building.

Yes, I`ve purchased many AMT kits.

[Hawk312]

Something else to think about, it`s been a few years since I watched the show, but I am assuming Chip still does his rendering near the beginning of the show, and then at some point shows the drawing to the camera and says:
"Hi Napoleon (or whomever), here is your AMC Pacer (or whatever)."
At the reveal at the end, is anyone objecting and saying ".....oh no...that`s not what was in the picture Chip!" And they have more at stake then the $17-$20 being paid for a kit.

[Longbox55]

Something else to think about, it`s been a few years since I watched the show, but I am assuming Chip still does his rendering near the beginning of the show, and then at some point shows the drawing to the camera and says:
"Hi Napoleon (or whomever), here is your AMC Pacer (or whatever)."
".....oh no...that`s not what was in the picture Chip!"

That would be funny if it actually happened on show, though!

[SSNJim]

And you're right, more advanced model builders are capable of making the mods to the kit to make it look like the illustrations.

Chip Foose couldn't make the real car look like the illustration. What chance has a model builder?

[Ace-Garageguy]

Chip Foose couldn't make the real car look like the illustration. What chance has a model builder?

This is a joke, right? There's no smiley, so I'm not sure.

Foose's crew builds those silly made-for-TV-we-stole-your-car-BS rides in a week. That's not Foose's real work. Ya ever seen the stuff the man has built for the Riddler? If the object was to make the TV-show car look like the rendering, it would. Period. Flared fenders, more rake on the windshield, proper stance, etc. Butcha can't do it in a week.

And trust me, if my goal was to make the model look like the illustration, I could, and I'm only a modeler.

[SSNJim]

Look, if I were joking, I would've said "what do you do with an elephant with three balls? You walk him and pitch to the rhino".

The model builder part was a joke. I just haven't seen a post-1960 Foose car that had a style anything like that illustration - even the ones not for Overhaulin'. He does a great job with pre-1960 cars and original designs, though.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Look, if I were joking, I would've said "what do you do with an elephant with three balls? You walk him and pitch to the rhino".

I'm still laughing..........

[Draggon]

Chip Foose couldn't make the real car look like the illustration. What chance has a model builder?

Yea, no kidding!

[Danno]

[Lownslow]

Maybe we should call the box-art illustration the "box art illusion".

I am amazed that anyone is upset because an illustration isn't just like the finished product.

Illustrations always look sleek and far more enticing than a photo.

As for the stance, you're model builders... lower it. You're not being hosed by the manufacturer.

Be grateful that Pablo Picasso didn't do the cover art.

stance is repairable, crappy wheels arent.

[Ron Hamilton]

As much as I like the original issue of the Revell '68 Firebird kit, even with it's foibles(wheels and tires), I'll wait until it is on special at Big Lots, Ollies, or somewhere else for about $10. My major gripe is that the '68 Firebird kit could have been modified, and would be a better seller, if marketed as a convertible, a Sprint (OHC 6 and flat hood), or even backdated into a '67 or updated to a 1969, but wait, that would have taken some imagination and some tooling dollars.

I like Chip Foose' work for the most part, and a tie-in to his company for a model replica is not a hateful idea, but the execution of this kit could have been better. As Frank Rizzo said in his post, "stance is repairable, crappy wheels arent."

At least the box art is nice.

[Hawk312]

So, after a few weeks of searching for this kit, I resorted to Steal-bay for this, received the kit, and the next day I see it at HobbyLobby! :\ Oh well. Anyway, I just had to get this kit and see for myself what it up with it. So here we go....

First of all, the kit is a 2 in 1. You can build the Foose version, or a race version with a blower and special decals which appear to be new. The stock wheels and tires are not included and IMO, aren`t missed (I never liked the stock ones anyway). The drag wheels and tires offered in past kits are also not available. Everything else seems to be the same as in the previous releases. So, I will skip over a basic kit review and move onto the more contentious items.

Warning! Unpopular opinions ahead
I decided to mock this thing up, completely stock and straight out of the box. I simply assembled the parts according to the instructions, and this is the result:









For reference, here is the 1:1. Pictures are a bit scarce on this for some reason:





To my eyes, the stance appears to be ever so *slightly* higher with the kit as opposed to the 1:1, maybe by a scale inch or two in the front. If you notice in the pictures of the 1:1, even from above, you can see the tread on the front tires. So, the tires are not tucked under the fenders, but actually have a couple inches of clearance from the fender. And speaking of the tires, they actually appear to be much *wider* in the kit as opposed to the 1:1. Look how narrow the front tire is in the very last picture. And the back tire isn`t much wider.
As far as the wheels, they appear to be close, but the spokes seem to get just a little narrow towards the ends. And it looks as though the 1:1 has "bigs" in the backs and "littles" in the fronts. Maybe someone else can confirm this as I have yet to see the entire episode. Still, if they are different diameter wheels, I am guessing it is only by a couple inches at the most. It looks as though the kit has the back wheels all the way around.
The kit does not include disc brakes, though there are brake rotor decals for inside of the wheel backs to make it look like it has disc brakes.
The kit engine is the stock GM small block V8, which should be an LS2 according to the pictures I have seen of the real car. Though the 1:1 is an LS2, it is a carbureted LS2. This means that visually the top end isn`t much different than the 400 included in the kit. The most glaring difference would actually likely be the equidistant exhaust ports on the LS2. I noticed in the pictures of the real car that they moved the coil packs to the firewall. This is an unmistakable detail, as it takes up a good bit of real estate on the firewall. All of this probably explains why the stock 400 was left in the kit. To replicate the 1:1 car would require a small block LS engine from a `97 and up Corvette or 98 and up fbody kit (except the 5th gens) and shaving the coil packs off the valve covers and placing them on the firewall.
Lastly, the interior is simply the stock interior. The race seats and updated Foose-ified rear seats are not included.

My thoughts on this kit....
This is clearly not a kit marketed towards us exacting, finicky, hobbyists that can pick out incorrect tire patterns on a whim. This is for non-hobbyists and kids that are fans of the show,or hobbyists the just want something that looks like a Foose car. As I said earlier, I remember buying countless MPC Knight Rider kits in the past, and I even have one now to complete. I didn`t care that some of the details were incorrect. It looked like "KITT". And I think alot of people familiar with the show, and are open to modeling, will have the same mindset.
I understand completely why Revell did what they did with this kit. We don`t like it, but I am betting with the ultra-cool box art, the huge bling wheels, and the custom graphics, it will sell decently in places like Hobby Lobby and Wal Mart. And Foose`s name stamped on it wont hurt. I would also rather they poo-poo this subject to make a profit to be able to bring us completely awesome kits like the coming `70 Cuda, Mustang LX, and the Stacy David Ford, which are all new tools from the ground up and probably wouldn`t sell very well in the general, non-hobbyist, Wal-Mart type crowd.

Now where`s that fire jacket.....

Edited by Hawk312, 20 October 2012 - 03:35 PM.

[Joe Handley]

Actually David, you have me wishing I could swing the green for that and the Cornet now! Unfortunetly, gas for my Cherokee and 200 plus car payment on the latter come first.

[Hawk312]

Heh, heh. I hear you Joe. And I bet the gas bill for that Cherokee is pretty steep with gas prices the way they are.

I must say, after reading all the posts here, this kit is better than I expected, though that isn`t saying to much. I definitely don`t regret the purchase though, and may even buy a couple more. It looks like it will build into a cool little car on the shelf. The front end is *really* easy to drop a couple scale inches...same with the rear. And I actually like the wheels, though I do wish they were just a little deeper. They will look nice on some muscle car projects I`ve been thinking about doing.

[Joe Handley]

Heh, heh. I hear you Joe. And I bet the gas bill for that Cherokee is pretty steep with gas prices the way they are.

Luckily, now that I have my 200 as a DD, I've used one tank of gas in the Jeep since Easter But yea, it ended up being just short of $60 (I could have bought both Foose kits and a lunch for that ), and I even went to theeee cheapest station in the area and splash blended 3 gallons of E-85 to see how well that generation of OBD2 system puts up with it (and for 30 miles so far, quite nicely!) Currently around home and work gas prices are down to $3.59-$3.75 a gallon for 87, this station had 87 for $3.39, 93 for $3.79 and E-85 for $3.09.......I haven't looked closer to home to see who was selling 93 for what..........doubt I actually want to know

I must say, after reading all the posts here, this kit is better than I expected, though that isn`t saying to much. I definitely don`t regret the purchase though, and may even buy a couple more. It looks like it will build into a cool little car on the shelf. The front end is *really* easy to drop a couple scale inches...same with the rear. And I actually like the wheels, though I do wish they were just a little deeper. They will look nice on some muscle car projects I`ve been thinking about doing.

If it's set up like their Mid-60's B-Bodies, I imagine it can't be that tough to do, does it look like it would be hard to move the wheels and tires slightly inboard to "tuck" them while lowering the car a bit more?