Amt 36 Ford?

[Don Sikora II]

Man, I didn't remember seeing one with the slots before. Going to have to dig out my box of early '36 Ford parts and see if I have any!

[Flat32]

If I had one of these actual rims I could make a CAD model in about two hours. The wheel hub in another two and print them in the normal model scales. Printed could easily be refined into resin mold masters.

Your pictured plastic model representations are rather poor IMHO.

[Ace-Garageguy]

24 minutes ago, Flat32 said:

If I had one of these actual rims I could make a CAD model in about two hours. The wheel hub in another two and print them in the normal model scales. Printed could easily be refined into resin mold masters.

Your pictured plastic model representations are rather poor IMHO.

Plenty of usable images on the web. Figure 16" diameter at the tire-bead seating area. Extrapolate the rest of the dimensions. Should be absolutely good enough, considering how arithmetic-challenged even the major manufacturers are today.

[Lordmodelbuilder]

1 hour ago, Flat32 said:

If I had one of these actual rims I could make a CAD model in about two hours. The wheel hub in another two and print them in the normal model scales. Printed could easily be refined into resin mold masters.

Your pictured plastic model representations are rather poor IMHO.

I took the pics of the models with my cell phone. I will get a better pic this weekend. I have 3-1936 Fords & they all have those wheels.

I have no problem letting someone use one to cast them.

[Ace-Garageguy]

17 minutes ago, Lordmodelbuilder said:

...I have 3-1936 Fords & they all have those wheels.

I have no problem letting someone use one to cast them.

Are any of yours perfect?

Usually there's some edge damage on the non-slot wheels, and there's often buggers and flaws in the parts themselves...which is why I always look at the wheels first whenever I get an AMT '36 in any condition.

I have a miniature mill and lathe in case some pattern work needs to be done prior to taking molds.

[Flat32]

Master models that are made by reverse engineering from a factory blueprint or actual item are best and easily done.  Reverse engineering from photos is more like work and usually compromised on accuracy.  FreeCad, free download software,  allows you to import a photo and trace over it.  Problem with the wheel is no cross section of the center.  

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

Not to worry. I have access to real ones. 

And...I located and purchased two virgin molded-in-gray complete kits last night. They'll be in my hot little hands this coming week.

Edited January 12, 2019 by Ace-Garageguy

[espo]

Another use for the non slotted wheels would be for a VW type 1. I built a copy of a long ago dune buggy I had. The 1:1 used the stock VW wheels in front and widened VW wheels in the rear. This was based on a '57 chassis so it had the wide 5 wheels. The '36 Ford kit wheels maybe a little out of scale but not so you would notice. So if someone was building a VW and wanted an exposed wheel with no hub cap these look the part. 

[tim boyd]

On ‎1‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 9:46 PM, 68shortfleet said:

Not that this answers your question. Does your 61 kit molded in gray have wide 5 artillery style wheels? The black ones should have wide 5 wheels but not the artillery style.

Basically, I have been told that the first issue of this kit had the artillery wheels, and none of the kits since them got those wheels.

Jason....thanks for asking that question!  I never had a clue about on this....

I just looked in my stash where I have two new (old) first issue AMT '36 Fords.  One cast in gray, the other in black.  And lo and behold....both have the Artillery wheels.  I didn't see any overt tool damage on them, but they were not the clean castings we expect today, either.   

These are both pristine, unused kits and I don't want to part them out....but somewhere I have a box of gluebomb  AMT '36 Ford first issue parts......if I can find it, and if one of those parts is the Artillery wheel, and it looks in good condition, maybe I (we) could talk Norm into casting some? 

TIM 

[Dave Darby]

My guess is that the slots went away around the time the chopped coupe went away. But I could be wrong. Just for posterity,  the original issue was also molded in light blue. Unfortunately my example is incomplete and missing the wheels.

[Greg Myers]

When did this "Artillery wheel" thing start ?

Edited January 13, 2019 by Greg Myers

[Mark]

You'd think more of these wheels would be floating around in parts boxes...but no!  With that first issue, the stock wheels were used regardless of which version was built.  Unless the builder used wheels from another kit, those wheels wound up on the built model, more often than not with the custom caps glued onto them.

Early kits were indeed molded in blue, too: someone I contacted looking for an early wheel did turn up a light blue one with the slot detail.  Unfortunately, like my gray one, it has tooling damage in the detail area. 

[Lordmodelbuilder]

Here's a few more pics of my gray & black 36 Ford wheels. None seem all that perfect in the slot/spoke area.

Can't hardly see with the naked eye,but bad spots show with Macro camera setting.

A-G Bill, let me know when you get those 36 kits. If the wheels are not there,I will gladly give you a set of 4.

[Casey]

I picked up the '86(?) AMT/Ertl #6591 issue of the '36 Ford, took pics of the contents (which can be viewed here: http://modelkitreviews.proboards.com/thread/1142/25-amt-ertl-6591-ford ), and I wondered about a few few changes I noticed which had not been mentioned in this topic:

1) The custom rear license plate surround had the "1936" removed at some point. A small change, inconsequential change which nobody likely minded. 

2) When was the 6x2 carb and intake option eliminated? It was definitely not included in the '74(?) Street Rods issue, but was still present in the T243 Gasser (cartoon art) issue. 

3) Has the 3x2 option for the Pontiac V8 been present in every issue?

4) Was the Dick Tracy issue from 1990 the first to include the 5-window top section?? I've seen another (unknown) issue molded in white, which included the 5-window top, but the most recent reissue does not include the 5-window top section.

5) Is the Dick Tracy issue body, with the altered door cut lines, correct for a roadster?

[Can-Con]

43 minutes ago, Casey said:

I picked up the '86(?) AMT/Ertl #6591 issue of the '36 Ford, took pics of the contents (which can be viewed here: http://modelkitreviews.proboards.com/thread/1142/25-amt-ertl-6591-ford ), and I wondered about a few few changes I noticed which had not been mentioned in this topic:

1) The custom rear license plate surround had the "1936" removed at some point. A small change, inconsequential change which nobody likely minded. 

2) When was the 6x2 carb and intake option eliminated? It was definitely not included in the '74(?) Street Rods issue, but was still present in the T243 Gasser (cartoon art) issue. 

3) Has the 3x2 option for the Pontiac V8 been present in every issue?

4) Was the Dick Tracy issue from 1990 the first to include the 5-window top section?? I've seen another (unknown) issue molded in white, which included the 5-window top, but the most recent reissue does not include the 5-window top section.

5) Is the Dick Tracy issue body, with the altered door cut lines, correct for a roadster?

I can answer a couple of those .

Yes, the "Dick Tracy" kit was the first 5 window issue and the door length is correct for a roadster. Also, I understand that it was a "stock only" issue but not having one. I'm not %100 sure on that. If so, no Pontiac engine.

[EDIT found pics of an open Tracy kit on e-bay, definitely stock only, no optional parts at all.]

As for the 6X2s, I don't know which ones don't have it but my 5-window on the previous page has them. It was built from a newer kit with the black car on the box top. and looking at pics of the parts layout on e-bay of the kit with the silver and pink car, they're in there too.

Edited February 24, 2019 by Can-Con

[Casey]

26 minutes ago, Can-Con said:

I can answer a couple of those .

Yes, the "Dick Tracy" kit was the first 5 window issue and the door length is correct for a roadster. Also, I understand that it was a "stock only" issue but not having one. I'm not %100 sure on that. If so, no Pontiac engine.

[EDIT found pics of an open Tracy kit on e-bay, definitely stock only, no optional parts at all.]

As for the 6X2s, I don't know which ones don't have it but my 5-window on the previous page has them. It was built from a newer kit with the black car on the box top. and looking at pics of the parts layout on e-bay of the kit with the silver and pink car, they're in there too.

Thanks, Steve. I found a YouTube video for the AMT/Ertl "Classics" kit with the black car on the box art (#31540), and the 6x2 parts and the custom grille insert are present, but the lakes pipes and roadster windshield frame are not:

 

...and the custom grille shell insert has been moved, too:

 

...but the most recent reissue has it moved back to where it originally(?) was located (Tim's pic):

[Bernard Kron]

18 minutes ago, Can-Con said:

I can answer a couple of those .

Yes, the "Dick Tracy" kit was the first 5 window issue and the door length is correct for a roadster....

...

I need to correct this. The '36 Ford Roadster has a longer door length which it shares with the 3-window coupe. When ERTL/AMT introduced the 5-window they moved the door line to represent the short door length of this model, which was used on the Club Cabriolet Convertible version (roll up windows and A-pillars extending from the doors) of the open air '36 Ford. So, if you want to build a Roadster version (snap in side curtains and separate windscreen) you need to either re-draw the 5-window door lines, or , more easily, start with the 3-window coupe version.

 

[Can-Con]

2 minutes ago, Bernard Kron said:

I need to correct this. The '36 Ford Roadster has a longer door length which it shares with the 3-window coupe. When ERTL/AMT introduced the 5-window they moved the door line to represent the short door length of this model, which was used on the Club Cabriolet Convertible version (roll up windows and A-pillars extending from the doors) of the open air '36 Ford. So, if you want to build a Roadster version (snap in side curtains and separate windscreen) you need to either re-draw the 5-window door lines, or , more easily, start with the 3-window coupe version.

 

Ah, yes, I see. 

I had thought the roadster had the shorter doors. wrong.

and I can't even go back and correct my original post now. 

[Muncie]

Before anyone starts cutting new door lines - Five window coupe and roadster have the same door opening dimension and the shorter doors.  Three window coupe, cabriolet and 2-door sedan have the same door opening dimension and the longer doors.  I believe the door opening dimension is at the beltline.  The perceived door length is affected by the angle of the car in the most photographs.

Back to the source, Reference Ford literature from 1936...

Door opening dimension:

Tudor Sedan    40 inches

Cabriolet     40 inches

Three-Window Coupe    40 inches

Five-Window coupe    34-1/4"

Roadster     34-1/4"

 

Edited February 24, 2019 by Muncie

[dino246gt]

Here's how I made the chopped 3 window roof fit better:

First picture shows the side body line where the roof part is proud at the rear and the opposite at the front.

Second picture shows after I sliced the body to allow me to fit scrap styrene into that slot as a wedge to keep the body lined up.

Third pic shows the consistent reveal of the body line from rear of kit roof to front.

I guess it would've been easier before I glued the roof on, but either way, it works.

 

[Casey]

On 1/11/2019 at 9:23 AM, Mark said:

AMT probably caught that early on, and altered the tooling to eliminate the slots.

I thought the little semi-circular lines I saw were remnants of the vent holes (left wheel, below), but they seem to be too far toward the outside diameter. There is also some damage (mold corrosion?) around the lips of some of the wheels, too:

Edited February 24, 2019 by Casey

[Don Sikora II]

On 2/23/2019 at 7:34 PM, Casey said:

 

...and the custom grille shell insert has been moved, too:

 

...but the most recent reissue has it moved back to where it originally(?) was located (Tim's pic):

The part probably wasn’t moved in the mold. My guess is that the shot was cut on opposite sides of the part in the two pictures. 

[Casey]

14 hours ago, Don Sikora II said:

The part probably wasn’t moved in the mold. My guess is that the shot was cut on opposite sides of the part in the two pictures. 

 Now I see it. Thanks, Don.

[ChrisBcritter]

Got my one good '36 wheel cut down to make a master of the center; now to pick up some of the pink rubber to make an undercut mold:

One of these days I'll use them to make a more correct '39 Deluxe sedan.

[Oldcarfan27]

On 11/24/2015 at 11:09 AM, Art Anderson said:

 With all of this in mind, when critiquing kits of that now long-ago era, it's only fair to keep this in mind, when viewing them from the point of view of living in this digital age.

Fair enough, but even in this "digital age" toolmakers are still making many goofs in the accuracy department. Which I'm finding inexcusable when there is so much reference material available.