Jump to content


School bus question


  • You cannot reply to this topic
93 replies to this topic

#41 Harry P.

Harry P.

    MCM Ohana

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,382 posts
  • Location:NW suburban Chicago
  • Full Name:A mere layman...

Posted 11 January 2013 - 04:54 PM

In the event of an accident who will be cutting 48-72 seatbelts. ;)

 

Nick

 

I guess that makes sense. Sort of. Maybe.



#42 Rob Hall

Rob Hall

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,304 posts
  • Location:Phoenix, Arizona
  • Full Name:Robert Hall

Posted 11 January 2013 - 04:55 PM

And as far as I know, no seatbelts in school buses. At least that's how it is here.

 

What's up with that? We don't even let little Johnnie and little Janie ride a freakin' bike without a helmet. So why no seatbelts in school buses?

I've read it's because of the padding on the seats.  And the logistical headache of getting all the kids to buckle up.



#43 martinfan5

martinfan5

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,713 posts
  • Location:Arizona, Valley Of The Sun
  • Full Name:Jonathan Stephens

Posted 11 January 2013 - 04:56 PM

In the event of an accident who will be cutting 48-72 seatbelts. ;)

 

Nick

First responders will be cutting those seat belts



#44 Nick Winter

Nick Winter

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,926 posts
  • Location:Whitby,Ontario, Canada
  • Full Name:Nicholas J. Winter

Posted 11 January 2013 - 05:11 PM

First responders will be cutting those seat belts

Not always, especially in the event of an urgent emergency situation where the first responders have not arrived yet.

 

adding to what Rob said, next time your on a school bus, grab one of the seats, you'll feel how soft they actually are, quite pliable.

 

Nick



#45 Craig Irwin

Craig Irwin

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,955 posts
  • Location:Pendleton Indiana ( near Indianapolis)

Posted 11 January 2013 - 05:13 PM

And as far as I know, no seatbelts in school buses. At least that's how it is here.

 

What's up with that? We don't even let little Johnnie and little Janie ride a freakin' bike without a helmet. So why no seatbelts in school buses?

I am so with you on this one!!!

 

Good 'ol government, "Do as I say, not as I do".



#46 martinfan5

martinfan5

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,713 posts
  • Location:Arizona, Valley Of The Sun
  • Full Name:Jonathan Stephens

Posted 11 January 2013 - 05:14 PM

Not always, especially in the event of an urgent emergency situation where the first responders have not arrived yet.

 

adding to what Rob said, next time your on a school bus, grab one of the seats, you'll feel how soft they actually are, quite pliable.

 

Nick

And that is a good point as well,  I dont think I am going to be stepping foot on a school bus anytime soon



#47 Lunajammer

Lunajammer

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,681 posts
  • Location:Fargo, ND
  • Full Name:Mike Laliberte

Posted 11 January 2013 - 05:30 PM

Actually, if I'm not mistaken, I think testing showed there's more upper body and neck injuries in busses when kids use waist belts. They would also need other kinds of protection before exceeding the safety of just letting kids have full body hits into the padded seats in front of them.



#48 Harry P.

Harry P.

    MCM Ohana

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,382 posts
  • Location:NW suburban Chicago
  • Full Name:A mere layman...

Posted 11 January 2013 - 05:34 PM

I think it's ironic that we expect kids to wear a helmet when they're on a bike, but we think it's fine that they ride in a school bus twice a day without wearing a seat belt. In one way we're so overly protective, yet in another way we seem to be ok with "taking chances." Not saying belts in buses is right or wrong... just kind of funny how we are so inconsistent.



#49 Danno

Danno

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,999 posts
  • Location:Feenicks
  • Full Name:Nameless Natural Luminary

Posted 11 January 2013 - 05:56 PM

Why no seatbelts in school buses?

 

Answer:

 

 

$  $  $

 

 

 

 

:huh:



#50 Danno

Danno

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 13,999 posts
  • Location:Feenicks
  • Full Name:Nameless Natural Luminary

Posted 11 January 2013 - 06:13 PM

Think I'm overly cynical?

 

It's reported that there are only 5 or 6 children killed in school bus traffic accidents annually.

 

 

Costs versus benefits

A report from the NHTSA estimated that installing a singular bench-style seat belt set would cost between $375 and $600, totaling between $5,485 and $7,346 for every large bus.

 
"The NHTSA concluded that lap and shoulder belts can be misused, resulting in more injury."
 

According to the NHTSA, "The benefits would be achieved at a cost of between $23 [million] and $36 million per equivalent life saved." Instead of a federal mandate, the NHTSA encourages individual states and local governments to be able to decide on the seat belt requirements within their own communities.

 

The NHTSA concluded that seat belts are not always worn properly, resulting in more injury. "Lap/shoulder belts can be misused and NHTSA's testing showed that serious neck injury and perhaps abdominal injury could result when lap/shoulder belts are misused," representatives from NHTSA said. Furthermore, the NHTSA concluded that it was unrealistic to ask bus drivers to make sure each child complied with seat belts.

 

Taking all of this into consideration, many transportation safety experts agree with the NHTSA that the cost simply outweighs the benefit.

 

 

 

B)



#51 Guest_Johnny_*

Guest_Johnny_*
  • Guests

Posted 11 January 2013 - 06:37 PM

Any one with kids knows how hard it is to get a sholder belt placed properly on a kid. They are not a one size fits all, even in adults!

Think of the varios size kids that ride a bus on any given day.

Then the amount of time that it would take for someone to go through and make sure that every student had the belt on correctly. Then if you made the rule like for cars many would also have to be in a booster seat unril they met the height/weight requirement to wear the regular seat belt.

 

Now I will say that the bus that picks up the preschoolers here DOES have belts and the aid straps each kid in as they get on the bus. But unlike the corner group pickups for the regular kids the preschoolers are picked up at their door.

 

I know it sounds cold when the give the cost to death ratio, but they do have to draw a line somewhere. That or make everyone get their own child to school themselves and do away with buses.



#52 Harry P.

Harry P.

    MCM Ohana

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,382 posts
  • Location:NW suburban Chicago
  • Full Name:A mere layman...

Posted 11 January 2013 - 06:41 PM

If little kids can ride around in buses without wearing a seat belt (and where are the bus air bags???), why not the rest of us?

 

Seems very hypocritical that we have a "cost benefit analysis" that says it's "not worth it" to strap kids into a school bus for their own safety, but everyone who rides in a car has to wear a seatbelt by law.

 

A little inconsistent, isn't it?



#53 Guest_Johnny_*

Guest_Johnny_*
  • Guests

Posted 11 January 2013 - 06:53 PM

Harry, I used to be one of the biggest anti-seatbelt law protesters there was. But after working as a paramedic and seeing that they DO in fact save more lives in CAR accidents I came around to it. (as in using them myself although we have always strapped our kids in)

Went on several calls of school bus accidents and never say serious injury to a kid. The numbers justaren't there to support the push.

While it seems hipocritical it really is not. Because if you use the same formula for cost to compliance in cars the numbers are astronomical in the oppisite direction!

On a side note, personaly I do not like laws that remove ones right to choose like the seatbelt or helmet laws.



#54 Lunajammer

Lunajammer

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,681 posts
  • Location:Fargo, ND
  • Full Name:Mike Laliberte

Posted 11 January 2013 - 06:57 PM

I wouldn't contest your thoughts Harry because I think at some level everyone feels like there's something wrong with the picture. But money just isn't available for everyone's avid cause. I guess it comes down to asking all taxpayers in the school districts, rich or poor, to fork it over if that's what important to them.

 

I expect they might need to pay bus monitors to make sure squirrelly kids are minding the rules and not goofing with the buckles and/or systems. Which might happen anyway for security, the way things are going.



#55 Harry P.

Harry P.

    MCM Ohana

  • Administrators
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,382 posts
  • Location:NW suburban Chicago
  • Full Name:A mere layman...

Posted 11 January 2013 - 06:59 PM

I used to be an anti-belt guy too. I figured nobody had the right to tell me to wear a seatbelt. And I never wore it.

 

Then one day I was hit head on by a minivan (long story, but it was the other driver's fault, not mine). Anyway, the airbag probably saved me, because without it I would have gone through the windshield for sure, But from that day on I have never driven a car without putting on the belt first. I learned my lesson the hard way.

 

I guess it seems odd to me that we have one set of rules for people in cars and a different set of rules for kids in buses.



#56 Art Anderson

Art Anderson

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,288 posts

Posted 11 January 2013 - 07:56 PM

Years ago, school buses were yellow all over. Over the past few years I've noticed that almost all of them now have their roofs painted white.

 

Since this  happened just within the last several years, I assume it's some sort of technology-related reason? Something to do with GPS, maybe?

 

Anyone know?

Not really.  While school busses in the Midwest, certainly the Great Lakes region, used to be yellow all over, white roofed school busses have been around in the hotter parts of the US for decades--and for the very same reason that white roofs on 2-toned cars became popular--white reflects a lot of the sun's heat in the summer!

 

Indiana school busses were Yukon Yellow from the the 1940's forward (the dark orange school bus used in the iconic film "Hoosiers" wasn't accurate from my memory, never saw an orange school bus as a kid!) all over.  The white roof thing started here about 1980, but it isn't universal even today--Lafayette and West Lafayette school corporations don't have them, but Tippecanoe (county) School Corporation busses have white roofs.  A lot of that stems, I think, from the old traditional school year for rural schools here, stemming from the era when rural schools here started their year in the 2nd week of August, and ended with the first weekend in May every year, so farm kids could help with corn planting, then go back to school after the summer grain harvest (winter and spring wheat, barley and oats), where we city kids got to be free until the week after Labor Day, and stayed in school until generally the first or second of June every spring.

 

In addition, at least in Indiana until the late 1960's, most rural schools relied on farmers who contracted to operate school busses.  In that earlier system, a farmer would buy the school bus chassis, have a body fitted to it, and ran his route every morning and afternoon during the school year, generally replacing the chassis about every 4-5 years, having the body transferred from one chassis to the next.  But increasing concerns about safety and liability concerns lead the then-newly-formed school corporations (back 60 years ago, rural schools here were the property of the various townships in rural Indiana), the newly consolidated school districts opted to take over bus transportation themselves, the result being considerable uniformity.

 

As for aerial surveillance, Indiana State Police no longer operates that sort of thing, due in part to variable weather for flying, and costs, so few, if any school busses here have any sort of numbering or logo's on their roofs.

 

Art



#57 Art Anderson

Art Anderson

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,288 posts

Posted 11 January 2013 - 08:01 PM

If little kids can ride around in buses without wearing a seat belt (and where are the bus air bags???), why not the rest of us?

 

Seems very hypocritical that we have a "cost benefit analysis" that says it's "not worth it" to strap kids into a school bus for their own safety, but everyone who rides in a car has to wear a seatbelt by law.

 

A little inconsistent, isn't it?

Harry, actually the worst danger to kids re: school busses is not a wreck, but the stupid idiots who refuse to stop when a school bus stops to board or let off kids!  The incidence of children being injured in school bus accidents, at least here, is actually quite low--the last serious crash here involving a school bus severely injured the granddaughter of a cousin of mine, when the school bus she was in was rear-ended by a truck driver not paying any attention to stopped traffic ahead.  Rachel's injuries were severe, it took about 5 years and several surgeries to repair her lower legs which were badly injured.

 

Art



#58 Skydime

Skydime

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,358 posts
  • Location:Gone from here
  • Full Name:None necessary

Posted 11 January 2013 - 08:02 PM

 

School buses have heat, I guess they don't have AC.

Yeah, but the school bus driver always had his/her little clip on fan.  Guess they figured the kids would just stick their heads out the little slide down window like a dog.  :blink:



#59 diymirage

diymirage

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,507 posts
  • Location:michigan
  • Full Name:Eelco Egelmeer

Posted 11 January 2013 - 08:46 PM

they oughta just do away with school busses all together

its the governments job to educate our kids, fair enough

but i fail to see how its to goverments job to get our kids to said place of education

think of all the money we could save by not having to run school busses

think of all the time we could save by not getting stuck behind school busses

think of all the bandwith we would save not having to argue to color of a school bus roof (3 pages and counting)

 

sure, i understand not everyone can drop thier kids off at school but im sure most people could make it work...people in every other country do

here's a thought, give them bicycles

that aught to take care of our obesity problem

and before you claim the infra structure isnt set up for that many bicycles, we have tons of money that we can spend on fixing that infra structure (we saved it on not hving to run schoolbusses) and all those out of work ex school bus drivers can pave these newly build sections of infrastructure...compared to a schoolbus full of nagging children a steamroller will be a breeze to drive :)



#60 mikemodeler

mikemodeler

    MCM Ohana

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,179 posts
  • Location:NASCAR Country!
  • Full Name:Classified

Posted 12 January 2013 - 05:48 AM

they oughta just do away with school busses all together

its the governments job to educate our kids, fair enough

but i fail to see how its to goverments job to get our kids to said place of education

think of all the money we could save by not having to run school busses

think of all the time we could save by not getting stuck behind school busses

think of all the bandwith we would save not having to argue to color of a school bus roof (3 pages and counting)

 

sure, i understand not everyone can drop thier kids off at school but im sure most people could make it work...people in every other country do

here's a thought, give them bicycles

that aught to take care of our obesity problem

and before you claim the infra structure isnt set up for that many bicycles, we have tons of money that we can spend on fixing that infra structure (we saved it on not hving to run schoolbusses) and all those out of work ex school bus drivers can pave these newly build sections of infrastructure...compared to a schoolbus full of nagging children a steamroller will be a breeze to drive :)

 

 

In the small town I used to live in Illinois, they didn't have money for school buses anymore so they did away with them. This was a town that was about six square miles and the only kids who didn't ride the bus had to live within 2-3 blocks of the school as the school system was overly concerned about safety. The funny thing is the buses were maybe half full because most parents still insisted on picking up their kids at school.

 

In Illinois, the state law says that only those students who live at least 1 1/2 miles from school are eligible to ride the buses for free UNLESS there is a major highway or dangerous intersection that the kids must cross to get to school. In cities like Chicago, that probably means a lot of kids ride the bus despite living less than a mile from school.

 

I think walking to school would be great for kids but because we have become such a lawsuit happy society, most schools tend to let kids ride the bus to keep from being sued. In my neighborhood, the middle school and high school are both about a mile away and kids here a more likely to ride the bus in the morning and walk home in the afternoon, especially if the weather is nice!