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Revell '29A CHANNELED Hot Rod Roadster Quick Build Update #3 - Chassis and Interior completion, and photos of completed model...


tim boyd

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that sounds like much the same problem as software projects: the documentation and manuals are left for the last (and for those who failed to dodge the bullet to develop them) and are often incomplete and/or incorrect because no one ever actually tried to follow and verify them against the actual reality. way too much trouble. be interesting to see how quickly any corrections make it out. they might print up a little "tip in" insert to the directions like I have seen before from someone, possibly Revell

jb

 

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Starting at photo #16 at this link: http://public.fotki.com/funman1712/tim-boyd-on-line-mo/tim-boyd-on-line-mo-1/  you'll see the chassis completed, interior completed, steps to final assembly, and a number of views of the completed model. 

I finished one side of the model with the wheels and trim rings only...DSC 0069 

...while the other side includes trim rings and hubcaps, accented with the same flat red used on the finned engine accessories, as suggested by Dennis) earlier in the thread...DSC 0089.

A total of 17 fresh images and captions at the link above for your perusal and comments, such as this shot of the completed chassis, which has immense kitbashing potential for Model A and Model T-based hot rod model projects..DSC 0061.

Thanks for following along....I'll be posting some comparo photos of the Channeled and Highboy versions of the kit, photographed together, later this evening or early tomorrow.  

Cheers...TIM 

Edited by tim boyd
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Thanks for sharing again Tim...love the 46 'caps.  So I guess there's an easy 3rd version here too, a highboy using the model A frame? 

I don't care for the channeling's effect on the proportions...your idea to move the radiator back might help some, but I think it would need to be chopped to return to the over the axle location.  

Are those the largest of the 3 headlights?

Edited by mike 51
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I've been very much anticipating seeing this version done. I really like the colors you chose for it and I'm glad you thought enough of my wheel and hubcap suggestion to give it a try. B)

I prefer the hubcap'd side and this picture is my favorite. The rake is perfect and the car just lays-out right. Like a real hot rod I would much rather see a vintage spring under the back because the coil overs look completely out of character with the rest of the way the car is setup. 

DSC_0074-vi.jpgHosted on Fotki

My final thoughts about the channeled version are as follows:

- The Model A grill has got to go. It's just too antique-looking for the rest of the car. If this was a pre-War styled 4-banger powered car it would be fine but it's just not in the right flavor for the way the car is setup. It needs a '32 grill chopped about 1/8". 

- The grill and radiator are also too far forward. The grill should never be past the center line of the wheels because it makes the grill look like it's just slapped on. The huge distance between the grill and cowl is also out of proportion.

- The headlights are too high and too big. The smallest lights would have been a better choice but they're still up too high. They're also too far back relative to the grill.

- The windshield is too tall, especially for the channeled version. It needs to be 1/8" to 3/16" shorter. Basically, the top bar where the rear view mirror is now. 

It honestly looks like a well planned hot rod that the builder got in a hurry and just threw a grill and lights on at the end to make it to its first car show. Whenever I get one of these I definitely plan to build the channeled version first and correct those things I have an issue with.

Edited by Dennis Lacy
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First off, at the risk of somewhat repeating myself, the pictures of the completed OOB channeled version underscores just how valuable these straight out-of-the-box initial reviews are to the automotive modeler. One of the unique things about car modeling (shared in recent decades with the emergence of the fantasy modeling world), is that replicas are only one aspect of the richness of our hobby. These "reference builds" that you have given us, Tim, are rich with important information about what the potential of this kit is to provide each of us with the raw material for our own, personal, "right" version. For this, once again, much thanks.

I agree with Dennis regarding the issue of the grill placement, and indeed, in the case of the channeled version, whether the Model A style grill should be used at all. The headlight issues are an outgrowth of the need to place and align them with the grill as it is set up in the kit. All of this can be changed to suit the builder's tastes and is part of the fun...

The side view reveals a couple of things I will think about as I contemplate my first swing at this kit in the weeks to come. First off, it confirms what I suspected, that the raised rear wheel well arch looks most right in the channeled version and the stock height highboy variation would benefit from more body panel as provided by the lower stock arch placements. I will be curious about the compatibility of the AMT roadster shell in this regard.

Secondly, to my eye there is still too much "air" beneath the body in the channeled version. Even chopping the windshield frame won't fix that. It make me think the ideal variation will prove to be the Deuce railed highboy with a rear end z'd to raise the tires into the position they have in the channeled version. That, combined with the grill shell corrections Dennis brought up, would be a mighty fine hot rod.

DSC_0089-vi.jpg

The other approach is to further lower the highboy chassis front and rear, for a radically low channeled rod look more in line with the Red Roadster Photoshop mockup I posted earlier in Tims' highboy buildup thread. This would require both additional z-ing the of the rear end and finding a way to bring the front end down.

Perhaps these will be my two initial versions, with an attempt to combine the Revell '29A roadster kit with additional parts from the old AMT '29A roadster and some wheels, tires motor and suspension bits from my parts box to get 2 complete cars from one kit.

Again, all this initial thinking-through of my strategy is thanks to Tim's two OOB buildups since I don't as yet have a kit in my hands.

And finally, whatever my thoughts might be about my own personal "right" A-bone, the channeled version you just completed is a mighty fine little hot rod, and a fitting complement to the highboy you presented to us just a few days ago,

Thanx Tim.

Edited by Bernard Kron
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I've been very much anticipating seeing this version done. I really like the colors you chose for it and I'm glad you thought enough of my wheel and hubcap suggestion to give it a try. B)

I prefer the hubcap'd side and this picture is my favorite. The rake is perfect and the car just lays-out right. Like a real hot rod I would much rather see a vintage spring under the back because the coil overs look completely out of character with the rest of the way the car is setup. 

DSC_0074-vi.jpgHosted on Fotki

My final thoughts about the channeled version are as follows:

- The Model A grill has got to go. It's just too antique-looking for the rest of the car. If this was a pre-War styled 4-banger powered car it would be fine but it's just not in the right flavor for the way the car is setup. It needs a '32 grill chopped about 1/8". 

- The grill and radiator are also too far forward. The grill should never be past the center line of the wheels because it makes the grill look like it's just slapped on. The huge distance between the grill and cowl is also out of proportion.

- The headlights are too high and too big. The smallest lights would have been a better choice but they're still up too high. They're also too far back relative to the grill.

- The windshield is too tall, especially for the channeled version. It needs to be 1/8" to 3/16" shorter. Basically, the top bar where the rear view mirror is now. 

It honestly looks like a well planned hot rod that the builder got in a hurry and just threw a grill and lights on at the end to make it to its first car show. Whenever I get one of these I definitely plan to build the channeled version first and correct those things I have an issue with.

Dennis...thanks for posting your detaliled critique. It matches my own thoughts in a number of areas....

I fully agree on the grille shell being too far forward.  I remember noticing this on the test shots I built 18 months ago, but it is very obvious on the finished, painted model here.  It appears, however, that it may be a super-easy fix.  The radiator is what mounts to the frame, and the grille shell then mounts to the radiator.  It appears that you could section the radiator by about 1/2 its width and that would move the grille shell rearward by the same amount.  If that is indeed the case, this is a two-minute mod that will do much for the appearance. 

As for the headlamps, I had already used the smallest ones (there are three choices of headlamps in the kit) on my highboy build, so I wanted to try a different size on this build.  I ended up using the mid-sized ones.  More than the size, the biggest issue is that they are too high for a modern-era interpretation of a 1950's hot rod (they are more technically correct for a true 1950's rod where lighting laws were strictly enforced).  This is driven by the shock mounts, which are configured to support the Highboy version, and adapted for the Channeled version as a result.  Using the smallest size headlamps will help, as you pointed out, but lowering the position of the lamps is going to involve some work and adaptation.  

To the best of my knowledge, I believe that parts from this kit and an additional future version from this basic tool, are designed to allow swapping between the kits.  If this is true, the '32 shell seen on the pictures that surfaced over the summer of a purported future kit variation, would swap right onto this kit version.  As to whether you'd have to tweak the radiator to get the height correct (top of shell to align with top of roadster cowl), I couldn't say.  

Sectioning the windshield (where the top bar meets the side post) should be a very easy mod.  

Overall, it's pretty amazing to me that Revell was able to get too such different versions out of one kit - it was a masterful work of art from the kit design and tooling team.  However, it appears to me that the kit was designed around the '29A/'32 rails highboy configuration, then adapted for the second channeled version.  The result is that the channeled version is a BLAH_BLAH_BLAH_BLAH fine effort, but would benefit from some minor tweaking.  Your list above is a great place to start.  

Best...TIM

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First off, at the risk of somewhat repeating myself, the pictures of the completed OOB channeled version underscores just how valuable these straight out-of-the-box initial reviews are to the automotive modeler. One of the unique things about car modeling (shared in recent decades with the emergence of the fantasy modeling world), is that replicas are only one aspect of the richness of our hobby. These "reference builds" that you have given us, Tim, are rich with important information about what the potential of this kit is to provide each of us with the raw material for our own, personal, "right" version. For this, once again, much thanks.

I agree with Dennis regarding the issue of the grill placement, and indeed, in the case of the channeled version, whether the Model A style grill should be used at all. The headlight issues are an outgrowth of the need to place and align them with the grill as it is set up in the kit. All of this can be changed to suit the builder's tastes and is part of the fun...

The side view reveals a couple of things I will think about as I contemplate my first swing at this kit in the weeks to come. First off, it confirms what I suspected, that the raised rear wheel well arch looks most right in the channeled version and the stock height highboy variation would benefit from more body panel as provided by the lower stock arch placements. I will be curious about the compatibility of the AMT roadster shell in this regard.

Secondly, to my eye there is still too much "air" beneath the body in the channeled version. Even chopping the windshield frame won't fix that. It make me think the ideal variation will prove to be the Deuce railed highboy with a rear end z'd to raise the tires into the position they have in the channeled version. That, combined with the grill shell corrections Dennis brought up, would be a mighty fine hot rod.

DSC_0089-vi.jpg

The other approach is to further lower the highboy chassis front and rear, for a radically low channeled rod look more in line with the Red Roadster Photoshop mockup I posted earlier in Tims' highboy buildup thread. This would require both additional z-ing the of the rear end and finding a way to bring the front end down.

Perhaps these will be my two initial versions, with an attempt to combine the Revell '29A roadster kit with additional parts from the old AMT '29A roadster and some wheels, tires motor and suspension bits from my parts box to get 2 complete cars from one kit.

Again, all this initial thinking-through of my strategy is thanks to Tim's two OOB buildups since I don't as yet have a kit in my hands.

And finally, whatever my thoughts might be about my own personal "right" A-bone, the channeled version you just completed is a mighty fine little hot rod, and a fitting complement to the highboy you presented to us just a few days ago,

Thanx Tim.

Bernard...just like Dennis' critique above, I think we can learn a great deal from your observations.  

I won't repeat my observations/suggestions relative to the grille shell position and headlamps that I''ve just posted in response to Dennis' observations, but they apply equally well here.

I too am interested in exploring the AMT '29A shell which for me would make the most sense for the highboy version (where the original factory rear wheel well position would look best). But as one of you voiced earlier, I am really reluctant to give up the much better accuracy of the Revell body in the cowl area (the more accurate treatment of the separation between the side panels and the top cowl/gas tank cover here, as well as the correct body stamping below the windshield frame).  

What I would ideally like would be the AMT body, with the Revell front cowl/side area and rear wheel well area, and the Revell rear inner fender (with its more accurate side stamping) adapted to fit the AMT fender openings.  As to whether this could be accomplished without huge amounts of work, I do not know.  

Bernard, as I've mentioned before, I highly value your perspective because of how many "reet on" 1/25th scale hot rod builds you've posted before.  And personally, I can't wait to see your interpretation(s) of this new Revell kit.  

Best...TIM 

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Thanks for sharing again Tim...love the 46 'caps.  So I guess there's an easy 3rd version here too, a highboy using the model A frame? 

I don't care for the channeling's effect on the proportions...your idea to move the radiator back might help some, but I think it would need to be chopped to return to the over the axle location.  

Are those the largest of the 3 headlights?

Mike....I think a highboy using the Model A frame is indeed a possibility.  Maybe you could use the Highboy interior and the Z'ed Model A Frame to get the Highboy/A frame configuration. (Hmmm....maybe I should give that a try?)  

These are the middle of the three headlamp sizes.  I used the smallest ones on the Highboy build.  

Best,  TIM  

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Mike....I think a highboy using the Model A frame is indeed a possibility.  Maybe you could use the Highboy interior and the Z'ed Model A Frame to get the Highboy/A frame configuration. (Hmmm....maybe I should give that a try?)  

These are the middle of the three headlamp sizes.  I used the smallest ones on the Highboy build.  

Best,  TIM  

Mike...following up on your idea, I pieced this together this morning.  Only a slight modification to the bottom of the Highboy version inner fender wells (to create clearance for the Model A frame at the back, which is slightly wider than the narrowed '32 frame) is required to make your suggestion of a Highboy version using the '29A Z'ed chassis a go!    Best Regards...TIM 

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I think the channeled version needs a major altitude change.

the funny thing is, it looks to me like the high boy version is actually lower looking than the channeled version. the channeled version is channeled, but its like the frame was brought up instead of the body being brought down. its also a factor of those large tires front and rear but I knew from the first I saw that frame that the Z was not going to be adequate to do much for the frame height. its more of a step than a Z.

but probably with a more radical drop front axle, putting some more Z into that Z, and smaller diameter tires, that is going to be looking very nice. I also see potential for those patina decals but maybe over some dremeling or crusty build up.

jb

 

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Secondly, to my eye there is still too much "air" beneath the body in the channeled version. Even chopping the windshield frame won't fix that. It make me think the ideal variation will prove to be the Deuce railed highboy with a rear end z'd to raise the tires into the position they have in the channeled version. That, combined with the grill shell corrections Dennis brought up, would be a mighty fine hot rod.

I absolutely agree that there is too much "air" under the car. This is a problem with channeled cars if the chassis doesn't sit low.

For comparison, here's the side view of a channeled AMT '29 Roadster that I built some years back. The back of the frame is stepped several times more than the new Revell kit frame and the front axle is from the modern tool Ala Kart with the spring from the '29 Roadster stock front axle glued on top of it. The spring is really flat compared to the new kit spring.

Hosted on Fotki

Also, what's killing the front ride height of the new kit (both frames) is how far down the center of the front cross member is below the frame rails. Somewhat accurate for a stock '32 frame but not a Model A. It's obvious that the reason Revell did the cross member the way they did was so they could fit a reasonable sized radiator. 

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I'm loving reading the above posts. I don't know how much of it I'll be using, but I sure am learning a lot. About both model and real street/hot rods. There is some great knowledge and insight going on here. This thread is just plain good reading. None of the personal BS. I'm like it! Thanks guys.

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I absolutely agree that there is too much "air" under the car. This is a problem with channeled cars if the chassis doesn't sit low.

For comparison, here's the side view of a channeled AMT '29 Roadster that I built some years back. The back of the frame is stepped several times more than the new Revell kit frame and the front axle is from the modern tool Ala Kart with the spring from the '29 Roadster stock front axle glued on top of it. The spring is really flat compared to the new kit spring.

IMG_7324-vi.jpgHosted on Fotki

Also, what's killing the front ride height of the new kit (both frames) is how far down the center of the front cross member is below the frame rails. Somewhat accurate for a stock '32 frame but not a Model A. It's obvious that the reason Revell did the cross member the way they did was so they could fit a reasonable sized radiator. 

Dennis that is a gorgeous and righteous hot rod model, my friend!  Great job!   TIM 

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