Jump to content


A request for aftermarket support!


  • You cannot reply to this topic
34 replies to this topic

#1 jeffs396

jeffs396

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,115 posts
  • Location:NE Ohio
  • Full Name:Jeff

Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:00 PM

With all of the great new kit releases already out, and quite a few more scheduled, there is a need for photoetched detail sets for these kits. In the past, the Model Car Garage had always fullfilled this need. Not long after the new kits were out, we had a detail set available. It seems they are no longer producing ALL-NEW detail sets.

http://www.modelcarg...p?idCategory=33

These new, highly detailed 50s cars are just begging for separate lettering, emblems, interior trim, etc. to really finish these gems off properly. Maybe licensing fees are keeping these detail sets from coming to our benches?

How about it aftermarket? Posted Image

Discuss please ;)

#2 martinfan5

martinfan5

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,218 posts
  • Location:Los Santos, San Andreas
  • Full Name:Jonathan Stephens

Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:19 PM

Could be a cost issue too, maybe they dont have the money to invest in to P/E sets right now, there could be a lot of reason's, maybe email them and ask them if they have any plans to ;)

#3 jeffs396

jeffs396

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,115 posts
  • Location:NE Ohio
  • Full Name:Jeff

Posted 23 October 2012 - 08:14 AM

Any other views on this?

#4 Greg Wann

Greg Wann

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 555 posts
  • Location:Glendale, Arizona
  • Full Name:Greg Wann

Posted 23 October 2012 - 09:05 AM

http://www.pulsarpro.../4_Milling.html

You can make your own PE parts from this kit. I have not tried it but am hoping too eventually.

#5 dimaxion

dimaxion

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 992 posts
  • Location:NE Indiana
  • Full Name:John JR. Landgraver

Posted 23 October 2012 - 09:05 AM

Sure , my thoughts are as follows . I do appreciate the After Market and all of the products . I (we) are on a Fixed Income . I cannot keep up with the new releases any longer . I have to be more selective .
Nomenclature was among the first choices to go away . I do have a smattering of Photoetch . I now find
myself trading off kits I will not get to in favor of what I cannot afford and want . I did not buy these for trading ever in my mind . Such be life . I just cannot support all niches of my Hobby as I used to . Thank you Uncle Sam for placing me here due to your Rules ! Apparently I needed to cheat ! Bitter and
holding grudges ... Thanx ..

#6 gtx6970

gtx6970

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,883 posts
  • Location:Northern Ky
  • Full Name:Bill Allphin

Posted 24 October 2012 - 01:57 AM

Sure , my thoughts are as follows . I do appreciate the After Market and all of the products . I (we) are on a Fixed Income . I cannot keep up with the new releases any longer . I have to be more selective .
Nomenclature was among the first choices to go away . I do have a smattering of Photoetch . I now find
myself trading off kits I will not get to in favor of what I cannot afford and want . I did not buy these for trading ever in my mind . Such be life . I just cannot support all niches of my Hobby as I used to.


Ditto

#7 Craig Irwin

Craig Irwin

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,778 posts
  • Location:Pendleton Indiana ( near Indianapolis)

Posted 25 October 2012 - 02:31 PM

4 years ago I would spend $45 on a resin kit, buy 2 kits (or more) as donors, a photo etch set, $30 worth of automotive paint and some aftermarket decals just to build a model if the subject interested me. Today I have to think out every dollar I spend. I would be a buyer for PE sets for kits that lack scripts and emblems, but I would want them smaller than whats been out before (no pedals, wiper arms, plate frames, ect.) to keep the cost down. Scripts and emblems only.

#8 charlie8575

charlie8575

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,612 posts
  • Location:Marlborough, Ma.
  • Full Name:Charlie

Posted 25 October 2012 - 07:09 PM

4 years ago I would spend $45 on a resin kit, buy 2 kits (or more) as donors, a photo etch set, $30 worth of automotive paint and some aftermarket decals just to build a model if the subject interested me. Today I have to think out every dollar I spend. I would be a buyer for PE sets for kits that lack scripts and emblems, but I would want them smaller than whats been out before (no pedals, wiper arms, plate frames, ect.) to keep the cost down. Scripts and emblems only.


I quite agree.

For example, if they did that for the '50 Olds, I'd be surprised if it went over $10. At that price, I'd buy a set for every variation I plan to build- club coupe, 2-dr. sedan (I know of one in the works,) fastback and Holiday. And when Revell releases the convertible, they'll end up on that too. If I ever get brave enough to try building a 4-door or wagon, and scratching up the engine for a 76, I'll buy more. At that price, I can afford it.

But....$15-20 each. Nope.

On a related topic- foil decals would be an acceptable (though not ideal) alternative. Does anyone know how, or if, those can be made by individual hobbyists or if anyone makes those?

Charlie Larkin

#9 southpier

southpier

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,665 posts
  • Location:northeast coast
  • Full Name:joe smythe

Posted 26 October 2012 - 12:14 AM

gets back to the whole philosphy of modeling: do you build, or buy?

#10 Casey

Casey

    MCM Ohana

  • Moderator
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,901 posts
  • Location:Men. Falls, WI
  • Full Name:Casey Littmann

Posted 26 October 2012 - 05:12 AM

Maybe licensing fees are keeping these detail sets from coming to our benches?


I get the feeling MCG is in the situation of needing to be very careful which kits they should do p/e sets for. They must have a ton of dead stock for kits like the '71 GTX. It's a $15 kit, and how many people are going to spend another $10 on a few metal detail items to detail a decent, but not modern/high-end kit? Not many, I suspect. Most modelers are cheap frugal, myself included, and scoff at paying $29.99 for a kit, so another $12.00 for a p/e set is not going to happen. That leaves MCG targeting the folks who would buy p/e sets regardless of the cost, which is a far smaller number of people, which means it will take a lot longer to sell those 100 frets they had produced in 2003. :huh:

Maybe someone like Scott(?) from Auto Modeler or similar could chime in an give us an idea of what it costs to make p/e fret, what the minimum order number is, and so on.

#11 jaydar

jaydar

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,084 posts
  • Location:chicago, il U.S.A.
  • Full Name:Joseph J. Taylor

Posted 26 October 2012 - 05:33 AM

I came from building planes where aftermarket was 100% of the cost of the kit. I could not even bring myself to build OOB. I returned to building cars purely because of burnout. I was greeted and treated to the fact that MCG made p/e for my builds. I was a happy camper and i promptly built a '69 Camaro RS and a '72 Dr Hemi Cuda both with fantastic MCG photoetch.

I have many other kits that have a corresponding fret of p/e from MCG.

My advice to MCG is to invest in new p/e frets. THey cannot sell them if they do not make them.

joe.

#12 Steven Zimmerman

Steven Zimmerman

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 837 posts
  • Location:Meadville Pa
  • Full Name:Steven

Posted 26 October 2012 - 06:40 AM

I would respectfully suggest you research what gos into creating / producing a fret of photo etched product.A resin caster can put a casting on the market for an initial outlay, while not cheap, but much cheaper than photo etch.He has to either pay for, or produce his own master, and then put it in rubber, then cast, clean up and sell...Usually for less then 500 bucks ( give or take). Photo etch ?...Artwork may cost you several hundred dollars, and then you have to have a 'first run' fromyour photo etch person, which usually runs between 1200-1500 dollars. For a 'cottage industry' fella, the initial outlay can be 4 or 5 times the initial outlay for a resin caster. Now, I'm not knocking resin casters here, but just pointing the differance in expenditures, and how it may affect what you decide to offer in your product line....'Z'

#13 edboys

edboys

    MCM Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 62 posts
  • Location:Des Moines, Iowa
  • Full Name:Mark Johnson

Posted 27 October 2012 - 06:34 AM

In regards to Steven's comment, yes do the research or at least consider greatly what he is conveying in his comment about cost. I am a caster and the initial outlay for the cost of materials such as mold rubber and resin are not as much as what photoetch will cost. The acid chemicals alone that are involved in the process would require a license just to get the quantities to do a large job. The process Steven has mentioned is time consuming and we all know what time invested can amount to. As a caster, nobody can imagine the amount of time I have to invest in creating a part from scatch. If that amount of time had to calculated, and I chose to just pick a number such as $15.00 an hour, I would have to charge close to $100.00 a part just to break even. I offer my parts as sideline to supplying my own needs. MCG is a real business unlike what I do and has to make a profit in order to stay in business. We all hope for many items to be supplied for our interests and not every want or desire is going to be made on our personal schedules. Currently, we all live in the most prosperous period in modeling history. The aftermarket industry is threatened by the current economy and if you wish to blame it on some political situation so be it, but just remember you could be living a modelers life like in the 60's when thread was used for ignition wiring and cotton used to simulate smoking tires. Been there, done that and I am glad I live in the current timeline.

Edited by edboys, 27 October 2012 - 06:43 AM.


#14 martinfan5

martinfan5

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,218 posts
  • Location:Los Santos, San Andreas
  • Full Name:Jonathan Stephens

Posted 27 October 2012 - 10:21 PM

I do enjoy using P/E sets for the most part, but really I just the brake rotors and call it a day, so I dont really see the point of spending $10 or more for something that I am not going to use all of it, or heck, half of it. If I was a contest builder, then maybe.

I will be the first to admit that I am cheap, I would like to say frugal, but no, I am cheap :lol: , so I try and support the aftermarket world, but the cost can add up fast, I have two builds that I am doing, both are using stuff for the aftermarket world, one of them between the paint and decals, I am in for $42, because of a very nice fellow resident and club member , the kit was free. :D

Then I have another build that the kit cost was little over $40, paint $13, wheels $12 if I decided too, it all adds up

Its hard for me to justify buying aftermarket stuff like P/E sets that cost the same or more as a kit does, And I completely forgot where I was going with all this, :unsure: :( :lol:

#15 gtx6970

gtx6970

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,883 posts
  • Location:Northern Ky
  • Full Name:Bill Allphin

Posted 29 October 2012 - 02:15 AM

I build for myself, and I have no interests in competing in contests. So for me personally I don't feel the need to go all out on a build. ( although I do enjoy looking at them )
Several years ago I did a build to replicate a friend of mines 1970 Charger and I had all kinds of PE stuff in it. Once completed I realized I had spent had more in aftermkt stuff in the car than I had in the car ( and the kit wasn't exactly cheap)

My hats off to them and I would love to support the aftermkt suppliers more then I do ,,,,,but my interests and budget make the decision as to what I buy.

But anymore about the only aftermkt pieces I buy are pre-wired distributers , some resin pieces that I can't get in stryene and decals .

#16 jaydar

jaydar

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,084 posts
  • Location:chicago, il U.S.A.
  • Full Name:Joseph J. Taylor

Posted 29 October 2012 - 03:07 AM

I would respectfully suggest you research what gos into creating / producing a fret of photo etched product.A resin caster can put a casting on the market for an initial outlay, while not cheap, but much cheaper than photo etch.He has to either pay for, or produce his own master, and then put it in rubber, then cast, clean up and sell...Usually for less then 500 bucks ( give or take). Photo etch ?...Artwork may cost you several hundred dollars, and then you have to have a 'first run' fromyour photo etch person, which usually runs between 1200-1500 dollars. For a 'cottage industry' fella, the initial outlay can be 4 or 5 times the initial outlay for a resin caster. Now, I'm not knocking resin casters here, but just pointing the differance in expenditures, and how it may affect what you decide to offer in your product line....'Z'


Z in my profession I don't do much with numbers but I do recognize when someone does not complete their point.
The $1200 - $1500 for a first run, and artwork of $200 for a total of $1700 is not much considering MCG charges between $9.99 and $14.99 per fret. Assuming that first run is 200 frets that means that a sale of 200 frets at $13.99 is $2798 yields a very cool profit. Tell me there are not 200 of us willing to buy a photoetch set for the '70 Mustang, 427 S/C Cobra or the .....After the initial artwork cost is paid the cost goes down and profit goes up.

I apologize to MCG for using their name in this discussion as it applies to any aftermarket producer. You are the one we are most familiar with.

joe.

Edited by jaydar, 29 October 2012 - 03:11 AM.


#17 Chuck Most

Chuck Most

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,915 posts
  • Location:Ithaca, Michiganistan
  • Full Name:^See Above

Posted 29 October 2012 - 03:58 AM

gets back to the whole philosphy of modeling: do you build, or buy?

So I take it you scratchbuilt everything on your display shelf- scripts, tires, glass, and all, right?

#18 southpier

southpier

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,665 posts
  • Location:northeast coast
  • Full Name:joe smythe

Posted 31 October 2012 - 04:21 AM

no; i buy

#19 Steven Zimmerman

Steven Zimmerman

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 837 posts
  • Location:Meadville Pa
  • Full Name:Steven

Posted 31 October 2012 - 05:54 AM

OK, Joseph, now complete YOUR point. Advertising. (can't sell them if nobody knows about them, have you priced an ad in the mags lately ?), packaging ( not just those little plastic bags, but the printing of all those little 'how to use photo etch' inserts plus the 'cover printing.Someone trims those photo etch frets from the master fret, someone packages them up, someone pays to print the catalog, Shipping. Cost of renting a table at hobby shows....postage and related costs. Now, II realise these arent mind numbing espenses, but they do add up. And I'm not sure, but i don't know if a run of 200 meets the supplier's minimum or not. And you're assuming sales of all two hundred, not necessarily a given, no matter what you think.I work hand in hand with a resin caster; what happens when that body he casts 50 of; because he thinks it will sell like hotcakes....doesn't sell at all ?...( it DOES happen)....

#20 jaydar

jaydar

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,084 posts
  • Location:chicago, il U.S.A.
  • Full Name:Joseph J. Taylor

Posted 31 October 2012 - 08:26 AM

Steve, all good points but most of all those expenses (with the exception of the package related ones, good point!) you just mentioned are applicable to al the products in his inventory. Each of the frets would only carry a fraction.,

joe.