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International Harvester Truck kit's ERTL's First Models.


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46 minutes ago, Casey said:

This is my original scan to The Truck25 Foki account.  An invaluable resource for Big Rig trucks and Big Rig models created and maintained by a Dutch truck model enthusiast.  I have all of the original Blueprinter newsletters.

 

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Have you posted a link to that album previously here on the forum? They're really interesting to read.

I scanned the three issues I had last year (second link, and the above image is from one of the issues I scanned), but I only acquired three issues. -_-

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1 hour ago, Casey said:

Have you posted a link to that album previously here on the forum? They're really interesting to read.

I scanned the three issues I had last year (second link, and the above image is from one of the issues I scanned), but I only acquired three issues. -_-

I might have.  I was a subscriber back in the 70s.  Many of the same articles were in Car Modeler Magazine and Scale Auto Enthusiast Magazine back in the 1970s, but the Blueprinter articles were complete. I remember an article on how to modify the Transtar 4070A to a day cab.  The Scale Auto Enthusiast version seemed to be a first draft.  The author still trying to figure out how to make the modification as easy as possible.  Going as far as stating that Ertl was in the process of introducing a new version of the Transtar cabover and he needed to see what differences the modification would entail.    Whereas the Blueprinter article, which was several months later had all of the kinks worked out, along with step-by-step photos of the modification process.  Actually, I haven't looked at those articles for years.  I have put my mind to modern truck kits and subjects.  I haven't completely ignored the old stuff, just way more interested in the 21st century.

Edited by chuckyr
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I have no clue how anyone couldn't love these kits they were way beyond awesome.   I built most of them as a kid and loved them...they were nicely detailed kits that built very nicely too  Id love to see them come back someday but not going to hold my breath on them.  I have the IH 4070A truck but its very rough...maybe someday Ill be able to restore her to her formal glory..?   AMT and Ertl made some very nice kits back then. 

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13 hours ago, chuckyr said:

I might have.  I was a subscriber back in the 70s.  Many of the same articles were in Car Modeler Magazine and Scale Auto Enthusiast Magazine back in the 1970s, but the Blueprinter articles were complete. I remember an article on how to modify the Transtar 4070A to a day cab.  The Scale Auto Enthusiast version seemed to be a first draft.  The author still trying to figure out how to make the modification as easy as possible.  Going as far as stating that Ertl was in the process of introducing a new version of the Transtar cabover and he needed to see what differences the modification would entail.    Whereas the Blueprinter article, which was several months later had all of the kinks worked out, along with step-by-step photos of the modification process.  Actually, I haven't looked at those articles for years.  I have put my mind to modern truck kits and subjects.  I haven't completely ignored the old stuff, just way more interested in the 21st century.

I did see you Cincy address on one of the labels. :D  The issues do very much read like How-To articles, but that's not really a bad thing, especially considering how much Ertl must've invested in the entire IH product line.

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2 hours ago, Casey said:

I did see you Cincy address on one of the labels. :D  The issues do very much read like How-To articles, but that's not really a bad thing, especially considering how much Ertl must've invested in the entire IH product line.

That address is long, long ago, from a galaxy far, far away!  The 4070A ain't gonna be reissued, because the molds don't exist anymore.

 

Except for what Round2 wants for spoon feed you with reissues, all you have is memories from the Ertl Blueprinter kits.

Edited by chuckyr
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19 hours ago, chuckyr said:

 The 4070A ain't gonna be reissued, because the molds don't exist anymore.

 

Except for what Round2 wants for spoon feed you with reissues, all you have is memories from the Ertl Blueprinter kits.

That was what they said about the W925 Kenworth cab too, but it has came back from the dead. 

 

I can't remember if it was the 4070a or the Transtar Eagle II I had as a kid, but what would be the major differences between the two? Even if the molds for the 4070a are long gone, if it shared common parts with the Transtar Eagle II or even the 4300 Transtar conventional, those molds ARE still around. Couldn't it be possible as with the Kenworth to make new molds for the missing parts of the 4070 and use the existing molds for the (if any) common parts the 4070a shared with the other two kits? 

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The 4070 has round lights where the Transtar has square bezels, the 4070 has a non turbo motor where the Transtar has a turbo, the 4070 has Dayton wheels and an air ride rear suspension but the Transtar has Alcoa fronts, five hole rears and a walking beam rear end. The Transtar was out in the 90's so it most likely still exists in that form but they probably can't do the 4070 again without some retooling.

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1 hour ago, highway said:

That was what they said about the W925 Kenworth cab too, but it has came back from the dead. 

 

I can't remember if it was the 4070a or the Transtar Eagle II I had as a kid, but what would be the major differences between the two? Even if the molds for the 4070a are long gone, if it shared common parts with the Transtar Eagle II or even the 4300 Transtar conventional, those molds ARE still around. Couldn't it be possible as with the Kenworth to make new molds for the missing parts of the 4070 and use the existing molds for the (if any) common parts the 4070a shared with the other two kits? 

"I worked for International Trucks/Navistar for 38.5 years and, except for a 2.5 years stint in World Headquarters in Chicago, I worked in the Fort Wayne, Indiana Engineering Center. I spent time in Sales Engineering and eventually was the Product Information Manager, both were jobs that included supplying technical data and drawings to model manufacturers that wanted to build models of International trucks. "

 

"2 - The 4070A was retooled into the Transtar II which was, I believe, reissued in the '90's. The 4070A is gone..... B)"

Edited by chuckyr
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When the 4070B Transtar II was originally released, it had the IH Air Ride suspension from the 4070A and 4270.  At that time Ertl was owned by Victor Comptometer Corporation. Ertl was later acquired by the Kidde Fire Extinguisher Company, thats when things changed. The Air Ride was replaced with the Hendrickson Walking Beam spring suspension that was first used in the Paystar 5000 Dump Truck. The Air Ride was never used again on any of the IH Ertl kits or any of the re-issues of the cabover or 4300.

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1 hour ago, Modeltruckbuilder said:

When the 4070B Transtar II was originally released, it had the IH Air Ride suspension from the 4070A and 4270.  At that time Ertl was owned by Victor Comptometer Corporation. Ertl was later acquired by the Kidde Fire Extinguisher Company, thats when things changed. The Air Ride was replaced with the Hendrickson Walking Beam spring suspension that was first used in the Paystar 5000 Dump Truck. The Air Ride was never used again on any of the IH Ertl kits or any of the re-issues of the cabover or 4300.

Possibly a copyright issue.  Although I think they were both Hendrickson suspensions.

The Ertl Great Dane van has been reissued at least once, but the reefer unit hasn't.  Definitely a copyright issue.

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3 hours ago, chuckyr said:

Possibly a copyright issue.  Although I think they were both Hendrickson suspensions.

The Ertl Great Dane van has been reissued at least once, but the reefer unit hasn't.  Definitely a copyright issue.

I personally liked the Air Ride. It fit very well and the forward drive axle didn't need to be adjusted in order to have all of the tires touching.

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22 hours ago, Fat Brian said:

The 4070 has round lights where the Transtar has square bezels, the 4070 has a non turbo motor where the Transtar has a turbo, the 4070 has Dayton wheels and an air ride rear suspension but the Transtar has Alcoa fronts, five hole rears and a walking beam rear end. The Transtar was out in the 90's so it most likely still exists in that form but they probably can't do the 4070 again without some retooling.

 

21 hours ago, chuckyr said:

"I worked for International Trucks/Navistar for 38.5 years and, except for a 2.5 years stint in World Headquarters in Chicago, I worked in the Fort Wayne, Indiana Engineering Center. I spent time in Sales Engineering and eventually was the Product Information Manager, both were jobs that included supplying technical data and drawings to model manufacturers that wanted to build models of International trucks. "

 

"2 - The 4070A was retooled into the Transtar II which was, I believe, reissued in the '90's. The 4070A is gone..... B)"

As I and a few others have said, that has been said about other kits too, specifically the W925 that had its cab retooled into the T600A. The W925 was brought back with the aid of the lost tooling being remade, and if the headlights, air suspension, and no turbo on the engine are the only differences, I don't see why Round 2 couldn't do the same for the 4070A that they have done for the Kenworth. I purposely left out the Dayton wheels because of the fact there are many kits that have them, so they shouldn't be a factor. 

Also learning about the air suspension, it does make me remember it was a 4070A that I had as an early teenager because it was my first attempt at a conversion because of the air suspension made cutting the back of the frame off to make it a single axle an easy conversion. The plan that never did make it past the cutting stage was to make it a single axle workhorse similar to what many of the LTL companies ran in my youth. 

 

Personally, I'd like to see both versions make a return to the shelves again. 

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1 hour ago, highway said:

 

As I and a few others have said, that has been said about other kits too, specifically the W925 that had its cab retooled into the T600A. The W925 was brought back with the aid of the lost tooling being remade, and if the headlights, air suspension, and no turbo on the engine are the only differences, I don't see why Round 2 couldn't do the same for the 4070A that they have done for the Kenworth. I purposely left out the Dayton wheels because of the fact there are many kits that have them, so they shouldn't be a factor.

Think about something for a minute here, the Dayton wheels might be the "issue" in all of this. None of the Ertl named issues that originally had spoke wheels have ever been re-issued. The S Series have never been re-issued and all 3 versions had Daytons. The 4270 conventional and 4070A COE both had Daytons as well in their original form but were both re-tooled into the 4300 Eagle and 4070B Transtar II, both have been re-issued since and coincidentally both had/have 10 hole Alcoa front wheels. The 4300 has 10 hole rears, the 4070B has 5 hole Budd rears. 

As far as the engine is concerned, the 4070A and 4070B both have the same engine, Detroit 8V-71 non turbo. The 4270 had the non turbo Cummins V-903, (not the VT which was a turbo motor) and the 4300 has the turbo IH Boat Anchor V-800. All of the S trucks and Paystars had the V-800 as well.

 

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1 hour ago, highway said:

 

As I and a few others have said, that has been said about other kits too, specifically the W925 that had its cab retooled into the T600A. The W925 was brought back with the aid of the lost tooling being remade, and if the headlights, air suspension, and no turbo on the engine are the only differences, I don't see why Round 2 couldn't do the same for the 4070A that they have done for the Kenworth. I purposely left out the Dayton wheels because of the fact there are many kits that have them, so they shouldn't be a factor. 

Also learning about the air suspension, it does make me remember it was a 4070A that I had as an early teenager because it was my first attempt at a conversion because of the air suspension made cutting the back of the frame off to make it a single axle an easy conversion. The plan that never did make it past the cutting stage was to make it a single axle workhorse similar to what many of the LTL companies ran in my youth. 

 

Personally, I'd like to see both versions make a return to the shelves again. 

Tim Alhborn was quoted as saying that he thought the W925 wouldn't be brought back, due to it being modified to the T600.

So far as I know, Tim Alhborn hasn't worked for any model company.  I could be wrong.  And any information he has, even though it may be reliable is third person account.

I would tend to believe the person who worked 30 years as the liaison between IH and Ertl and was actually responsible for bringing the Ertl 4070A kit to reality.

If he said is gone, I take him at his word.  

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24 minutes ago, chuckyr said:

I would tend to believe the person who worked 30 years as the liaison between IH and Ertl and was actually responsible for bringing the Ertl 4070A kit to reality.

If he said is gone, I take him at his word.  

Chuck, are you saying the Transtar kit is gone too or just the A version?

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1 hour ago, Modeltruckbuilder said:

Think about something for a minute here, the Dayton wheels might be the "issue" in all of this. None of the Ertl named issues that originally had spoke wheels have ever been re-issued. The S Series have never been re-issued and all 3 versions had Daytons. The 4270 conventional and 4070A COE both had Daytons as well in their original form but were both re-tooled into the 4300 Eagle and 4070B Transtar II, both have been re-issued since and coincidentally both had/have 10 hole Alcoa front wheels. The 4300 has 10 hole rears, the 4070B has 5 hole Budd rears. 

As far as the engine is concerned, the 4070A and 4070B both have the same engine, Detroit 8V-71 non turbo. The 4270 had the non turbo Cummins V-903, (not the VT which was a turbo motor) and the 4300 has the turbo IH Boat Anchor V-800. All of the S trucks and Paystars had the V-800 as well.

 

I dont think it's the wheels, they don't say Dayton on them and they seem generic enough to not be an issue. 

As for the engine, I know the exhaust manifolds are different. My Eagle II kit is missing one and 4070A manifolds won't work. I seem to remember the Eagle kit being single stack and the 4070A being dual stack, maybe that is the difference. 

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12 minutes ago, Fat Brian said:

As for the engine, I know the exhaust manifolds are different. My Eagle II kit is missing one and 4070A manifolds won't work. I seem to remember the Eagle kit being single stack and the 4070A being dual stack, maybe that is the difference. 

Maybe you should check out the instruction booklet,

4070A

http://public.fotki.com/modeltrucks25thscale/truckkit_instructions/ertl/8000_international/

4070B - Air Ride

http://public.fotki.com/modeltrucks25thscale/truckkit_instructions/ertl/8017_international/

4070B - Spring Suspension

http://public.fotki.com/modeltrucks25thscale/truckkit_instructions/ertl/8017_international-1/

Edited by Modeltruckbuilder
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20 minutes ago, Modeltruckbuilder said:

I know that's different too, I was speaking specifically about the engine.

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5 hours ago, Modeltruckbuilder said:

Think about something for a minute here, the Dayton wheels might be the "issue" in all of this. None of the Ertl named issues that originally had spoke wheels have ever been re-issued. The S Series have never been re-issued and all 3 versions had Daytons. The 4270 conventional and 4070A COE both had Daytons as well in their original form but were both re-tooled into the 4300 Eagle and 4070B Transtar II, both have been re-issued since and coincidentally both had/have 10 hole Alcoa front wheels. The 4300 has 10 hole rears, the 4070B has 5 hole Budd rears. 

As far as the engine is concerned, the 4070A and 4070B both have the same engine, Detroit 8V-71 non turbo. The 4270 had the non turbo Cummins V-903, (not the VT which was a turbo motor) and the 4300 has the turbo IH Boat Anchor V-800. All of the S trucks and Paystars had the V-800 as well.

 

You might be on to something there Anthony! I do remember from not only the 4070A but the Great Dane reefer I had as a kid, those wheels also had the fluted spacer molded in to the wheel, and digging through everything I have in my collection with a spoke wheel, none look as good as those ones. I even looked at an original Paystar logger and while the tractor has the 5 hole Budds as the dump truck and mixer versions, the trailer also had those Dayton wheels, but the newer reissue of the stand alone Peerless trailer has 5 hole Budds. As for if there were any difference in the hubs between the rear drives from the 4070A and the others and the trailer wheels, I don't know that because I have no drive wheels to compare the trailer wheels to, but if there isn't they have been around as recently as 2003 in the Great Dane extendable flatbed. 

20180214_205949.thumb.jpg.a0340979aa7def36f35cb05e13f93029.jpg

The single wheel is from my Paystar logger and the unopened sprue is from the Great Dane, and I noticed this was also a Stevens International release, so it may very well be possible they at least have the molds for the wheels. 

 

The only reason I didn't really think the Daytons were an issue is I really don't care for spoke wheels. Sure, they have their place for workhorses and I do use them for trailers or as drive wheels on trucks like a Mack R and in fact, I had to find a set of spoke wheels for my early 2000s reissue if the R model because it was the one that only included Alcoas and I wanted the Alcoas on the steers but spokes on the drives since it will be hauling a lowboy. 

4 hours ago, chuckyr said:

Tim Alhborn was quoted as saying that he thought the W925 wouldn't be brought back, due to it being modified to the T600.

So far as I know, Tim Alhborn hasn't worked for any model company.  I could be wrong.  And any information he has, even though it may be reliable is third person account.

I would tend to believe the person who worked 30 years as the liaison between IH and Ertl and was actually responsible for bringing the Ertl 4070A kit to reality.

If he said is gone, I take him at his word.  

I guess we will just agree to disagree, because not only with the W925 but other kits in the automotive realm that have been said not to have parts in them since original issues because the molds have been said to have been lost, missing, or destroyed, but they have returned also. 

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