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Snake45

If I Ran Revell....

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32 minutes ago, Motor City said:

Sadly, I can't think of many vehicles over the past couple of decades that I would want a kit of, though many of you might be interested in kits of SUVs, exotic sports cars, or tuners.  I don't know the European or Asian vehicles or kit manufacturers well enough to know if these are covered.  For the American market, I would do a Cadillac CTS-V coupe, ATS-V coupe, or ELR.  Going back a bit further, I would do an XLR.  The last Buick worth doing would be the '95-'99 Riviera.   A Pontiac G6 retractable convertible or coupe, the G8 sedan, and the Chevrolet HHR would be other good subjects.  The current Charger offers the most potential with various police car versions.           

But what kits would you bash these with to improve/simplify detail?

I think Snakes topic was to get simple kit variations produced to mix parts with already existing detailed kits.

Trying to get more with less.

Maybe the companies could give us more of what we wanted if the cost to produce a full detail kit wasn't so high?

I would be all for the Hasegawa American 66 series, if they had spent more time with the interiors. I could bash them with other kits for the rest. But I digress....

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On 12/29/2018 at 2:00 PM, Snake45 said:

If I ran Revell, I'd start a new line of 1/25 snappers--actually, a continuation of their current snapper line, but done like their '69 Camaro with separate hoods. These would have accurate bodies, basic but accurate interiors, and 1-piece chassis with wire axles, and would retail for @ $20. Here's the twist: They would be set up so they could be transformed into full-detail kits using an already existing Revell full kit chassis and engine and whatnot. Instructions on how to do this would be included (for the "advanced modeler"). 

The first two I'd release would be '65 and '67 GTOs set up to fit on the '66 GTO chassis. Next would be a '69 Firebird that could use the guts of their '68 Firebird kit. Then would be a '67 El Camino that used the chassis from the '66 Elky or wagon or '67 Chevelle. How about a '71 or '72 Chevelle using the new '68 Chevelle mechanicals. '68 and/or '69 Impalas for the '65-'66 chassis? Surely something can be done with the '72 Cutlass--maybe a '68 or '70 or '71 4-4-2 coupe. I'm sure there are many other possibilities as well.

I think they'd sell a lot of such kits, and they'd also sell a bunch of "donor" kits, too. I know I'd buy 'em. B)

Discuss.

Rebooting this thread...

Revell has done some very credible snap kits in the past.  I'm thinking the '73 Monte Carlo and the '70 Chevelle.  In fact when I saw the new '68 Chevelle, my first thought was "I wonder how that would work under the '70 snapper."   My club used these and other snap kits for youth events, where we invited youth groups for a build, to introduce youngsters to model car building.  The kids were enthusiastic and our members were impressed with kits we had overlooked. Add in the ability to easily convert these new snap kits into slot cars, and I think you'd have a product!   

Sales ability?  I don't know how to gauge that today.  First, note that the guys who frequent model car boards and shows are maybe the top 1% of the hobby.  No company could survive on the sales from us guys.  It's the remaining 99% of the market, the casual builders who wouldn't do a kit bash like this, but may enjoy the simple snap kit of a cool car. 

My own thought is that Playing Mantis was onto something back before they sold the company with simple kits like the Herbie VW Beetle.  It was a full detail snap kit.  It was molded in color and was quite easy to build and be able to put a nice replica on your shelf.  I gave one to my 12 year old nephew when the kit was first out,  he assembled it in about an hour and was very happy with his results.   Same kit was designed so that the serious modelers could use it as the basis for a more detailed kit.  I think this happy medium may be more the way of the future.

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2 hours ago, Oldcarfan27 said:

I think Snakes topic was to get simple kit variations produced to mix parts with already existing detailed kits.

Trying to get more with less.

You get me. You really get me. B)

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2 hours ago, Tom Geiger said:

Revell has done some very credible snap kits in the past.  I'm thinking the '73 Monte Carlo and the '70 Chevelle.  In fact when I saw the new '68 Chevelle, my first thought was "I wonder how that would work under the '70 snapper."   My club used these and other snap kits for youth events, where we invited youth groups for a build, to introduce youngsters to model car building.  The kids were enthusiastic and our members were impressed with kits we had overlooked. Add in the ability to easily convert these new snap kits into slot cars, and I think you'd have a product!

I agree.

I personally would call these the Revell "Slump Buster, Snap Series" 🙄

I just wish they would do more esoteric subjects, rather than more common 57 Chevy, 63 Corvette and 70 Chevelle.

What if they had chosen a 57 Cadillac or Pontiac, a 66 Corvette and a 71 Chevelle instead? Now that would have had my interest in building more snappers!

BTW - it was a 77 Monte Carlo, although a 73 would be great too!

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If I ran Revell, I'd first reissue the '62 Mopar kits and watch with relish how you ugly lot smash each other's heads in to get them.
Then I'd release variations of the '59 Caddy and Chevy, such as a Fleetwood 60 Special, an Impala flattop sedan and a Biscayne four door sedan.
Then I'd have a 1/24 scale Borgward Isabella newly tooled because Germany and I'd have to somehow finance my expensive - errr - lifestyle.
Then I'd have the Duel truck and Valiant tooled in 1/25 and issue them in an ultra expensive set just because I'm cynical.
Then I'd have a Greyhound Scenicruiser and a Büssing D2U tooled up in 1/25 and 1/24 respectively.
Then I'd tell those military modelers where they can shove it for all I care and take all military paints out of the portfolio. Give peace a bloody chance.
Then I'd have a 50s Diner tooled up in 1/25 scale.
Then I'd supplement the tractor series with a Lanz Bulldog. Because I could.
Then I'd have as many 57-60 American finned monsters tooled up in 1/25 scale as the styrene granulate supply permits.
Then I'd say, see, I told you so for 40 rotten years.

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On 12/30/2018 at 4:39 PM, DiscoRover007 said:

If I were Revell I would dissolve the 1/25 line and shift all new models to 1/24 scale. Then I'd start making niche kits that people want to make that haven't been tapped yet.

 

Yes. I agree on a move to 1:24 for all new kits.

Although I haven't purchased any recent release Revell kit as there is nothing in the catalogue that tickles my fancy, it seems to me that the new Revell owners need to take on the world. One Ford GTLM and some old Porsches aren't world beating market changers nor will they raise Revell's market share or profile in non-US countries. Take Beemax, Belkits and Ebbro as examples, They came on the scene and started to issue kits that the rest of the world wanted and the rest of the world is buying those kits and the aftermarket for these kits is firing on all cylinders as well. Even Hasegawa have seen the light and are releasing new subjects and re-issuing some great old kits.

If Revell are to survive and thrive in a supposedly dying market then most future new Revell kit subjects need to have world appeal not just kits for someone whose grandpa drove one back in the day.

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It would be great if you could pivot a company like Revell on a dime, but it's more like parallel parking an aircraft carrier. There are a lot of "legacy" expenses that have already been paid before the sale and consolidation took place and it would just be fiscally irresponsible for the new owners (even imaginary forum ones) to scrap all the in-progress projects and start from scratch with new ones. Aside from the part where starting from scratch would leave the company with no new kits to release in 2019 until very late in the year, if at all.

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8 hours ago, Junkman said:

...you ugly lot...

...I'd tell those military modelers where they can shove it for all I care....

Really? :blink:

Why all the hate, dude? :wacko:

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Instead of all the cynical, negative philosophical responses on "why that would never work" or "Revell would only sell old cars to old builders" - remember this.

This is just a hypothetical idea, not a corporate addendum. Nobody's basing any products from our little discussions. The companies will make and sell models based on their own research. If they feel old cars will sell, then that's what they'll produce. 

The point of these threads is to inspire ideas and meaningful discussions. If it's all just going to be "that'll never work" or "they'll never sell those", then what's the point of writing in positive ideas?

 

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Ok, I admit I only read the first page of just skimmed the other 4.  

I see a lot of "these kids today don't want to use their hands".  Not true, not true at all.  Kids today build models.  A lot.  They're just not building car models.  They build Gundam robots.  They're building tanks they play in World of Tanks.  They're building Warhammer and stuff for other tabletop games like Bolt Action and Flames of War.    They cut plastic parts off sprues and stick them together and put paint on them just like we do.  Just not cars.  Quit slagging off "the kids today".   

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1 minute ago, Brett Barrow said:

Ok, I admit I only read the first page of just skimmed the other 4.  

I see a lot of "these kids today don't want to use their hands".  Not true, not true at all.  Kids today build models.  A lot.  They're just not building car models.  They build Gundam robots.  They're building tanks they play in World of Tanks.  They're building Warhammer and stuff for other tabletop games like Bolt Action and Flames of War.    They cut plastic parts off sprues and stick them together and put paint on them just like we do.  Just not cars.  Quit slagging off "the kids today".   

I can't agree with this statement more and I have the viewpoint from behind the sales counter to back it up. 

Car kits DO sell to younger builders, but my younger REPEAT customers tend to be on the military side and the truth is that the support from the hobby is there too. New companies, new product, ever improving product, ever improving tools, and much of that driven by the influx of new builders who emphasize fit and accuracy over price. 

And my younger car builders? Primarily Tamiya. 

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2 minutes ago, Justin Porter said:

I can't agree with this statement more and I have the viewpoint from behind the sales counter to back it up. 

 

As do I, will be 19 years in this year.  Been hearing "these kids today" stories since the day I started.  Just one of my biggest pet peeves.  

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We were once "those kids today"...

-Don't these kids realize that model airplanes are supposed to fly, and model boats are supposed to float?  They're building them just to sit on a shelf...

-Don't these kids realize that being a "real" modeler requires working with wood?  These newfangled "plastic kits" are nothing more than knocked-down toys...

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55 minutes ago, Justin Porter said:

I can't agree with this statement more and I have the viewpoint from behind the sales counter to back it up. 

Car kits DO sell to younger builders, but my younger REPEAT customers tend to be on the military side and the truth is that the support from the hobby is there too. New companies, new product, ever improving product, ever improving tools, and much of that driven by the influx of new builders who emphasize fit and accuracy over price. 

And my younger car builders? Primarily Tamiya. 

 

48 minutes ago, Brett Barrow said:

As do I, will be 19 years in this year.  Been hearing "these kids today" stories since the day I started.  Just one of my biggest pet peeves.  

Good to hear!

A question though, how well do muscle cars do with kids today...reason, saw a Lego commercial the other day and it featured an animated red '70 Charger, for a split second anyway

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1 minute ago, Luc Janssens said:

 

Good to hear!

A question though, how well do muscle cars do with kids today...reason, saw a Lego commercial the other day and it featured an animated red '70 Charger, for a split second anyway

Well, they don't do badly because they're still featured heavily as "Want Objects" in popular media. Tony Stark has a garage of hot rods and classics. The boys from Supernatural drive around in their dad's Impala. The Fast & The Furious franchise has featured muscle cars just as heavily as it does imports. There's any number of reasons for younger builders to WANT to build the typically popular muscle cars. 

The biggest problem I've run into is that when they start - generally as they seem to - with a Tamiya Skyline or Supra, and then go to build an AMT Dodge Charger, they're almost immediately turned off to the domestic kit manufacturers. 

Round 2 has mitigated this somewhat by making it very clear that they're re-issuing old kits that are targeted at a nostalgia market rather than positioning themselves as a serious model company ala Tamiya or Trumpeter but old kits lurking in new boxes have done immeasurable damage to the automotive side of the hobby. 

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A Supernatural 4-door 67 would be a hot seller, we sell tons of the 2-door AMT kits just because it's a 67.  The F&F Charger has done really well, as have most of the F&F kits since Revell took over the line.  I don't remember the AMT/Ertl ones doing so hot the first time.  Cars with a movie or TV tie-in can do OK, it just depends on the tie-in.   

13 minutes ago, Justin Porter said:

but old kits lurking in new boxes have done immeasurable damage to the automotive side of the hobby. 

Which is why Round 2 has started taking the Lindberg name off the 90's Lindberg stuff and made it AMT, to differentiate it from the old 60's stuff. 

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18 minutes ago, Justin Porter said:

Old kits lurking in new boxes have done immeasurable damage to the automotive side of the hobby. 

 

Indeed, it's like aircraft kits with raised instead of engraved panel lines, not acceptable in today's market.

Also, the reason I'd like Round2 to dump the old Mpc GTO '67-72 tooling, it's poison for the Mpc brand name, maybe they should use a new (or restyled?!) brand name, for all new tooling, but which one cuz they all have their dogs, except Polar Lights maybe?!

Same with Revell, but they recently unloaded their old tooling to Atlantis, so I've read here.

 

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15 minutes ago, Luc Janssens said:

... maybe they should use a new (or restyled?!) brand name, for all new tooling...

When a non-retooled repop is released, why not just tell the truth on the box, something like "This is a nostalgia kit, made in 60-year-old (or whatever) tooling, and is identical in most respects to the original. Do NOT expect the level of fit, accuracy, or complexity of a kit tooled in the 21st century".

That should go a long way towards dispelling disappointment upon opening the box.

Still, in some respects, the 60-year-old stuff can be more accurate than much more recent offerings. I wonder why that is.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, ShawnS said:

Yes. I agree on a move to 1:24 for all new kits.

Although I haven't purchased any recent release Revell kit as there is nothing in the catalogue that tickles my fancy, it seems to me that the new Revell owners need to take on the world. One Ford GTLM and some old Porsches aren't world beating market changers nor will they raise Revell's market share or profile in non-US countries. Take Beemax, Belkits and Ebbro as examples, They came on the scene and started to issue kits that the rest of the world wanted and the rest of the world is buying those kits and the aftermarket for these kits is firing on all cylinders as well. Even Hasegawa have seen the light and are releasing new subjects and re-issuing some great old kits.

If Revell are to survive and thrive in a supposedly dying market then most future new Revell kit subjects need to have world appeal not just kits for someone whose grandpa drove one back in the day.

Yes absolutely. That's why I think there's huge potential in the SUV market.  And there are a number of sports cars that haven't been built.  They keep pushing old kits from decades ago and it's holding them back immensely. The best thing Revell did  in terms of subject and quality the last several years was their 599 GTO up to the Porsche 918(Which still has its drawbacks).  Their new Ford GT is a great kit Im sure but Im afraid it'll just be another one off instead of a sign of things to come.

Aoshima's been doing right for the last several years. They completely dominated the Lamborghini subjects and have made the best versions of them in history of models. They've tapped into the nostalgia of the Countach and are making the new models as well. Tamiya is obviously great but they don't release new kits too often. 

Edited by DiscoRover007

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28 minutes ago, Luc Janssens said:

Indeed, it's like aircraft kits with raised instead of engraved panel lines, not acceptable in today's market.

 

 

In the past few years on the air side, I have seen Tamiya and Airfix dig into their catalogs and discard older tooling in favor of newly tooled kits of subjects within their line for the sake of being able to compete with smaller, more focused companies such as Eduard or Kitty Hawk. 

I applaud Revell for having "gone back to the well" to make their attempts at improved Mopar E-bodies or more recently to cure the '69 Mustang tooling of its biggest faux pas. It's the attitude of a company that understands what it takes to truly be competitive in today's kit market. 

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I've watched this thread and have a few thoughts (go figure).

I love Snake's idea. It allows Revell to have new product at a lower price point that not only can be a Grandma purchase but also can add value to older molds. Some of those are sitting on my shelf while others I'd buy. The recent build of the Revell snapper by another magazine has really got me thinking about that whole series.

New kits need more than one building version. I think many new builders like the creativity more so than the replica stock building. For example the first two kits I built with my father, okay watched him build, were a 1967 or 1968 MPC Bonneville and GTO with the spy gear. I loved the spy gear as a 10 year old. We need to encourage creativity in building. An excellent whatever with only one option is simply a whatever. Creativity allows it to be the builder's creation.

Revell does need to have more new kits of newer cars but there is the question of sales. How many people bought the Audi R8 or other recent new kits?

The statement about AMT and MPC branding is something that Round2 needs to be aware of. Maybe they should label these as AMT and MPC Classics. Easy change to the logo and it helps original kits maintain some of their value.

Round2 needs to use a new manufacturer name for new tools. Maybe the Autoworld label would be a good choice.

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If I ran Revell...

Pickup trucks. Where are they?? America's best selling vehicle has been a truck for years now. Canada is the same (at least the western half is). All I see on the road these days is trucks and SUVs. Lifted bro-dozers...trucks with sled decks and snowmobiles...trucks loaded with firewood...work trucks...sales lots filled with trucks...parking lots jammed with trucks.

I've talked with people from various places in Europe who rented a full-size pickup truck for their holiday in Canada, because of the novelty factor. There's international appeal!

The 2011-era Ford F150 is a very handsome truck. The Raptor has significant name-brand cachet. The roads are full of impatient young RAM owners passing on blind corners (lol). Trucks are where it's at, and somehow there aren't any kits to be had!  (Other than maybe the Revell snap-tite Raptor and Meng F-150).

If I ran Revell, I'd want to get some truck kits out on the shelves. They're the modern do-everything vehicle and I have no doubt that millions of kids are obsessed with them. 

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11 minutes ago, Spex84 said:

If I ran Revell...

Pickup trucks. Where are they?? America's best selling vehicle has been a truck for years now. Canada is the same (at least the western half is). All I see on the road these days is trucks and SUVs. Lifted bro-dozers...trucks with sled decks and snowmobiles...trucks loaded with firewood...work trucks...sales lots filled with trucks...parking lots jammed with trucks.

I've talked with people from various places in Europe who rented a full-size pickup truck for their holiday in Canada, because of the novelty factor. There's international appeal!

The 2011-era Ford F150 is a very handsome truck. The Raptor has significant name-brand cachet. The roads are full of impatient young RAM owners passing on blind corners (lol). Trucks are where it's at, and somehow there aren't any kits to be had!  (Other than maybe the Revell snap-tite Raptor and Meng F-150).

If I ran Revell, I'd want to get some truck kits out on the shelves. They're the modern do-everything vehicle and I have no doubt that millions of kids are obsessed with them. 

Good point, the US pickup truck replaced the big American car, big is better so it seems, and also here in Antwerp Belgium, we see quite a lot of those US pickup trucks, number one brand is Dodge with their Ram,  then far behind is Chevy (more Suburbans then C series) and sometimes you'd spot a Ford Raptor

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So many modern truck and SUV subjects that would be great to see...like the new Wrangler and Gladiator, the Grand Cherokee Trailhawk or Trackhawk, '19 Ram 1500 pickup, etc.     

And as far as kits that could appeal to adults or kids, how about the beater '70s Camaro from the Transformers movie..

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