bonehead23
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Posts posted by bonehead23
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Do not let anybody tell you this kit is a fluke...it isn't. With a little bit of a trim, the chassis fits just fine, in fact better than I first thought. Here's the proof. I know, the stock bumper and lights look a little off, but I want to build a stock one, with a trailer, and I want the two cars to be identical except for the air dam and engine, of course...and the slicks...and....etc...I took a few pieces from an old junker for the deck lid scoops and body parts.
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With a klittle trimming at the rear, and opened wheel wells on the rear of the body, it fits...and the trailer is pulled by a stock 'Vair. Update: Bodies are painted, and John Greczula sent me an extra set of decals for the tow car!
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I didn't mean to sound like I was complaining, this is a good kit once you get the chassis trimmed properly, and the body's rear wheel wells opened up a bit. I have the chassis finished, and the body fits after alteration.You just have to have good "eyeball engineering" ability to get it right. If not for these re-issues, i would be bored to death!!!! Chezoom will be on a trailer pulled by a stock Corvair in identical paint.
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They should be ashamed to ask so much money for this piece of junk. I started one, and actually put a Mustang 5.0 in it, and better wheels, but the chassis and body problems sent it back into its box. Nothing fit without tons of work, and I gave up. I seldom ever do that but this kit is THAT bad. I'll probably use the wheels and engine in another project. Nice concept, miserably poor execution, overpriced final product. If you dig doing a lot of work, I mean a LOT, get one. If you don't like to scratch-build and re-engineer everything, avoid this one.
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Stephen....yes the rear chassis pan needs to be trimmed (as noted in the instructions), but what they don't say is that it must be trimmed laterally along the back, but also additional triangular sections off the far rear corners of the pan....do that and the rest falls into place (reasonably well). TIM
Yup, us old farts will figure it out! The instructions do show this mod, but not very clearly. I was thinking, it could have been possible to modify the mold to fit better...but I am ignorant of tool costs etc....and possibly Round 2 wamts to re-issue the Barracuda as well???? I'd buy two! I want to build a stock "Vair to pull the 'Zooom" on a trailer...so I am committed to finishing it now!
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Anybody bite on this one? If you do, be prepared to alter the Barracuda chassis to fit the "vair...in a few words, it does not fit. Another case of "Didn't anyone try to build this before releasing it?" category. I am determined to get this thing built, but it will take a lot of work. Beginners better stay away from this one...99% of them will give up and use the parts somewhere else or be so disappointed that they give up building models!!! The concept is cool; the product suffers a bit, missing details like steering gear and brake detail, radius rods in front, and they could have included the little scoops that go on the deck lid holes...but as i said, I WILL get this built no matter what. It does have some very neat parts regardless of the chassis not fitting at all.
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I finally got new shelves!!!! These replace an ugly old entertainment center. (See the post "Jus' call me Bonehead" to see the difference) The goal was to create more space, but within two days i had filled every shelf. The good news is they are spaced far enough apart that i can add more as time progresses!!! It also made the room brighter and appears larger. You can see every model this way...before, a lot were hidden behind tons of junk. Much better now!!!!
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Apologies to all for my ridiculously bad memory...Bad Medicine was a dragster, right? Patent Pending is the Dr. Krook's car??? At my age i am lucky to remember my own name,but I keep building my old rare kits even if I forget what they are called!!!! I don't save the boxes; i would need a whole room just for them!!! So I forget ....Thanks to those with a solid brain who remind me of the proper appellations!!!
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Holy Moley! that's some crazy corvair engine there! might be a little over aspirated!
'vair motors pop up all over the place. did you know Ed Roth's Road Agent was Corvair powered?
jb
Yup, and isn't it a thing of beauty??? I regret not getting more than one of these; that chassis is excellent!
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My good friend John Morrow and I are in EastWenatchee, where there are no clubs, shows, and only one Hobby Lobby to get kits from other than on line. Why isn't there a STATE-WIDE modeler's club? We would love to be included in that. But anyway, John and I have been at it since we were very young, and we're full of advice, among other things....Feel free to ask us anything, this is a great place for that.
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I read some of the threads here - not all - and not completely, because my time for such activities is limited, so I don't see every comment on every new kit.
There seems to me to be a feeling among some members here, that we are somewhat careless and sloppy in the way we go about researching and developing kits.
I guess that you could say I have an interest in making an effort to provide some explanation of how / why some new kits have flaws .
I think that I can speak for all of us who try to put nice new kits on store shelves when I say that flaws in kits occur for many reasons none of which include intentionally sloppy research or a lack of caring about the quality of kits we work to produce.
#1 As has been stated over and over, unless the subject is an all new car there are no factory drawings / factory clay models/ digital files to work with - In the "old"days" Johan and AMT had direct accesss to the factory design departments because they produced promos for the Big 3.
Today a 1960's era car kit is an exercise in finding a good reference vehicle to photograph and measure (hopefully a factory stock perfectly preserved or restored example) - then getting photos of every possible detail with good dimensional reference in every photo so China can see exactly what the car looks like. Believe me when it come time to make a mock-up there are never enough photos - there are always details that can't be found in photos.
To be truthful the best solution for me would be to have a perfectly restored example of my next kit sitting in my garage from start of research to finally approved kit in the box so that I could walk out and photograph or measure each little detail whenever there was a question from China
As for the suggestion, often offered in these forums, that reference vehices can be simply scanned into a computer file, my answer is not yet - not for a cost that works for us - and even after a scan is done that still does not provide all the details needed to produce a kit. Even if I could simply scan the car into my computer, I'd still need photos of all the interior, probably photos of the engine bay and lots of details that will not show clearly on a scan.
Errors are bound to creep in because the reference vehicle has non stock features - or because available photos are not perfect references or because the product developer didn't catch them. I can't speak for others but I share images of 3Ds, and mock-ups with several other experienced and trusted modelers and car guys as well as sending test shots to some of these same folks, in my best effort to catch errors that I did not see! ( I don't know for sure but I'd bet that Revell does the same thing) Even then I know thay errors will creep in! I try to educate myself on any specific vehicle we're doing - but I am not a walking encyclopedia of automotive details, and there is no chance that I will ever become one.
#2 The days of working from hand built 1/10 scale models and cutting tools with pantograph machines are as far gone as the age of the steam locomotive. Today every detail if the finished model is produced in a computer 3D file before any physical parts are made. All tool mking is now done from digital files - no more tool makers going into a tool into a tool and revising it by hand if you need to fix something. (To make revisions to our 61 Pontiac we needed to first go back and revise everything in the 3D files and approve all that before they'll touch the tools)
Which brings me to one of several reasons that we miss release dates. The tooling revison process takes time, LOTS OF TIME - when I find a problem - I tell China - they revise 3D files - 15 to 30 days later I get revised 3D files - I review the 3Ds if the files are right they make changes to tools - 30 to 45 days later they send me a test shot. which take about a week in transit. For me to build and review a test shot add another week or so - IF the 3Ds files were NOT right - add 15 to 30 more days. when I get done reviewing the test shot and something else needs to be fixed we can go right back to the revise 3D files step again!
#3 Simple economics dictate that we can't delay a kit to tweak of every tiny detail. We do our best to get these details right - honestly, we do, and product release dates get pushed back because we're doing our damnedest to get them right! BUT at some point we need to decide whether it's more important to keep pouring time and added dollars into revising tools or putting a less than PERFECT kit on store shelves. Trust me, as an example, our factory doe not revise tools for free. I can't keep going back and fixing every tiny detail - if I do try to do that, then there won't be a Moebius Models any longer.
#4 Styrene Plastic injected in steel tooling is an imperfect medium - steel tooling and injection molding can produce spectacularly complex shapes IF you have a big enough budget and plan on producing a big enough run of parts. That said, there are limits to our tooling budgets and production quantities, so from time to time there will be some compromises made in order to keep costs in line - sometimes there will be shapes that cannot be produced in a core, cavity and four slides typically used to make up a car body - that's just the nature of the beast
#5 I see the comments regarding high price of kits these days - I hate to say it but our costs are rising steadily, as are the costs of every other manufacturer - wages in China are going up, old cheap technology is going the way of the Dodo bird, 3D file and CAD design are more costly now in China than a room full of guys making tooling models by hand was a few years ago.. the day of the 10 or 15 dollar kit is past - the days of running 15-20,000 kits every run are long gone. Now those of us who produce kits need to find ways to keep our lights on while running 10,000 or less of a given kit and paying higher tooling and development costs - that. my friend results in a more exensive product on the shelves. It cannot be helped - the days of running 50 thousand copies of any one kit are also long gone.
#6 I keep seeing this question:Why can't you move back to the US? - The simple answer is that there is no one-stop shop for producers like Moebius or for that matter Revell in the US.
In order to produce kits here I'd need a design operation to produce the 3D files for tooling - then a tooling shop to translate those drawings to tooling - then a production shop to shoot plastic in those tools - a printer to produce packaging and instructions - probably a decal printer because the guy who prints boxes can't print decals - then I need to bring everything together somewhere to put it all in a box for the custome to buy - Now it all happens in one place I deal with one guy who makes ONE profit from the transaction, not 6 different guys each of whom expects to profit fromthe their piece of the total project
#7 We are a model kit company, not only a model car kit company, unlike Johan and AMT were, "back in the day". We produce a wide range of kits, not only car kits, so we are not specialized to only do cars - Johan started as 100% cars - AMT originated as 100% car models, while about 30% of the projects that I have going right now are car kits. (BTW Revell is also a multi line model kit company also with a wide range of kits, not only cars)
#8 Company staff size and work loads. I can't speak for other domestic brands here - but our staff in the US is very small
I do almost all product development for EVERY kit we produce NOT just car kits.
Currently I have 20 projects in various stages of development, only 6 of which are cars/trucks. Even though our car kits are less than 1/3 of my project list thay are by far and away the most complex and time consuming projects that I have.
I do my best to research each car project and I talk to several pretty good car modelers and a number of car guys on a very regular basis- I don't pretend to know every detail of each car project - I do my best, but I will be first to tell you that I can and do make mistakes - I'm sure that the same is true of the other guys at other kit producers who do the same job.
We have a full time graphic design guy who produces almost every piece of packaging, decals art, instruction sheets, any magazine ads, all brochures and he does some special project product development - the Florida home office does everything else- licensor relations, purchasing, sales, customer service,warehousing,shipping etc.. All design, tooling, manufacturing, packaging etc is done by our partner in China.
When I see comments here wondering why Moebius or Revell can't put out kits that are absolutely accurate at more affordable prices and on time according to announced release dates all I can think is that there a lack of understanding behind those comments.
I'm sure I won't have changed any minds with my attempted explanation here.
I'm sure that our upcomming kits will inspire the usual chorus of critical comments.
It would, however, be nice to think that there might be a little better understanding for some of the reasons that these kits will have occaisonal flaws, and that we can't just jump right out there and fix them right away.
Dave Metzner
New Product Development Manger
Moebius Models
Dave, I think your company is incredible. Thanks for the explanation; I am sure many modelers are clueless. I on the other hand have been into this hobby since 1958 and to this day i enjoy the challenge of "correcting" flaws, and basically, i take turkeys and make eagles out of them anyway; i build them MY WAY and as i said, enjoy the challenge of an "imperfect" kit. I completed a survey by SAE mag a few years back, and the question was, "Would you pay 15-20 dollars or more for a kit?" HELL YES! I understand how expenses are rising, and modeling is such a large part of my life that i will pay 50 dollars for a good kit without a second thought. It is nice to be retired and have the time and money for it...years ago with two jobs and a band playing every week, raising two kids and a manic depressive wife, i never had the time or money. Now it seems to be we are in the "Good ol'days" that will be lamented and mised in the future when they cost 100 bucks a kit...and i will STILL buy your models, as they are truly different and amazing no matter what the "rabble" says...they all have their priorities and information all wrong.
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This is a resin body, using Revell '59 sedan parts. I could write a lot about resin stuff...but I'm sure you already know this was a lot of work!!! Those who never tried one, let's say it is a challenge. And some are better than others! This one wasn't too bad, only the windshield fit was off a tad. But the chassis and 348 from the sedan fit very well. Flintstone, i think....man my memory stinks....
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The Roth car you have is the "Road Agent" I can remember seeing it when it was new on the show car circuit. It's display started the engine, revved it a couple of times, cycled the bubble top up and down, and had a recording that told the story of the car and all of its specifications.
yeah, I couldn't remember what it was called!!!!
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I have a $100.00 camera myself...the "resolution" and other quirks sometimes distort the proportions, wheels look off-center etc..be careful of camera angle..I always use "autofocus" in "close-up" mode, but most important is your lighting...I turn on every light in the room, and have a 60-watt bulb in a gooseneck light that when positioned right, makes a better photo. All my photos are taken on top of a white towel draped over a model box and tacked to the wall; makes better contrast than a dark background for me.But never give up and keep whackin; plastic and shooting photos; keep at it as experience is the best teeacher. My paddy wagon is a twin of yours only mine might be dustier!!!
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Nice! Especially like the last 3, Dr. Krook's Medicine Show, Meter Cheater and T-Bone Stake. It took me a while to find a salvageable kit of Dr. Krook's. They're pretty rare.
Every time I dig out an old rare kit, I hesitate on building it...but that is what I got them for in the first place, so they get built! After I sold 1,600 kits for $14,000.00, I realized I sold them for 8 bucks a kit more or less...so they are only worth what the buyer is willing to pay. At those prices, I will build the remaining 1,000 kits vefore i croak as a toast to those collectors who buy cheap and sell outrageous...
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I was asked what other Corvair powered things I have built...here's a few; the Revell "Gran Turismo" dune buggy, a '28 Mercedes vair rod, "Bad Medicine,", "T-Bone Stake", and "Meter Cheater" from Revell, The T-bone has the turbo option included in some AMT 'Vair kits. And I think the other one is a Roth Orbitron...it has a really cool chassis that would make a great base for a cool rod...
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Hot Rod magazine showed how to do the real conversion back in the 60's. And I've been thinking about doing it in model form for years now. Both the Karmann-Ghia and the VW buses will take the Corvair engine with no exterior body modifications.
What Ghia kit did you use? What Corvair engine? And can we see more of how you did your conversion? Did you use a Corvair or VW transaxle? I have a Tamiya Ghia that I go back and forth on doing this. But, the VW engine in that kit looks so very nice. I hate to not use it. Maybe I need to sneak a Corvair power plant into my Revell bus instead?
Scott
The kit was a Tamiya, I think. I had a resin Ghia body but then this kit came out, so i still have the rather crude resin body. I did not think to take construction photos,It uses the stock VW transaxle, which I imagine would have to be beefed up a lot in 1:1...I wonder if the "vair trans and suspension would fit? Another project perhaps! The mill is straight out of an old '69 AMT 'Vair with Webers and scratched exhaust.
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Creative and a powerplant I'd never considered......until now.
What others have you built?
Dusty P.
Revell's "Meter Cheater", "Dr. Krook's Medicine Show", and the "T-Bone Stake", all Corvair rods, a crazy loking Revell dune buggy that looks like a shrunken 'Vette (Can't remember the name) And a '29 Mercedes with a "Vair mounted in front like the dragster. Curiously enough, I do not have a Corvair on the shelf; i am anxious to get the '69 and Chezoom, add a trailer and have a Race team ala "Vair.
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Isn't that the AMT parts pack frame?
One of my projects is putting a front mounted Corvair engine in a Monogram Beer Wagon.
What transmission did you use?
Yes, you are right about the frame...I did build another rod using the Mummy..but I forgot which one! The tranny is just some old GM parts box unit! Wish I knew...but I have a lot of parts on hand I have slim idea where they came from!
Cool!
Where'd you get your decals.
All I can tell you is they were very old AMT decals. I have a large box full of them. Friends have "donated" their childhood collections to me in the past, and I never throw anything away. In one bunch were many decal sheets, but only a model trivia champ would know where they came from! The "Corvair" decal came from a 1960 3-in-1 kit. The rest are, like, ???????
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I think Stacey David's rod would have looked meaner as a coupe, meaner still chopped. I sent him a photo of this, he probably didn' t like it. I got no reply. If you try this, or any other deuce body, keep in mind they all fit this chassis...somewhat... What i liked about this issue is of course the wheels, and that Chevy engine that is accurate as they get, the hood, and exhaust setup. But to do a body swap, you must use the interior for that particular body, and expect to do a little nip and tuck to get it right! Just sayin'. I had hoped to use the cool Roaster interior, but it will not fit well in the coupe. I need to delete some old photos to make room here!
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I have a love for Corvairs, and put the motors in all sorts of things, but this is one of my faves. I got the iodea when a friend showed me a photo of a real 1:1 BLOWN Corvair mill, so, I built one using an AMT Mummy Machine frame and a lot of eyeball engineering.
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This is an older issue of the VW cabriolet...and i had an old Lola GT car in the junk, so I installed the rear subframe, suspension, and engine from the IMC Lola...it fits too! There's a radiator where the stock mill was, and the snakey exhaust runs out the back over the suspension and rad hoses. The license reads "Litemup" and I bet it would.
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Thank you kindly for the info...I did what you said and now I think I figured it out. I am new here, and obviously way too exuberant...I should know that no file on earth can contain everyone's posts...I didn't realize how huge this thing is, and will maintain my voracity henceforth! Thanks again, bro's...ignorance on my part is NOT bliss; the rules need to be followed. Roger that.
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I used a lot of the Revell custom Merc parts, like the lowered suspension, body parts, '56 Chrysler wheels, and a 302 from a '32 Ford kit.I wanted to use the louvered hood with the rounded corners, but the bodies are different at the cowl.
IT Fits! (Chezoom chassis)
in WIP: Drag Racing Models
Posted · Edited by bonehead23
I took about 1/2" from the tail, and each side had to have a slight angle cut to fit within the rear of the fenders. Also the wheelbase is a bit off in the rear, so you must trim out the wheel well according to where the wheels end up once the chassis is installed. Donot cement the rear wheels on until the body is fitted, and wheelwells are centered over the tires. Do this, and everything looks bitchin'. You may also want to cement the interior tub to the chassis before doing anything else, and finish the interior or at least secure the dashboard. This insures the tub and chassis are aligned proerly inside the body!!!! Then you can fit the rear wheels and know they will be right after paint and finishing.