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getting a flawless finish


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#1 captin

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 08:53 AM

i ushally build rat rods or junkers for models and i tried a shiny one but ended up putting mud flinging up on the body cause there where some imperfections in the paint and i tried sanding it and polishing it but its didnt come out. i am starting a new model and its a 56 ford f100 and i want it to look like it just came off the showroom, but im not sure how to acheive a flawless paint job. i thought i did but it didnt turn out as flawless as i hoped (then again it was my first and only shiny build). any tips or tricks on acheiving a flawless paint job.

                    thanks chris

 

 

 

 

 

 



#2 Chas SCR

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 11:19 AM

Wet sanding between each coat of primer from 3200 to 12000 and then each coat of color and also each coat of clear. The better the body is like glass and smooth the better the paint job will be. Remember you are not driving this thing and the weather is not going to get to it like a real car so you can make it smooth as glass and still paint it and the paint and clear will hold.



#3 Custom Mike

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 01:30 PM

Chas, samding a primer is a no-no, I've seen many people have issues doing that, especially if they apply any kind of masking. The paint will lift if you sand the primer and mask it off for a second color/graphic/etc. And yes, I've had people say they've done it and didn't have a problem...well, you got lucky, and sooner or later (Usually on your best paint job ever), it'll bite you. Primer is supposed to be rough, it gives the paint something to bite into. If you're smoothing it out, well, you might as well paint the bare plastic.

 

Chris, spray  a couple of light mist coats (Not fully covering any area) until you have full coverage, giving the paint a bit of time to "flash" between mist coats. Once you've got full coverage, lay down a couple of light wet coats. Let those flash, and determine if you need more paint. Once the paint has fully cured (Usually 2-5 days depending on the type of paint you used), then you can do some color sanding if needed.



#4 Ace-Garageguy

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 03:35 PM

Opinions abound. I ALWAYS sand primer, on 1:1 cars and on models, but NEVER NEVER with anything finer than 400-600 grit paper. This leaves sufficient grip. NOT sanding primer leaves orange peel, and you have to bury it in paint. After sanding, clean the primered surface with isopropyl alcohol. That should kill any poor adhesion problems, as it removes any finger oils or other contaminants.

 

Maybe not flawless, but not too bad...

 

DSCN5575.jpg


Edited by Ace-Garageguy, 09 February 2013 - 03:36 PM.


#5 cobraman

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 04:31 PM

Yikes !  I love that car everytime I see it. Great build. I also always sand my primer.



#6 Longbox55

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 04:51 PM

I always sand my primer, too. The only time I had a problem with paint adheasion was the one time that I didn't sand the primer.



#7 Chas SCR

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:21 PM

Option is about all it is!  Ummm never had any thing lift and I use all Du Pont paint products

 

226812_1874001303552_1175598_n.jpg419771_4994257988019_860292505_n.jpg



#8 Chas SCR

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 05:23 PM

And if you do not think I do graphics here is one also.

No decal on nothing there.

 

165261_1682649759883_6069478_n.jpg



#9 plowboy

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 09:06 PM

I sand the entire body first with 400 grit. Any low spots will still have a shine and you can see where putty or additional sanding is needed.

When that's done, I sand the entire body again with 600 grit, wash and dry, then spray a couple of light coats of gray primer. I then mist a coat of white primer over that. The white primer will show any spots you may miss in the beginning when you sand the next time.

When that's dry, I go over it again starting with 600 and finishing up with 1000. Wash and dry again, then spray two to three good coats of primer on.

Then, I do a final sanding with 2000 grit, wash and dry and spray two good coats of paint on.

When dry, I sand with 3600 or 4000, wash and dry and spray one good wet coat on, let it dry a few minutes, spray a light coat of clear over it and allow that to dry.

Then, I sand with 4-6000 (if needed), wash and dry and spray two good wet coats of clear.

I usually don't have to polish the clear using this process,but occasionally I will have to to get that perfectly smooth finish. If I do, I start with 6000,then 8000 and finish with 12000. Then I will do a final polish with Nu Finish polish, then a coat of wax.

This is the process I use with lacquer paints which is all I will use anymore. The only thing I do different with enamels is that I wait until the color coats are dry, sand with 4000 and then spray the clear.

It's tedious and time consuming work, but that's what it takes to get a really nice finish on a paint job.



#10 Ace-Garageguy

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 04:57 AM

Another one of my personal techniques...I recommend prepping the bare plastic body by scrubbing with Comet, a toothbrush and plenty of hot water. Sanding will NOT get in all the crevices around details (I've looked at the surface under high magnification to verify this), and it also tends to blunt and soften the crispness of details.

 

If you have heavy bodywork to do, roughen the surface under where filler will go with 180 grit paper, and make sure you mix your two-part filler correctly. Poor mixing technique and poor surface prep is responsible for the adhesion problems some folks have with fillers. Try to avoid putting two-part filler over primer. My orange Chevelle above has MAJOR bodywork in the quarter panels, as the top is chopped 4 scale inches.

 

After major bodywork is finished and very closely shaped, I shoot two coats of Duplicolor or Plasticoat (both the High-Build varieties) primer, letting it flash completely in between coats. I'll often bury minor inperfections on local areas in more primer, or if the problems are too much for primer, a little ONE-PART glazing putty, which is simply very thick lacquer primer.

 

LET IT DRY COMPLETELY. It WILL SHRINK as it dries. I sand out imperfections with 600 grit wet, and look over the model VERY carefully...then go back and rework any remaining problems. Again, LOOK AT YOUR WORK VERY CAREFULLY AND CRITICALLY, as paint will NOT cover or hide bad bodywork.

 

My final 600 wet sanding of the primer leaves a flat and smooth surface with NO orange peel. I usually shoot lacquer or automotive-basecoat, one medium wet coat of paint first, as I personally find that shooting a mist coat first adds to orange peel buildup. A medium-wet coat will also give you sufficient shine to show up any remaining flaws. Nice thing about lacquer or automotive-basecoat colors is that they dry quick, and any tiny imperfections can be sanded out before you go any further. Enamel has to be allowed a long dry-time, or stripped.

 

Depending on the topcoat color and the final primer color, three to six coats of color usually get it. I've learned to shoot the color wet enough so it self-levels but doesn't run, and usually requires no sanding prior to clearing. Solid color lacquers require no clear and can be sanded up to 12,000 grit wet and polished. Aotomotive basecoats, Testors basecoats (the two-part lacquer system) and metallics all require clear.

 

DO NOT sand metallics or pearls inmmediately prior to clearcoating. Sanding of these without recoating with more color is virtually GUARANTEED to leave noticable blotchiness under the clear. If you have a flaw in metallics or clears, let it dry hard, sand the flaw out and then CAREFILLY re-spray the affected area with color to hiding, then shoot your clear. I use three coats of model-car lacquer clear, minimum, to allow sufficient material for wet-sanding and polishing without cutting through the clear and screwing the color.


Edited by Ace-Garageguy, 10 February 2013 - 05:02 AM.


#11 captin

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 05:42 AM

Wow thanks guys this really helps me out a lot i appreciate all of your comments. another question when it comes to enamel or lacqoer paints is there one that is better than the other or is the only difference that one just takes longer to dry. thanks again guys

#12 plowboy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:53 AM

I used to only use enamels. But, after trying lacquer paints, I won't even consider painting with enamels any more. Besides the much faster drying time, lacquer paints go on much thinner than enamels and won't bury the details on the body. Plus, lacquer is so much easier to spray, especially out of the can. I haven't gotten one single run painting with lacquers. I sure can't say that about enamels! My favorite lacquers are Tamiya, Model Masters and Dupli Color. You actually get more paint for your money with Dupli Color. But, they don't always have the colors I'm looking for. The only thing with some lacquers, is that you need to make sure you have your body covered entirely with primer or else it could craze the plastic. Hobby lacquers are usually safe where some automotive lacquers aren't. I always primer. So, it isn't an issue for me.



#13 Ace-Garageguy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:41 AM

I agree entirely with Roger (plowboy) in post #12, but I still use enamels for things like wheels and engines for example, that you mignt want very glossy but can't possibly polish out.

 

These wheels are Testors ratttle-can enamel.

 

DSCN7604.jpg

 

One other remark about Duplicolor...the flake in the metallics is very large for 1/24 scale models, as is Testors 1-coat lacquer. If you want to avoid the bass-boat, dune-buggy, kustom-kar look, you might want to look into something like Scale Finishes or others with closer-to-scale looking metallics.


Edited by Ace-Garageguy, 11 February 2013 - 07:49 AM.


#14 gman

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:06 AM

One other remark about Duplicolor...the flake in the metallics is very large for 1/24 scale models, as is Testors 1-coat lacquer. If you want to avoid the bass-boat, dune-buggy, kustom-kar look, you might want to look into something like Scale Finishes or others with closer-to-scale looking metallics.

 

I can certainly say some automotive sprays (including Duplicolor) can have huge flake in metallic paints, but this does vary.

 

IMG_3894.jpg

 

^^ Duplicolor's Nissan Cherry Red Pearl, polished with no clear coat contrasted against Tamiya White Pearl for the roof insert. 

 

While the flake size for the Tamiya white is washed out and you can't tell for comparison purposes, I was pretty pleased with the scale effect of the flake size in this particular Duplicolor paint. I usually gravitate to the pearl variants of automotive colors due to the smaller and more in-scale flake sizes they exhibit when used on a model.



#15 Ace-Garageguy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 10:21 AM

Good tip on the Duplicolor pearls from gman Greg.

 

Great looking finish, Greg. You didn't have any blotching issues polishing that, with no clear coat? Did you sand it first, or shoot it so slick all it required was a polish?


Edited by Ace-Garageguy, 11 February 2013 - 10:22 AM.


#16 gman

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 04:03 PM

Good tip on the Duplicolor pearls from gman Greg.

 

Great looking finish, Greg. You didn't have any blotching issues polishing that, with no clear coat? Did you sand it first, or shoot it so slick all it required was a polish?

 

It didn't shoot so slick, there was a little orange peel after it cured. I actually polished that out with Bare Metal plastic polish and there was no blotchiness- this color was one of their non-clear coat colors indicated by no "CC" on the can.  The beauty of Duplicolor is that it polishes nicely once cured.