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Buddy Baker's 1980 Oldsmobile 442 in 1/25th scale.


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7 hours ago, Phirewriter said:

I thought of another point in regards to this statement and should have used it in my earlier post. We as a group here are all well aware of the '40's era Chevy kits that Galaxie Ltd has produced over the years and the excellent quality and scale fidelity of them.

One man's vision, Gary Schmidt and one designer, Tom West. So again, that argument has no legs to stand on.

And after re-reading the statement from Mike's Decals  it certainly seems to come off as rather combative, excuse ridden and very off putting. Even if they correct things in any upcoming releases, attitudes like that make me less inclined to consider looking at them in the future.

These are my thoughts as well. That is why I posted the info found on another site.

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11 hours ago, ranma said:

And isn't that one of the things that Hobbico done, and was sued over? What was the out come to That?

Um.........................................................................................................................................................who cares?

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8 minutes ago, Rat Roaster said:

Um.........................................................................................................................................................who cares?

Well for one the former employee's of Revell USA, Hobby shop's and anyone who builds models! Lest you forget at this time there is no Revell USA? And the future of Revell even though it's Revell of Germany is uncertian when it comes to the U.S.

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Just some questions to all of those who look down upon this kit. Even though the Pyro( now Lindberg) Auburn speedster kit is from an old production, With all of it's mistakes still get's reissued does it not?  AMT, JoHan, Revell were producing kit's, Minus  the dreaded Palmer kit's, at the same time and had better looking kit's. Every Model company has it's "dogged" kit's, Just read any topic about most kit's (IE Starsky and Hutch Torino, Or the Revell 57 NOMAD KIT's) Another One is how many complain about how ERTL missed the mark on the Scout II kit's, And most of those are an easy fix with parts from a parts box! Last but least how many Die cast  cars are out with as many mistakes  as some plastic kit's or even worse than a plastic model? The fact is even the big guy's with all the tech, and such still can and do produce inaccurate  models!

Edited by ranma
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26 minutes ago, ranma said:

Just some questions

What matters for the sake of this discussion (and what most people have stuck to discussing) is this particular Grey Ghost kit. It's more than capable of being judged on its own merits, just like any other kit. No need to bring in other kits, a long defunct manufacturer of (mostly) turd kits (Palmer), and even die cast models. If the kit is well designed an the final product well executed, we'll heap on the praise. If it's sub-par and ill-designed, it deserves harsh criticism, and this kit certainly has a great number of problems. It helps nobody to make excuses and use distraction techniques in an attempt to cover up a lack of quality and planning on the designer's part.

Where is Chuck K, BTW? ^_^

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1 hour ago, ranma said:

Well for one the former employee's of Revell USA, Hobby shop's and anyone who builds models! Lest you forget at this time there is no Revell USA? And the future of Revell even though it's Revell of Germany is uncertian when it comes to the U.S.

Sears/Kmart  is failing. All their employees will soon be out of a job. Shouldn't you be doing something to prevent this?

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It was not an attempt to cover up the lack of quality of the Oldsmobile gray ghost kit, But to point out that "other "model companies have put out their fair share of below average quality kits.  It's  Odd that with so much tech that we have around today that there are still kit's that come out like the Gray Ghost. Yet the Promo car's from the 50's and sixty's seemed to be very good copies of the real thing (though being curbside Products)... Would I buy the Kit? maybe, Then I'd need a amt  bobby allison Coca cola Monte carlo for the correct chassis wouldn't I?

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Waynerd, I fail to see where Sears/Kmart  has anything to do with this. Hobbico, Owned Revell USA Which affects the Hobby. Hobbico Copied Some of Traxx R.C, Things Thus started  the demise of Hobbico. Your statement that The Company that made the Gray Ghost should have Copied AMT  for most of the parts, Is why I wrote my response.  It would have been Better to pay Round two for the use of the chassis mold's ect. The Real Point is This kit failed to hit the mark, Which all Model companies have done.

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17 minutes ago, Rat Roaster said:

Sears/Kmart  is failing. All their employees will soon be out of a job. Shouldn't you be doing something to prevent this?

Old companies with obsolete business models that failed to adapt to the modern world.   Irrelevant to the discussion here. 

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5 minutes ago, ranma said:

 The Real Point is This kit failed to hit the mark, Which all Model companies have done.

And it's especially bad that a new company with a fresh start---not working off existing tooling---would screw up this badly.  They didn't do their homework and rushed to market w/ a half-baked product.  

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1 hour ago, Casey said:

What matters for the sake of this discussion (and what most people have stuck to discussing) is this particular Grey Ghost kit. It's more than capable of being judged on its own merits, just like any other kit. No need to bring in other kits, a long defunct manufacturer of (mostly) turd kits (Palmer), and even die cast models. If the kit is well designed an the final product well executed, we'll heap on the praise. If it's sub-par and ill-designed, it deserves harsh criticism, and this kit certainly has a great number of problems. It helps nobody to make excuses and use distraction techniques in an attempt to cover up a lack of quality and planning on the designer's part.

Where is Chuck K, BTW? ^_^

And what is really galling is the attitude of the kit's manufacturer, chief distributor and their sycophants that people should willing accept, and even be thankful for the opportunity to shell out their hard-earned dollars for, a product that they themselves acknowledge is subpar and riddled with inaccuracies. 

If you went into a restaurant and were served a bad meal that made you violently ill, I seriously doubt you'd be mollified by excuses like "The meal was a one-man effort" or "It's the first time the chef ever cooked that meal." And I expect you'd be downright furious if the manager told you should be thankful the establishment provided you with the opportunity to be served such a terrible meal. And finally, I don't think you'd continue to patronize the restaurant because you wanted to see it succeed.

I'll simply never understand why so many car modelers willingly, even cheerfully, accept junk in boxes like this Olds kit and even berate and belittle those who have the temerity to point out that what they're purchasing is, in fact, junk.

It all goes ro reinforce beliefs that the IQs of a lot of modelers are a lot like a Hobby Lobby coupon; 40 percent off from normal.

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 Rob Hall, I agree with what you are saying that the kit was rushed. A.K.A half baked.  But as I was trying to point out that all kit companies are guilty of doing the same thing. No this don't excuse this company from the mistakes that are bad in this kit, Nor is it to defend them. It was to point out that Companies like Revell, AMT, MPC, Monogram, Trumpter, and even Moebuis has missed the mark.  Sadly this was a bad attempt on what should have been a decent kit!

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8 minutes ago, Allen Wrench said:

I'll simply never understand why so many car modelers willingly, even cheerfully, accept junk in boxes like this Olds kit and even berate and belittle those who have the temerity to point out that what they're purchasing is, in fact, junk.

Most people either don't know or don't care about value and quality. Cost always seems to be the most important factor for the majority, and while I won't deny cost is important, understanding value and why it's even important is a hard thing to teach people who regularly shop at Wal-Mart, where the idea of paying less falsely equates to "better".

49 minutes ago, ranma said:

The Real Point is This kit failed to hit the mark

That's all that needs to be said. No other company nor people had any input on the design of this kit, so nobody else factors in when it comes time to dish out the credit and criticism.

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4 minutes ago, Xingu said:

You are all missing the boat. It will be a collector's item one day and you will be kicking yourself for not getting a couple when they were first released. :P

Funny thing about that is you maybe right about that, As stranger things have happened!

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18 minutes ago, Casey said:

Most people either don't know or don't care about value and quality. Cost always seems to be the most important factor for the majority, and while I won't deny cost is important, understanding value and why it's even important is a hard thing to teach people who regularly shop at Wal-Mart, where the idea of paying less falsely equates to "better".

... and who still bemoan the fact that Wal-Mart no longer sells AMT kits in checkered boxes for $5 each.

This particular school of thought, combined with the willingness of car modelers to accept subpar, inaacurate kits, are why we can't have nice things like the military modelers.

Edited by Allen Wrench
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48 minutes ago, Allen Wrench said:

 

It all goes to reinforce beliefs that the IQs of a lot of modelers are a lot like a Hobby Lobby coupon; 40 percent off from normal.

Bravo! Just look at the ex-modelers here who can't even follow this thread B)

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33 minutes ago, Xingu said:

You are all missing the boat. It will be a collector's item one day and you will be kicking yourself for not getting a couple when they were first released. :P

That's exactly what I was thinking too. 

20 or 30 years from now ,, a "one and done" kit from a "one hit wonder" company = Ka CHINGGGGGG  $$$$$$

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I fail to see a shared equivalency in dredging up past failed companies, and/or older than dirt models as some sort of - "Well other kits are bad too" argument.  Yeah those other kits are bad...and for the most part they were all produced at LEAST 40 years ago, when as we are all told a bajillion times over models were a buck.  This is 2018, this is a new product, replete with a head honcho who routinely points out all his experience in toy design and how great he is at it - this is a dud of a kit, that will be a sales success because the run is almost entirely sold out because it was so small, and because the majority of sales were done prior DIRECT to consumers without anyone seeing what the product looked like before hand.

Even if I'm willing to give them another whack at things with the Monte Carlo, and they might be able to pre-sale that run to a sell out because "OMIGHERD MONTE CARLOOOOO" - the problem comes in the reissues of the Olds as the Petty car, and subsequent kits beyond that.  This first kit is going to under pin - and ergo continue to be a reoccuring issue in - a lot of the future kits.  Something will need be done to rectify the shapes, sizes and ejector pin issues because there's only so many times you can "fix it later" can kick before people write you off as the new Trumpeter and ignore your product line.

Edited by niteowl7710
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19 minutes ago, bobthehobbyguy said:

Its a shame that none of those who feel that they know how to develop and sell a kit doesn't step up to the plate to show everyone how it should be done! It would demonstrate to all that it can be done.

Bob, I gotta disagree with you there. I'm not an expert by any means in kit manufacturing......quite the contrary. However, when somethings not right it isn't right. This may not be a good analogy, but if I'm spending upwards of $15,000 for a car (my '11 Challenger for instance when I bought it in '14), and it's got a flat tire right off the bat, I expect the dealer to make it right. Not make an excuse by saying "But Sir.......it IS a Dodge Challenger!"

Sorry, but one need not be an expert to point out an error when it's a HUGE one. If you're talking about those on the board that do have that kind of experience, well that's up to them to comment but give the average Joe among us some slack when there's things wrong with a particular product. In this case it happens to be a model.

In the case of this Olds........despite it being a NASCAR, there's just some aspects of the car's body shape that aren't right. At least that's what my two eyes are showing me, and despite failing sight in the past couple years, I can still see when there's glaring omissions/incorrect proportions.

OK.....that's my 2¢ worth......... ;)

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49 minutes ago, bobthehobbyguy said:

Its a shame that none of those who feel that they know how to develop and sell a kit doesn't step up to the plate to show everyone how it should be done! It would demonstrate to all that it can be done.

You network and find the knowledgable people to make your project work.

I'll give 'm this much, they did secure all the neccesary licensing, which isn't an easy task

Edited by Luc Janssens
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56 minutes ago, niteowl7710 said:

Even if I'm willing to give them another whack at things with the Monte Carlo, and they might be able to pre-sale that run to a sell out because "OMIGHERD MONTE CARLOOOOO" - the problem comes in the reissues of the Olds as the Petty car, and subsequent kits beyond that.  This first kit is going to under pin - and ergo continue to be a reoccuring issue in - a lot of the future kits.  Something will need be done to rectify the shapes, sizes and ejector pin issues because there's only so many times you can "fix it later" can kick before people write you off as the new Trumpeter and ignore your product line.

Exactly. While Salvinos is supposedly creating the cotect rear suspension parts, it was stated on the Mike's Decals Facebook page that the front suspension probably won't be fixed, although Mike did say he was planning to offer the correct parts in resin. (At additional cost, no doubt.) And even if they fix both the front and rear suspensions, that does nothing to rectify that horribly misproportioned engine block/transmission, the oversized transmission/driveshaft tunnel, etc. 

But hey! We should be thankful to Salvinos for giving us the opportunity to purchase such an inferior product and we'd better go out and buy as many as we can, otherwise, they might not make any more of them!

Edited by Allen Wrench
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1 hour ago, bobthehobbyguy said:

Its a shame that none of those who feel that they know how to develop and sell a kit doesn't step up to the plate to show everyone how it should be done! It would demonstrate to all that it can be done.

I don't anything about filmmaking, but I know a bad movie when I see one.

I'm not a chef, but I know a bad meal when I taste one.

I don't know anything about brewing, but I know bad beer when I taste it.

I don't play any musical instruments and know nothing about the workings of a recording studio, but I know bad music when I hear it.

I don't know anything about manufacturing, but I know a shoddily made consumer product when I get one.

Your point is invalid.

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