NEW! An advance and detailed look at the final production version of the new Moebius Models 1961 Pontiac Ventura kit....

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Well, have a look at Tim's shot of the front bumper on the tree -

and you can see little blank areas for those signal lights. Hard to tell for sure, but it looks like there might be some light detail engraving there.  See your point about the headlight bezels; that's one well within my tolerance levels, personally, but maybe not for others.  Noticed that body color strip right off, but that may come down to painting.  While the hood "brow" trim may be molded a bit thick for scale, the foil job on those areas definitely exaggerates the effect on the boxcover model.

I loved that AMT Catalina at first, but I found the body withering a bit under scrutiny, mostly in a certain slab-sided aspect along the flanks, lower belt line to rocker specifically.  There's a whiff of that about this Ventura too, but what I think I'm seeing I'm hard-pressed to confirm till I have the actual shell in hand - it certainly seems better overall than the AMT kit. 

[Harry P.]

Looks to me like they missed the front turn signal lenses altogether...

[MrObsessive]

One thing Chuck that is rather conspicuous by its absence, is the Pontiac script that should be on the lower part of the grille on the driver's side. Not a deal breaker for me by any means, but something that would be nice if Moebius could fix this. 

If not, there's bound to be a PE set down the road.

 

Edited December 2, 2015 by MrObsessive

[mike 51]

Looks to me like they missed the front turn signal lenses altogether...

Seems like they need a new "final approval" guy(s).....someone there seems to be in too big a hurry!

[Chuck Kourouklis]

There are signal light blanks on the corners of the bumper, which maybe you're just presumed to paint white, but yup, no lenses on tree or instruction sheet (actually, translucent strips for these probably wouldn't be bad to include on the decal sheet).

And you're absolutely right, Bill.  Maybe a black script outline taken from a photo, printed onto clear decal stock and applied over a script-shaped piece of foil, might be an interim solution for thems what cain't hold out for MCG.

[wallyk 50]

It could be either one.  Most Pontiac V8s looked pretty much the same externally.  Heads and intake evolved over the years.
(This is a GENERAL comment.  I know there were lots of changes later, but the basic architecture remained the same)

Unless you have casting numbers you cannot tell them apart.

I will be picking up at least 2 of these, drove a 61 Star Chief in high school.  I am really impressed by the quality and details in this kit.  I sure hope you guys have a good business model, like to see this level of kits around for a long while.

Tim, thanks for the preview.

Wally

[Harry P.]

Seems like they need a new "final approval" guy(s).....someone there seems to be in too big a hurry!

I hate to dump on Moebius, because they really are doing good things, and they really do listen to us. But with all the eyeballs on a new kit in process, I just don't get how something so obvious as the front turn signal lenses get left off... and nobody notices?

I noticed. Immediately. And I agree with Casey's list. So how is it that a guy like me, just a "civilian" with no model kit manufacturing experience, notices stuff that apparently got past the eyes of all the "experts?" I just don't get it.

[tim boyd]

I just looked closely at the turn signal area of the front bumper. 

The forward facing turn signal surfaces appear to be represented in the casting (not as a clear lense, but as a plated, lightly recessed surface).  The recessed surfaces do not continue round the corners (as a recessed surface) to the sides of the bumper., as the 1/1 scale pictures clearly show.  

However, it would take a modestly experienced builder about two minutes to accurately paint the surfaces - front and sides - with silver/white paint that approximates the appearance of a pre-1963 model year turn signal lenses.  My view is that this is a really minor point of concern, and very easy to fix.  Others may see it differently.   

Certainly everyone is welcome to their opinion/view as long as they have their facts correct.  

On the other hand, it is also important to keep in mind the context of any potential "issues" relative to the overall technical achievement and finished appearance of any kit.  

TIM 

 

   

[Harry P.]

I agree it's not a big deal to fix. Almost anything wrong with a model can be fixed if you want to put in the effort and have the skill to do it. The real question isn't how easy it is to fix the mistake, but how the mistake made it to production. Again, not to bash Moebius... I think they are doing fantastic things and I applaud them big time. But how some of these obvious mistakes make it to production (not only with Moebius, but all the manufacturers) is puzzling.

[tim boyd]

Harry...these days these model kits are largely reflect the effort of just a few dedicated people, unlike the large teams that used to be at Monogram, AMT, et al.   This is particularly the case at Moebius and Round 2.  Not to mention the challenges of overseas suppliers, 12-13 hour time differences, language barriers, etc.  I won't make excuses for the companies here, but from my own personal point of view, I am sometimes amazed at just how much they get right given the challenges they face today.  

Best...TIM 

[Dave Metzner]

How do these OBVIOUS mistakes get made?

OBVIOUS? Those turn signal lenses in 1/25 scale are about 2x4 mm.

The product development staff and the "final approval guy" that we employ here at Moebius (those all would be me) failed to notice that the parking lights were missing, along with the Pontiac script badge on the grille!  Also several of my helpers, these are folks that I know and trust who I send test shots to for them to review also failed to spot those omissions.

Honestly, I do my best to pay attention to every detail of each kit that I'm working on, but, I do screw up every so often, and that is how obvious mistakes are made!

 

 

Edited December 4, 2015 by Dave Metzner

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Well I'm pulling hard for this one, Dave, and I ain't gonna skip it for those omissions by any means.

But if I may offer one polite little suggestion here: seems to me both of these issues could be at least partially corrected with a couple additions to the decal sheet...

[Dave Metzner]

Corrections are in the works.. seems those details are same for all 61 Pontiac Catalinas and Venturas..It'll get fixed for next version...

 

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Good show, and thanks.

[unclescott58]

How do these OBVIOUS mistakes get made?

OBVIOUS? Those turn signal lenses in 1/25 scale are about 2x4 mm.

The product development staff and the "final approval guy" that we employ here at Moebius (those all would be me) failed to notice that the parking lights were missing, along with the Pontiac script badge on the grille!  Also several of my helpers, these are folks that I know and trust who I send test shots to for them to review also failed to spot those omissions.

Honestly, I do my best to pay attention to every detail of each kit that I'm working on, but, I do screw up every so often, and that is how obvious mistakes are made!

 

 

Mistakes or not, I'm still going to buy one. It's a nice looking kit. Very small turn signals and a missing Pontiac script aren't enough to keep me away from what looks like a go looking kit. Thanks for bringing us the great kits that you do Dave. And thank you for your willingness to correct mistakes when they're found.

[charlie8575]

This looks like a really nice kit with very fine detailing and the subject is very interesting too. I will have to get me a couple of these for sure.

But... There is one huge problem with this kit and I can't understand why as this kit is otherwise so good and looks like the guys at Moebius have actually planned how to make it easy to build...Other than this spot. The windows. Why oh why they have that chrome trim molded in them?! Same thing is wrong with the Ford Pickups, but these windows are even harder to BMF as the window has some more shapes on it. One little slip while you're foiling those windows will ruin them and then you have to buy new windows, or a completely new kit. That is a mile-long minus in my eyes on an otherwise super fine kit... Why it is done this way?

I will be buying at least one of them, but I just hope I don't have to order replacement windows more than once.

Use painter's or Tamiya tape beneath the mouldings. That'll catch errant modeling knives. Remove and give it a quick wipe-down if there's any residue left. 

Charlie Larkin

[gtx6970]

How do these OBVIOUS mistakes get made?

OBVIOUS? Those turn signal lenses in 1/25 scale are about 2x4 mm.

The product development staff and the "final approval guy" that we employ here at Moebius (those all would be me) failed to notice that the parking lights were missing, along with the Pontiac script badge on the grille!  Also several of my helpers, these are folks that I know and trust who I send test shots to for them to review also failed to spot those omissions.

Honestly, I do my best to pay attention to every detail of each kit that I'm working on, but, I do screw up every so often, and that is how obvious mistakes are made!

 

 

My hats off to the entire team involved. I will be buying SEVERAL . I have an original issue 61 Bonneville and this will look right at home next to it . ( I want to pick up a 65 Satellite but the wife says I am not allowed to buy anything till after Christmas )

NOW,,,,,, What I really want is the 65 Comet . so chop chop

 

this is my 2 cents worth . BUT  IMO, it might be a good idea to send one or several to someone (maybe even several people )  familiar with the subject at hand. Even then the chances of missing something is possibile, its called human error . And kudos to all involved to acting on making revisions even though they be minor

[modelercarl]

How do these OBVIOUS mistakes get made?

OBVIOUS? Those turn signal lenses in 1/25 scale are about 2x4 mm.

The product development staff and the "final approval guy" that we employ here at Moebius (those all would be me) failed to notice that the parking lights were missing, along with the Pontiac script badge on the grille!  Also several of my helpers, these are folks that I know and trust who I send test shots to for them to review also failed to spot those omissions.

Honestly, I do my best to pay attention to every detail of each kit that I'm working on, but, I do screw up every so often, and that is how obvious mistakes are made!

 

 

Dave,

I give you a lot of credit for monitoring and commenting on this board after some of the ridiculous comments posted by members.  The post about OBVIOUS mistakes is a classic example.....the obvious did not become apparent until pointed out by someone else and then it gets beat to death with repeated references.

This is a HOBBY!  I think that Moebius (and you in particular) are producing some very interesting kits that very rewarding to build.  If the OBVIOUS mistake on the Pontiac kit is the front parking light is missing, I'm happy to fix that myself.

Thank you for your dedication.

[W-409]

Use painter's or Tamiya tape beneath the mouldings. That'll catch errant modeling knives. Remove and give it a quick wipe-down if there's any residue left. 

Charlie Larkin

That's a good idea Charlie, thanks! It lowers the risk of ruining the glass for sure.

Even if I don't like that chrome trim being molded to windows, I think this will be a great kit. I see at least one coming to my way that would be built as a Super Stock car.

[John Goschke]

Well, since I'll be building a mild custom out of one of mine, the omission of the "Pontiac" script on the grill is a good thing! The parking light issue a relatively easy fix with a little pearl white and a brush. Or if I really feel ambitious, a piece of clear plastic could be notched into the bumper.

I think the amount of body-colored sheet metal revealed between body and grill should be adjustable with some judicious cutting and repositioning.

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Dave,

I give you a lot of credit for monitoring and commenting on this board after some of the ridiculous comments posted by members.  The post about OBVIOUS mistakes is a classic example.....the obvious did not become apparent until pointed out by someone else and then it gets beat to death with repeated references.

This is a HOBBY!  I think that Moebius (and you in particular) are producing some very interesting kits that very rewarding to build.  If the OBVIOUS mistake on the Pontiac kit is the front parking light is missing, I'm happy to fix that myself.

Thank you for your dedication.

And here we are with this. Again.

You state "this is a HOBBY", as if that's some kind of absolute - as if "hobby" means the same thing to everybody, or as if YOUR way of seeing a hobby is the only valid one. But it's not. And as long as it isn't, you have NO objective basis to make sweeping declarations about what's "ridiculous".

Different hobbyists have different expectations, but the one constant is that a model is supposed to match a reference, that one of the very points of a discussion forum like this is to discuss where models don't, and that yes, missing grille scripts and signal lights are pretty obvious to some folks.

In my personal scheme of things, one is an easy fix and the other, only a little trickier.  But you're not gonna catch me acting like somebody with his pull-ups all in a bunch raining high and mighty judgment all over the grownups who want to discuss these problems frankly, just 'cause I personally have a lock on the problems. If any behavior is objectively wrong in these forums, that kind of conduct comes a lot closer than criticizing kits.

 

[modelercarl]

I am really curious......all my life I have referred to building model kits as being a hobby.  Everybody else that I have ever discussed building kits with has referred to it as a hobby.  Brick and mortar stores that sell/sold model kits were hobby shops.  If this is wrong, please enlighten me and I will refrain from referring to the practice of building up styrene, and resin kits as models being "a hobby".  What else should it be called?

[Casey]

Corrections are in the works.. seems those details are same for all 61 Pontiac Catalinas and Venturas..It'll get fixed for next version...

Might as well spill the beans about that next version right away...  

I think most of us realize publicly sharing a test shot or pre-final production version of a kit can be a bit of a risk, but here's hoping the benefits continue to outweigh any negatives when it comes to increased accuracy and scale fidelity on the final product. Being willing to listen to criticism, regardless if it's taken to heart or not, is always a good sign from any manufacturer.

[Brett Barrow]

Might as well spill the beans about that next version right away...  

I think most of us realize publicly sharing a test shot or pre-final production version of a kit can be a bit of a risk, but here's hoping the benefits continue to outweigh any negatives when it comes to increased accuracy and scale fidelity on the final product. Being willing to listen to criticism, regardless if it's taken to heart or not, is always a good sign from any manufacturer.

Catalina is next, I believe...   I'm out of the loop, my old source retired.   I like it better that way, not knowing, I had to keep my mouth shut about the Revell Model A's for at least 3 years...  Was not fun! 

[Ron Hamilton]

Sometimes, things get past the best of us. I have been building for over 50 years, and I will miss something, despite my best effort.I do not mind if someone makes a constructive comment, or points out the omission. One suggestion I have is if the grille emblem and parking lamp problem can be taken care of with a decal, or another part, furnish the modeler with the piece at no charge, with a proof of purchase, such as the upc code. 

I applauded Revell when they took care of the Pro Modeler '69 Charger, and Moebius when they offered the decals for the Hudson Hornet Air Cleaners.

Not every modeler will have a problem, but for those that has the problem, I think this could be an acceptable resolution.