Jump to content


Ariel Atom 3D print


  • You cannot reply to this topic
156 replies to this topic

#61 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 13 January 2013 - 04:31 PM

Thanks for the feedback, my wife has been shaking her head all day.  I have my Craftsman 2 ton jack sitting on a shop towel on a coffee table in the living room.  She drew the line at the kitchen counter ....   I must say the cone was much easier to measure and make all the moving parts move.

 

k55sgxql5q5roide7wus.jpg



#62 Ace-Garageguy

Ace-Garageguy

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,248 posts
  • Location:Down two, then left.
  • Full Name:Bill Engwer

Posted 13 January 2013 - 05:40 PM

Fascinating project. The Atom always struck me as being the next evolutionary step (in the 4-wheeled-motorcycle species) after the Lotus 7 and its derivatives. Insanely fun car.



#63 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 18 January 2013 - 09:22 AM

Mule 2 is here:

 

8gtg1cv0jq7dkq7hv6cq.jpg

Yes, that is the broken remains of mule 1 in the back. The wife stepped on it. If you consider it was used as a shoe it did not come out that bad and I never heard a cry out at the time of the incident, so, WSF must be spongy and soft on bare feet.

Issues:

  1. The suspension does work. It holds the car up and the springs compress when pressed. The Atom guys will tell me I have it set up way to stiff. Definitely the bias is off the front is much softer than the back.
  2. The steering does not work, oh it moves back and forth, but, there is way too much actual slop at the wheels to call it steering. It might be better called gentle nudge or hopefully guidance. I am going to have to think of a solution for this as if I make a solid attachment of steering shaft and wheel it will be too much articulation and be almost immediately a breakage point.
  3. The Team Dynamic 1.2 Pro's look great
  4. With the stiffening of the tray under the seats the frame is very robust now. No I still don't think it should be used for stepping on though.
  5. The revised articulation of the back wheels has made them very sturdy.
  6. The energy storing spring was a success. Too much success actually, it stores a ton of energy and is all stored up before it gets to my release mechanism.
  7. The entire drive mechanism has one big failing and one little one. Too much slop between the shafts, I need to either provide more support for the driving shaft or link the support between them or both. The energy storage system as designed does not work as the push shaft near the tire just pushes on the plate until the shaft moves the plate out of the wayrolleyes.png. The spring to force the drive shaft gear into the spring gear is too worthless and weak
  8. One of the rear shocks is having issues getting rid of the unused printing powder and the shaft only goes in partway.

Edited by NormL, 18 January 2013 - 09:25 AM.


#64 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 18 January 2013 - 10:05 AM

A couple of more shots:

 

rlk5uqpz6msj823ps7fz.jpg

zh292wpcl61i2pedwrnd.jpg

 

Something that has not been brought up in the 3D printing discussions happened on this print.  The wheel braces (the metal fingers that hold the rim) did not all print the same width.  This is because a laser sintered print does react to gravity on the molten plastic.  Kind of forgot about that.



#65 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 18 January 2013 - 10:47 AM


Edited by NormL, 18 January 2013 - 10:48 AM.


#66 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 20 January 2013 - 09:09 AM

I am not having difficulty on how to make the front wheels pivot and steer without so much slop that is is anything more than a direction suggestion system. The only workable solution that I know will work is that I use snap in components to make the steering actually functional. I really don't want to call the idea on the steering when I can make a storage spring work, but, I may have too. The suspension slop is livable now that the entire shock system is one piece with a pivot at the rocker. Basically replace all three wheel joints with ball and sockets. I still can't believe how much energy (power) can be stored in that spring.

 

I have figured a way that might get the steering done as a static print. I can't help but notice that the two rear tires can deflect up to 15° of arc with pressure and they immediately snap back when the pressure is released. The rear tires are not designed to have deflection contained within the nylon. I am thinking that I can get the needed deflection within the flexibility of the nylon. I have the upper and lower hub joints designed in my head and I am still working on the linkage.



#67 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 21 January 2013 - 08:32 AM

i dipped my WSF parts in future to stop them from absorbing paint

What is "Future"?  Most of my prints have been sealed with bondo and I am unfamiliar with this product.



#68 Lownslow

Lownslow

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,830 posts
  • Location:West Side Chicago
  • Full Name:Frank Rizzo

Posted 21 January 2013 - 07:54 PM

What is "Future"?  Most of my prints have been sealed with bondo and I am unfamiliar with this product.

0004650000182_500X500.jpg

a lot of builders swear by it, i use it to give a seal to my FUD parts to make them castable



#69 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:29 AM

We'll that certainly was not the expected answer!  I never would have thought of going to Target.  Thanks for the tip and it makes perfect sense now that I think about it.

 

Have you used it on WSF?


Edited by NormL, 22 January 2013 - 06:30 AM.


#70 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 23 January 2013 - 06:23 PM

I am resigning myself into having to add an idle shaft.  I can't increase the size of the gear that resides on the drive shaft as I am as close as I can get to the frame.  The gear ratio as it is now is too much for the spring and I thought I would end up here and here I am.  I can drop another shaft in below the spring shaft and actually have a choice in gearing.  I am also going to add at least two support webs between the now three shafts hard mounted to the frame

 

I did start the steering redesign today and scraped and restarted two more times.  I am thinking I have it now.  I have several more hours before I can shoot a screen shot.



#71 socalbuckeye

socalbuckeye

    MCM Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 14 posts
  • Location:OC, California
  • Full Name:Mark Yeager

Posted 23 January 2013 - 08:15 PM

OMG.  Awesome.  I looked into this a couple of years back as my brother has a MakerBot, but the resolution wasn't there and I shelved the idea.  I will definately need to revisit it. 

 

Question, what/how did you laser scan your Atom to begin with?

 

Seems like this would take out a lot of the upfront work and get the proportions dead-on.



#72 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:31 PM

I have two scanners.  One is a time of flight and one is phased based.  The TOF is +/-1mm within 350 feet and the PB is +/-1.5mm within 75 feet.  The difference is collection with the TOF being 50,000 nodal points per second and the phased being 508K pps.  When you take the first sigma mean from a cylinder containing 150k points it is pretty accurate.  The Atom's main tubes are splined in two directions at the same time and did take me a moment to figure out how to model correctly.  Mine are BIM (building model) scanners and the short throw scanners are much more accurate



#73 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:06 PM

I went ahead and spent a little time on the 1/24th jack and took the joint gaps way down and basically refined it.  I never did find the cup that goes in the lift plate, so, I just made one.  The gaps were from the 50% reduction of the 1/12th version and were 0.25 mm and I took them to 0.1 mm  The jack should actually work, but, you never know until you print it and try. 

 

Since I am doing 3D models, I decided to place a 3D pdf's instead of a lot of pics.  If Harry or another mod has an issue with this, just tell me and I will post pics instead.

 

nnotg9d97tql0s0zmxb8.jpg

Attached Files


Edited by NormL, 24 January 2013 - 07:11 PM.


#74 Chas SCR

Chas SCR

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 716 posts
  • Location:Michigan
  • Full Name:Chas Cochran

Posted 24 January 2013 - 09:15 PM

Very nice work, Now I know what you are talking about on the Atom as it's a car not a printer machine lol You learn some thing knew every day and sitting here reading every page I see what more you are talking about. Thank you for sharing this stuff with us.



#75 Bernard Kron

Bernard Kron

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,706 posts
  • Location:Seattle, WA
  • Full Name:Bernard Kron

Posted 24 January 2013 - 11:53 PM

Thanx for posting the 3D PDF. A little exploration around its various dusplay modes was very instructive.



#76 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 25 January 2013 - 05:17 AM

Thanx for posting the 3D PDF. A little exploration around its various dusplay modes was very instructive.

 

Did you catch the tree where you can turn components off and on?  That is my favorite part or maybe being able to measure.  There are some really cool 3D Andriod and iPhone apps too.  The one I use is Inventor Publisher



#77 Bernard Kron

Bernard Kron

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,706 posts
  • Location:Seattle, WA
  • Full Name:Bernard Kron

Posted 25 January 2013 - 05:20 AM

 

Did you catch the tree where you can turn components off and on?  That is my favorite part or maybe being able to measure.  There are some really cool 3D Andriod and iPhone apps too.  The one I use is Inventor Publisher

 

Yes I did. It's a great insight into how the object was constructed.



#78 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 25 January 2013 - 07:59 AM

Very nice work, Now I know what you are talking about on the Atom as it's a car not a printer machine lol You learn some thing knew every day and sitting here reading every page I see what more you are talking about. Thank you for sharing this stuff with us.

 

Thanks for pointing out that not everyone knows what an Atom is, LOL.  You would think I would already know that as every time I stop at a gas station I get pummeled with questions.  I changed the thread title so that it is more representative



#79 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:48 PM

How hard is it to get working steering in a 1/24th scale model with 0.5 mm gap minimums?  Look at the attached and you will see how far I have gone to get it done.  Using anything that resembles the stock attachments is too lose.  This actually uses the slop to my advantage for up and down suspension travel.  I have done a couple of motion sims and I am thinking this will work.  Now the linkage!

Attached Files



#80 NormL

NormL

    MCM Friend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 181 posts
  • Location:Lake Tapps, WA
  • Full Name:Norm Larson

Posted 26 January 2013 - 08:28 AM

Mirror the "special" tracks and rails for the steering to the other side.  It actually does not look as bad as I thought.

mw5559evcfvejsopp8dl.jpg

 

I am going to go to a rack and spur system for the steering actuation.  That is the only system that will fit and give me the length of travel necessary to actually steer.  I am also thinking I can double up on the storage spring if I add a third shaft.  Never too much power!