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New Moebius Ford Pick-ups 1971 Ranger XLT AND 1969 Custom SWB

Moebius 67-71 Ford F100s

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#361 Austin T

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Posted 23 July 2013 - 06:45 PM

Well, the issue with the Mustang kit was not a minor issue, that was a pretty big one, I think most of us sane model builders can over look smaller issues in most case's

No I agree the Mustang was a pretty big problem,but since then it has escalated.



#362 thatz4u

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 05:50 AM

Some of us will put the Mustang suspension & engine under the Moebius F-100 & the rest of the Mustang will be used for parts on other projects..... B)



#363 Danno

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 06:10 AM

No I agree the Mustang was a pretty big problem,but since then it has escalated.

 

 

The "problem" hasn't escalated  . . . the hubbub about it has escalated.



#364 niteowl7710

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 02:58 PM

Actually pretty much everyone who had anything to say about the Mustang's myriad issues said their piece and moved on having made their decision on purchasing one or not. There have however been snide sarcastic comments in every conceivable thread by those who would lick the warehouse floor out of gratitude of Revell's mere existence making reference to the Mustang's issues and how they cynically relate to whatever the subject matter is, and it's critics as needing to let it go while none of us have said boo about it in a month or more.

#365 Chuck Kourouklis

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 03:04 PM

And the hubbub about the "hubbub"... well, that's NEVER been an issue, now, has it?

 

Anybody notice how those on the other side of this interminable drama have an actual capacity to make a point without hyperbole and wild, baseless inference?  They can pretty much quote directly from a legion of of quixotic self-appointed Defenders Of Kit Manufacturer Honor and let all the irrationality and personal attacks speak for themselves.

 

I'd like to see the last rivet counter - even a TRUE, authentic, miserable one who doesn't fall over himself declaring he'll still buy the kit - to suggest any manufacturer be "burned at the stake". Or even to get in the general TIME ZONE of such a thing.



#366 Gluhead

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 02:37 AM

Pfft. A REAL modeler just sits back and chuckles at all who whine and moan about a too-tall roof, and quietly turns to look at the one he built 8 years ago that has excellent proportions...from scratch.

 

[yeah, I'm bein' cheeky heehee]



#367 Repstock

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 03:22 AM

Pfft. A REAL modeler just sits back and chuckles at all who whine and moan about a too-tall roof, and quietly turns to look at the one he built 8 years ago that has excellent proportions...from scratch.

 

[yeah, I'm bein' cheeky heehee]

 

In the same vein (cheeky, that is), let the rivet counters build Tamiya, and "real" modelers can build Palmer. If we comlpain about Palmer, they'll all stop making automotive models...Did that happen?



#368 Platerpants

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 03:37 AM

why complain? it looks like itll be a great kit sure their may be something wrong but has there ever been a perfect kit? I aint seen one yet. Just sit back and let the building happen.



#369 Gluhead

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 03:39 AM

Hey, no fair, Tom. You ARE one of those real modelers. :D


Edited by Gluhead, 25 July 2013 - 03:40 AM.


#370 DrKerry

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 04:15 AM

0

Edited by DrKerry, 26 July 2013 - 05:55 PM.


#371 Chuck Kourouklis

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 04:20 AM

In the same vein (cheeky, that is), let the rivet counters build Tamiya, and "real" modelers can build Palmer. If we comlpain about Palmer, they'll all stop making automotive models...Did that happen?


Sure did! You think the Internet's rough now, you shoulda seen it back in 1969!

"Real modelers". Well-played, gentlemen.  :P

 

For those of you taking it seriously, *sigh* - #2, "False Dichotomies", over here - 

 

http://www.modelcars...5&showentry=107


Edited by Chuck Kourouklis, 25 July 2013 - 04:30 AM.


#372 Repstock

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 05:02 AM

why complain? it looks like itll be a great kit sure their may be something wrong but has there ever been a perfect kit? I aint seen one yet. Just sit back and let the building happen.

 

I agree that the kit will no doubt be great, I have a fund set aside to purchase multiple copies. It's the rivet counter thing that bothers me. EVERYONE is a rivet counter, it's just where you draw the line on what to accept and what not to accept. Unless there ARE people who are perfectly content with Palmer kits. If a person had a Palmer kit, and wasn't driven to complain (assuming Palmer was still around), I don't know how much I could respect them as a modeler. The disagreement it seems is where to draw the line. 

 

On that we will all NEVER agree. What bothers me may not bother you, etc.  I don't know why this rivet counter thing keeps coming up. There's no way to prove an opinion, no way to resolve it.

 

Perhaps it's just venting. THAT I can understand.



#373 Repstock

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 05:04 AM

Hey, no fair, Tom. You ARE one of those real modelers. :D

In my mind we're ALL real modelers. For me this is a very solitary hobby. Without you guys I'd have no friends!



#374 earlleecliffton

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 05:45 AM

Gluhead, I bet you remember the comics of the middle 1960's where the front tires said " Skinny " and the rear tires said way wide , an so on too. Long Live "CAR-Toons magazines !

ive still got a 1969 issue



#375 mrknowetall

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 08:53 AM

That's really an undeserved and unfair shot at Dave Burket.

He subsidizes the expense of the kits issued as ModelKing exclusives because the kits would not be cost effective for the manufacturer to produce without ModelKing's subsidy. So, he either charges a fair price or you don't get the kit at all.

If you do not want to pay the ModelKing price, don't buy the kit.

But he does not gouge. That's a whole 'nother kind of situation. It does not apply to a businessman trying to recoup his investment.

And, in the case of ModelKing kits, it's an investment the manufacturer was not willing to make on its own.


:mellow:

Well said!  Dave Burket runs a relatively low number of his kits, which always equates to a higher retail price.  This is not gouging.  Stevens International sold quite a few "private run" kits years ago, and their retail price(s) were always higher, simply because their production run was typically half to a quarter of the number of kits the manufacturer would normally produce. 



#376 niteowl7710

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 06:08 PM

You know how right you are. After all we are MODELERS, and it is only PLASTIC. If it isn't right don't gripe about it, FIX IT!!! We should just be happy that we're getting the subjects that we are!!! Years ago you wouldn't of seen this but now after people like those at Moebious are listening to what we want and are jumping through hoops to get it to us!! I don't know the debackle behind the Mustang and I know the fin area was off on the 57 Ford, who cares, fix the issues and have fun with them!!!

 

Please tell me what other industry, service, or ANYTHING where the stupid attitude of "We should just he be happy we're getting it at all!!!" exists in...name one...and GO!

 

Oh the cook made my order wrong, but I should just be happy this restaurant is even open...

 

I mean seriously if you bought a lawn mower and you got it home and found out it had a deck that wasn't the same size as the one pictured on the box and instead of mulching it discharged grass clippings all over the place would you really expect to go online to a lawn care forum and have a bunch of people tell you that you should either alternately JUST BE HAPPY that you could even buy a lawn mower and the other bunch telling you that if you think you could make a better lawn mower you should design it yourself.

 

I have no idea what a debackle is, nor what "hoops" Moebius is jumping through.   Moebius makes models, that's their business, their sole purpose of existence.  Moebius' key advantage over everyone else - except Aoshima who follow a similar "business model" - is that they are willing to show their work in the process and then take the suggestions of their customers who see errors (of varying degrees of critical importance) and then actually fix them despite the "Criticizers" being public caned here by the "Don't Worry, Be Happy" crowd.


Edited by niteowl7710, 25 July 2013 - 06:09 PM.


#377 Ben

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 12:45 AM

What I would like to ask the "it's just a model car" guy's is, if you bought a kit that you had hoped a model company would produce, paid 25.00 for that kit and then found it had a very warped body or a short shot (not enough plastic injected to complete the body shell),would you be happy with it and fix it or would you want a replacement body?



#378 Austin T

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 03:01 AM

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#379 Daddyfink

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 03:55 AM

Wow! All this over a kit that is not even out! Nice!! :rolleyes:



#380 Chuck Kourouklis

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 09:00 AM

Okay, so let's take "stupid" out of Duff's first sentence and run it again:

 

"Please tell me what other industry, service, or ANYTHING where the attitude of "We should just he be happy we're getting it at all!!!" exists in...name one...and GO!"

 

That becomes a lot more difficult to address, like it or not.

 

You go straight to the four-figure mower, Kerry, glossing right over the botched restaurant meal that's closer in expense.  And to state the model's purpose as static display is to vastly oversimplify its reason for existence.   Any paperweight or plaque or trophy or flower vase can just sit there in static display.  What separates the model is that it's meant as a scale reproduction of something, meant to resemble that prototype as closely as possible.  And what's constantly implied but never satisfactorily proven is how it makes you somehow less of a modeler to expect the base kit to do its job as well as possible.

 

There are plenty of modelers, fully capable of correcting kits, who'd sooner dedicate their considerable skills to enhancement rather than those corrections; but from the look of your rules, apparently they're not "real modelers".  How does that make any sense?

 

And then there's another element that I've been playing with for a day or two, the notion of kit criticism as "trolling".  And make no mistake, I'm flat-out grateful to have this pointed out to me, because it looks like the first tiny window into a mode of thought that's left me utterly bewildered for the better part of a decade.

 

If I understand the concept correctly, to troll a forum is to post content with no other purpose in mind than to agitate other forum members and create a ruckus.  To call kit criticism "trolling" is to preclude the possibility that a member may be posting out of actual disappointment with the kit.  Fact is, you can't read minds, and who knows - maybe there really are people who trash kits purely to get a rise out of other forum members.

 

But I think that kind of post will have a pretty distinct attitude about it, and to treat any harsh review as if it's trolling has little basis in reality.  Post #293, page 15,  for instance.  Closest thing to an out-and-out diatribe in this thread, and I'll go so far as to say his post was rather more strident than I would've done, some of it maybe even premature.  But I'll not presume to judge Roger's content as "trolling", and I'm certainly not to going to reference a totally unrelated thread about another kit to address anything I find questionable about his post.

 

Said it before, and I'll say it again: you look at it objectively, it's not really the criticism getting these threads closed. It's the people who from all appearances just can't get over the fact that KITS WILL BE CRITICIZED. 

 

Note that I do NOT claim any of you who object to criticism are doing it for kicks.  The outrage I see from some of you is palpable and genuine - I just fail to understand the first rational basis for it. And again, I ask:  if you yourself didn't develop the kit, what is it to you?


Edited by Chuck Kourouklis, 26 July 2013 - 09:13 AM.