83 replies to this topic

[Draggon]

And AMT's 67 Falcon that ended up as the modified stocker.

[Erik Smith]

That's where the '63 Tempest ended up - AWB.
The '63 Nova wagon was modified too, no? Bossa Nova?
It's curious what happened to molds that were not modified, though, and have never seen reissues. '62 Tempests, '62 Galaxies, '62 and '63 Fairlanes?

[G Holding]

What about all the old "Gangbusters" cars and extras?? I am a bit young for most of it, but have seen them at shows now and then.

[mikemodeler]

You would think if Moebius can tool up brand new tools for the 67-72 series Ford Pickups, that Round2 could fix the molds for the 70's Dodge pickups that were converted into monster trucks in the 80s. I have one of the Dodge Monster trucks and it appears that the hood and original 4x4 drivetrain is all that would be necessary to get it back into production.

I am not an accountant or tooling engineer, but I don't think with todays' technology that it would take much to get these kits back on the shelf and make a ton of modelers happy. They could offer a 2wd & 4wd version and with The Modelhaus having parts, we could create different years on our own.

[Jeff Johnston]

And AMT's 67 Falcon that ended up as the modified stocker.

I'm with you 100% on that as well as the 67 Galaxie kit...

[rasafyff]

Whatever happened to the old Renwal Revival kits? The modern versions of classic cars.

[Fat Brian]

Mike, the tooling for the hood could be borrowed from the Little Red Express kit.

It would be nice to see the AMT Kenworth 923 again along with the Alaskan Hauler.

[Art Anderson]

You would think if Moebius can tool up brand new tools for the 67-72 series Ford Pickups, that Round2 could fix the molds for the 70's Dodge pickups that were converted into monster trucks in the 80s. I have one of the Dodge Monster trucks and it appears that the hood and original 4x4 drivetrain is all that would be necessary to get it back into production.

I am not an accountant or tooling engineer, but I don't think with todays' technology that it would take much to get these kits back on the shelf and make a ton of modelers happy. They could offer a 2wd & 4wd version and with The Modelhaus having parts, we could create different years on our own.

MIke, actually it would cost more money than you might think--in fact, you could prolly buy a couple of top-end Corvettes for what it might cost to rehabilitate some of those old tools, particularly if major elements have to be re-cut. Far too many people think that to put an old tool back into shape for new production is as simple and cheap as duck soup--but I am here to tell you that it is not that way!

Technology, be it 21st Century or something harking back to what some people today think of as the dark ages--it will cost $$. Now the question becomes: "Do you want to see the same old, same old kit from 40-50 yrs ago, or would you rather see something done as state of the art 2012?" You can think about that, then answer.

Art

[Greg Myers]

Every time I see "prolly" used in a thread I don't take it too seriously, and I'd pick state of the art, Art.

Edited by Greg Myers, 10 November 2012 - 11:38 AM.

[Jeff Johnston]

Every time I see "prolly" used in a thread I don't take it too seriously, and I'd pick state of the art, Art.

Reading this response I assume you don't know Art personally, or even by reputation. If you did, you'd not question his credibility. I know him personally, and I can tell you without question that I don't know anyone else who is as knowledgeable about automobile history or model car history than Art.

Edited by Jeff Johnston, 10 November 2012 - 12:12 PM.

[FordRodnKustom]

Besides all the original AMT 1958 customizing kits,



I'd like to see these again

[Greg Myers]

Reading this response I assume you don't know Art personally, or even by reputation. If you did, you'd not question his credibility. I know him personally, and I can tell you without question that I don't know anyone else who is as knowledgeable about automobile history or model car history than Art.

You.re prolly right.

[mr moto]

I'd like to see the return of the AMT/MPC 1965 Coronet. The body is so much better than the Polar Lights version of several years ago.

[Tonioseven]

'71 and '72 Caprices.

[tim boyd]

Parts from the Sizzler ended up in the School Bus, also a Tom Daniel's kit .

Daddy...I dind't know about the Sizzler parts in the S'cool bus. Which parts made the leap? Thanks for the insight on that one! TIM

UPDATE - in reading the rest of this thread, I see some are questioning this. I have the Sizzler kit but not sure I have the S'Cool Bus...wonder if anyone can pull out the kits and look (and photographs would be even better).

I think it somewhat unlikely that an old kit like the Sizzler would have been used to source the Daniell one-off's like the S'cool....that's why this statement caught my interest.

TIM

Edited by tim boyd, 11 November 2012 - 01:50 AM.

[FASTBACK340]

Irreversibly modified kit: AMT '65 Olds 88

Same goes for the MPC '68 Barracuda annual. They would have to re-tool the hood, header panel, grilles, tail lights/trunk finisher, marker lights, etc.

But that's just me.....

[Mr mopar]

So i Guess there are gone forever.

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[Art Anderson]

So i Guess there are gone forever.

In all likelihood the tooling for the Tyrone Malone Super Boss/Boss Truck of America still exists. The kits were produced in 1978 and 1979, but didn't really hit a lot of popularity at the time. Chances are, however, that all licensing has expired though.

Art

[Art Anderson]

You would think if Moebius can tool up brand new tools for the 67-72 series Ford Pickups, that Round2 could fix the molds for the 70's Dodge pickups that were converted into monster trucks in the 80s. I have one of the Dodge Monster trucks and it appears that the hood and original 4x4 drivetrain is all that would be necessary to get it back into production.

I am not an accountant or tooling engineer, but I don't think with todays' technology that it would take much to get these kits back on the shelf and make a ton of modelers happy. They could offer a 2wd & 4wd version and with The Modelhaus having parts, we could create different years on our own.

My first reply to this was a bit too brief, and a bit too flippant: Most people assume that when a model kit tool is seriously modified, say as in the case of the pickup kits that were converted from stock configuration to monster or crusher truck model kits, that the original steel dies were merely re-cut. In all likelihood that was not the case; rather it's more than likely that new inserts for the body molds were created for the altered wheel arches, etc. To explain this more thoroughly:

To create the tooling for a one-piece body shell (car body, truck cab for instance) requires a series of movable sliding "core molds" that in the injection molding process, move inward to close up the body mold, and then once the molten plastic has been injected and has cooled to solidify, slide back or outwards to release the molded shell so that it can be removed (ejected) from the mold. That's where all those mold parting lines we modelers love to hate come from. For almost any one-piece body or truck cab, it takes at least six sliding cores to mold it: Inner core (inside surfaces), front core, rear core, right side core, left side core and upper core. Now, if only say, the body sides are to be changed as dramatically as with the monster truck kits, just the two side sliding cores need be changed--given the nature of hardened tool steel, that's not easily done, so more than likely new side slide cores and a new inner core mold were created to fit the original body tooling. The question then becomes--do the original slides that were changed out still exist (likely they do) and if so, are they in a usable condition today? IF they were preserved with a coating of cosmoline then likely yes, if not, rust likely will have made them unusable today.

Next comes the job of finding all that stuff: While the main mold bases probably are readily identifiable, a lot of the tooling inside them was done as "inserts", smaller steel blocks engraved to make various parts, and those may well have been removed, replaced with newly cut inserts for subsequent versions. Finding and identifying those could be a major problem, particularly for AMT tooling, given that AMT's tooling has changed hands several times over the past 35 or so years, and been moved at least three times over hundreds if not thousands of miles (from Troy MI to Baltimore MD, then to Dyersville IA, and now to South Bend IN) and most all of it was made before the introduction of computer databases to track all those various bits and pieces of tooling--even the internal "house" codes used to ID a lot of those changed several times--it now becomes a matter of someone who is knowledgeable about this stuff to literally sort through probably several hundred tons of tools (those old original mold bases weigh at minimum, at least a ton apiece--you aren't just going to pick one up with your bare hands, open it up to see what's inside), and all those extra tool inserts are likely in a myriad of heavy wooden crates as well. This means literally looking at each and every bit of tooling, and identifying them as to what subject they truly are.

All of this is the basis for my earlier comment that it may well be less expensive to simply make all new tooling than to try and rehabilitate something cut decades ago--meaning that in either case, it is likely to be a major investment.

Art

[charlie8575]

Technology, be it 21st Century or something harking back to what some people today think of as the dark ages--it will cost $$. Now the question becomes: "Do you want to see the same old, same old kit from 40-50 yrs ago, or would you rather see something done as state of the art 2012?" You can think about that, then answer.

Art

The answer....and here comes my legal training into play, is, "it depends."

If it's a really cool kit that probably wouldn't be cut as an all-new tool now, yes, I'd like to see it restored. Or if the original kit was really well-done.

Similarly, if we need an all-new kit because it was either never done or the existing molds are an engineering horror show for whatever reason (missing parts, done really wrong initially, screwed up by some variation,) then cut the mold.

Example of really well-done and that I'd like to see come back- the Monogram and MPC classics. I love those kits.

Charlie Larkin