eBay, Old Kit, Parts & Pieces Pricing, Who's to Blame?

[StevenGuthmiller]

As a longtime eBay buyer and seller, I always enjoy these threads. 

Yep, most of us real model people know the reasonable eBay parts sellers and deal with them.  And the unreasonable types? The Certified Anteek & Junque peddlers who want $17.95 for the tires from a recent reissue (plus $12 shipping, what a deal!  And no combined shipping!)?

I just read those listings for entertainment value only and have a good laugh at them.

That especially applies to one notorious seller whose name usually pops up in these threads. Though I have to say, I would not deal with that guy no matter what the price.  His eBay listings tend to be long multi-font, multi-color rants against his own potential customers.  He frankly comes off as a little unhinged.

In a recent listing/rant, he griped about eBay buyers with "entitlement issues." HA! Mr. Pot, meet Mr. Kettle.

I agree.

Most of us who are avid builders can instantly smell the difference between a legitimate auction & someone looking for a sucker.

I don't mind paying a reasonable price for a kit or a part, hell, I will occasionally pay more than I should if it's something I really want or need.

Just today I happened upon a 1963 Ford pickup that was a complete gluebomb that the seller was asking $125.00 for!

Uh.....not in this lifetime!

You could most likely get an unbuilt kit for less than that!

 

Steve 

[gtx6970]

I agree.

Most of us who are avid builders can instantly smell the difference between a legitimate auction & someone looking for a sucker.

I don't mind paying a reasonable price for a kit or a part, hell, I will occasionally pay more than I should if it's something I really want or need.

Just today I happened upon a 1963 Ford pickup that was a complete gluebomb that the seller was asking $125.00 for!

Uh.....not in this lifetime!

You could most likely get an unbuilt kit for less than that!

 

Steve 

Agreed, I've seen the ' looking for a sucker '  sellers a few times and just chuckle a bit  when I do .  

Although I  have no problem paying up to get something I REALLY want but i am not going to get to crazy .

 

Steve,

I' have been casuallly keeping an eye on some of the early pickups ( I keep telliing my toy fund I need some of them,,,but it keeps telling me NO  I don't  )

But  decent builders run in the $50 - $60 range and up depending on whos after it ,,,IMO  Not likely an unbuilt will be under $100

[StevenGuthmiller]

Agreed, I've seen the ' looking for a sucker '  sellers a few times and just chuckle a bit  when I do .  

Although I  have no problem paying up to get something I REALLY want but i am not going to get to crazy .

 

Steve,

I' have been casuallly keeping an eye on some of the early pickups ( I keep telliing my toy fund I need some of them,,,but it keeps telling me NO  I don't  )

But  decent builders run in the $50 - $60 range and up depending on whos after it ,,,IMO  Not likely an unbuilt will be under $100

You're probably correct about an unbuilt kit.

There's a pristine in the box '63 Ford kit on the bay right now with a starting bid of $150.00 & a buy it now price of $195.00.

Too rich for me!

I'm not sure I'd call him a "sucker hunter" but I've seen them go for less than that.

The '63 Ford That I rebuilt was an unpainted & unmolested built up kit that I got for less than $60.00.

Not the best deal in the world, but it was the next best thing to an unbuilt.

I'm still quietly on the hunt for a '60 Ford pickup.

 

Steve

[ChrisBcritter]

so true..that ELO stripping product..to me and my experience makes plastic brittle and easily broken.

I've had better luck getting the bulk of the paint off with purple stuff and using a small amount of the ELO for a final scrub (with a toothbrush or a bristle brush in a Dremel) to loosen the last residue, then a final slosh in the purple stuff and rinse it all off.

[ChrisBcritter]

I'm still quietly on the hunt for a '60 Ford pickup.

Me too - I'm trying to think of a tactful way to buy back the '60 I gave to a friend when I moved back here.

[SfanGoch]

Me too - I'm trying to think of a tactful way to buy back the '60 I gave to a friend when I moved back here.

There really isn't a tactful way to do it. You're gonna look like a piker no matter how you go about it.

[charlie8575]

That old kits, parts, or builders are expensive, has always been this way and something I accept as a collector. Show me something about this hobby that is cheap.
I dislike the practice of disassembling complete builders to offer the individual components, since it is impossible to win all the auctions to get it complete again.
Nothing wrong with parting incomplete models and selling the components, though.

This I agree with as a matter of principle.

What some of those guys do deprives the rest of us from a chance to make something uniquely our own. 

Charlie Larkin

[Art Anderson]

I don't doubt the veracity of whether or not plastic can become brittle over time, everything deteriorates with age, including me.

I've just not seen it myself.

I've bought probably 40 kits in the past 3 years, all produced prior to 1969, most of them prior to '61, & I have seen no deterioration that I can detect.

I guess my point is, if brittle plastic is the main reason that you would be dissuaded from buying vintage kits, I don't think I'd worry about it a whole lot.

Or at least it would be very low on my radar.

 

Steve

One thing to keep in mind here, it seems to me:   While someone else's practices when marketing old kits on say, eBay, may disappoint, even anger others, whatever it is that person is offering up is his/her property.  When last I looked, anything that I own (or you all own!) is your's to do with as I (and you) wish, with no questions optional (barring anything illegal or immoral).

And, that goes with such things as the model car kits and related stuff we all want to enjoy.  If that means that someone is willing to "part out" a kit, even to the disgust or down right anger of others, it seems to me that is that seller's right to do so; and thus not really worthy of criticism based on the premise that someone else has been deprived of the opportunity to buy that kit (or old builtup) intact for themselves.

In short, I am reminded of that old and trite cliche' from my boyhood years, which while probably not quite correct, goes "Possession is 9-points of the Law"--which old schoolboy pronouncement does seem to support what I said immediately above.  I may well be as disappointed that someone else is parting out a desirable old model car kit that I'd love to have to build--but it's his, not mine, and it's his decision as how best to dispose of it for cash.

Art

[Junkman]

Although all of this is of course factually correct and a total mirror of today's globalist mindset, one could have a slightly more old-fashioned point of view.
Despite we all have our bills and mortgage to pay and families to feed, win at the stock market and shovel as much money aside as we possibly can, since whoever has more money, is the better person,
there might still be some value left in non materialistic things, although few people nowadays can remember that.

What if you just sacrifice a few Dollars by not taking that model apart and sell its components individually?
You might give another man the immense pleasure to obtain the model he has been looking for for so long. You anticipate, that he will cherish it and bring it back to life.
You know, that once he is done with it, another example is alive and well and preserved for all who see it to enjoy.

Am I really the only one, who can actually get some pleasure out of this? Despite I'm not 'rich'?

I have never charged anyone a Penny when I was able to supply some parts he was looking for in the Wanted thread, not even for postage.
I have given people mint annuals free of charge, because it was one of the few missing in their collection and I thought it's better for someone to have them all.

Sometimes, a human's responsibility to help to preserve something that otherwise would be lost forever is simply superior to his superficial greed for money.

OK, one could argue that parting out an old model helps more people to complete theirs, but this is usually not the motivating factor, hence I find it morally inferior.

 

[gtx6970]

When I was over his place a few weeks back , I asked where he gets his inventory . His reply was probably  90% of the items Ebay  seller Floyd426 sells , he bought either as a complete  kit or part of an entire collection . He purchased off of Ebay. So a buyer who wanted it whole already had there chance to buy it as such . .Like it or not,,,,, Anyone can call it anything they want. BUT,,,IMO , his cash = he is free to do with it as he wishes . I have no problem with it in any way shape or form

 

Edited December 18, 2015 by gtx6970

[Tom Geiger]

Christian, there are many more sides to your argument. Let's say I sell that rare old kit... and I don't even try to make a fortune on it. So I sell it at a reasonable price to someone in the name of the hobby... then that person just thinks "sucker!" and pops it on eBay for a few hundred dollars?

Then there are people in this hobby that think it's sacrilege to break the shrink wrap on a sealed kit.  So I feel that way and I sell my perfect sealed kit to someone who immediately opens the kit, ruining that "mint sealed kit" status?

Then we have unbuilt kits that aren't sealed... and those who believe they should be collected that way...  I buy their kit and I actually (horrors!) build it?!   Then we get down to the quality of the intended build... are only those who can turn out a show quality model allowed to build these kits?  Isn't it destroying and wasting that cherished kit if some guy builds it with brush paint and Testors tube glue all over the glass?

As far as parting out kits, I do as you do... if someone needs a part I have for a build, I happily donate and pay the postage.  I have the remains of an AMT '57 Ford that I cracked open for the suspension and hood I needed to restore an old custom.  I sent doors, wheel covers, the engine and interior parts to people on the boards. The roof is going on another of my old custom restorations and I sent the remainder of the body to someone on the board here to graft details onto a new Revell '57 Ford body.  So one kit can serve to bring many models to life! 

[StevenGuthmiller]

As far as parting out kits, I do as you do... if someone needs a part I have for a build, I happily donate and pay the postage.  I have the remains of an AMT '57 Ford that I cracked open for the suspension and hood I needed to restore an old custom.  I sent doors, wheel covers, the engine and interior parts to people on the boards. The roof is going on another of my old custom restorations and I sent the remainder of the body to someone on the board here to graft details onto a new Revell '57 Ford body.  So one kit can serve to bring many models to life! 

I have done the same with some people on the forum.

If I have parts that I don't need & know I will never use, & there is someone who is in need of them, I have no problem giving them up free of charge.

Hell, I don't even worry about postage.

 

 I buy their kit and I actually (horrors!) build it?!   Then we get down to the quality of the intended build... are only those who can turn out a show quality model allowed to build these kits?  Isn't it destroying and wasting that cherished kit if some guy builds it with brush paint and Testors tube glue all over the glass?

On the subject of who is acceptable to receive an obsolete kit, I agree, that's really not my place to say.

I personally cringe a little when someone chops up a vintage kit & customizes it, but that's just my issue.

I have no say over what a person does with "their property" once it's in their hands, & that's the way it should be.

If you want to sell them at astronomical prices, part them out, or bury them in your back yard for that matter, that's up to the individual.

I believe we still live in a free country.........or at least some semblance there of.

 

Steve

[Olderisbetter]

I think we need to consider the time it takes to inventory, package and ship these parts. A $3.00 part may involve as much labor as a $50 part. I'll bet non of these parts sellers are rich. I have never sold parts myself, by the way.

[martinfan5]

Both sides are to blame ,  buyers and sellers.

[Daddyfink]

There is no one to blame. The market exist, you can participate in it or not. 

 

Why is it always a blame game? Makes no sense. 

[Tom Geiger]

There is no one to blame. The market exist, you can participate in it or not. 

Why is it always a blame game? Makes no sense. 

BINGO!   Totally agree.  The cranky guys are just ticked that they didn't think of it first!   

[Harry P.]

I agree with what Art said as far as "parting out" kits and selling the bits separately. The person who owns the kit (or the parts) has every right to sell his merchandise as he sees fit. It's his stuff. You may not like the idea; you might not do things that way as a matter of principle... but you can't really fault the guy for doing whatever he wants to do with his property. If you disagree with the idea of parting out a kit, the best response is probably to never buy parts that are being sold that way. That's about all you can do, other than complain about it.

[Muncie]

haven't read every post or opinion... (but will probably wish I had...)

The seller who parts out a kit (hopefully one already started or missing parts, but if not that's OK) makes five people happy, that's five projects that can be finished - the seller who sells the kit only makes one person happy.

Price is what a buyer and seller agree - so no blame

 

 

 

[ChrisBcritter]

Heard back from the seller on the '40 Mercury parts - wouldn't budge on the price but would throw in the custom half-top he found. He relisted the items and I grabbed 'em - somebody had already put them on their watch list. I figure it this way - I got the rest of the car for free in a bag of junkers so I'm still ahead, more or less.

And just so you know - these were the only pieces he had; he didn't break up a whole kit.

[StevenGuthmiller]

There is no one to blame. The market exist, you can participate in it or not. 

 

Why is it always a blame game? Makes no sense. 

Bravo Jesse!

Perfect answer right there!

Right to the point!

 

Steve

 

[CometMan]

You can blame the buyers or the sellers, or you can blame everyone or no one at all. It's all just the market operating as it was designed to operate. This is a hobby, it is not a life altering event if we don't get a kit or part we want! If you don't like a price someone is asking, don't pay it!! There are quite a few hobby dealers as well as companies in the real world that I don't like their prices or their business practices, I simply do my business with someone else without making any waves. Although a kit or part may not be easy to find it is by no means the only one in existence, in time another one will always come up. Just my 2 cents on the subject, sorry if I went on a rant guys!

[martinfan5]

There is no one to blame. The market exist, you can participate in it or not. 

 

Why is it always a blame game? Makes no sense. 

It makes people feel better.

[mikemodeler]

I see both sides of the argument, but as it has been pointed out, if you don't like it, don't participate!

BTW- the new car dealers are guilty of the same thing. Buy a new car, complete for a fraction of what all of the individual parts would cost over the counter.

[Skip]

So, is everyone looking for a '60 Ford Pick Up too?  I've been looking for one for some time too!  Looking for a SWB, I've found a few long bed's for reasonable prices, just didn't want to do the surgery to cut the bed down.  I'm looking for one to replicate a buddy's first vehicle he drove to High School.  For the prices I am seeing them go for I might just bite the bullet and find a resin copy, leave the originals to you guys who collect annual kits.

No I really don't blame the sellers (for the most part) as I do the buyers with "I gotta win" mentality.  We've almost all seen that one a time or two, "stupid is as stupid does"!  Having been around the old car hobby nearly my whole life I've seen the same exact trends there as well.  We saw it when all the Dot Commies made huge piles of money day trading buying up anything and everything for stupid prices, especially those who bought at the "televised entertainment auction services".   

In many ways those auction services have done more harm for the hobby than good.  There is a direct correlation between the old car hobby to eBay auctions, both used to be traded for the most part either as casual sales or trades.  Now, nearly everyone (myself included) has that out of control instant gratification gene where we need it right now.  The only thing that's saved me a few times on eBay is the "proxy bid" where I bid on an "educated guess" standing firm at that price, going no higher.  The one thing that you can't allow into the deal is emotions, if you do you're going to pay more than it's worth more often than not.  It's a business deal after all, one where you're willing to pay for something.  One where the seller is more than willing to take as much of your money as you're willing to part with for the privelage of winning the auction!

[Mark]

In many ways those auction services have done more harm for the hobby than good. 

I'd disagree...eBay has brought a lot of stuff out of attics and closets that might otherwise have hit dumpsters over the following years.  When it comes to the parts auctions, I don't care to plow through a lot of that stuff, especially when the listing runs over and over.  I've seen items that were listed continuously for two years or more.  But the buyer determines what he/she is willing to pay, and if they want to even participate or not.  These things are nice to have but aren't necessities.