3D printing

[Pico]

Thanks for the compliments, guys. "Moving across the arc of media" ? Darn, that's some mighty flighty prose there, Bernard. And I thought I was just doin' the best I could under the circumstances. Chris - excellent explanation about Shapeways quality. BTW, I thought I was the first, and only modeler to use a video game car to make a 3d printed model; but I see in another thread that you beat me by several years. The "Supersonic" was printed by Steven Furick, but I am building a DLP printer, so if I get a hot flash I can bang something out in the middle of the night. 

[jaxenro]

I am wanting to get some parts printed 3D but do not have the design skills or software. Is there someone anyone recommends that does this work on a custom basis?

[CabDriver]

2 hours ago, jaxenro said:

I am wanting to get some parts printed 3D but do not have the design skills or software. Is there someone anyone recommends that does this work on a custom basis?

3DScaleParts on Instagram has done two different custom commissions for me, and did a great job on both

[FredRPG]

There seems to be a camp that believes that current commercial printing is as good as it gets. I work in an industry that utilizes printers that work in micron thick layers and some sintering machines that print metal in molecule thick layers, literally. Granted they are multi-million dollar machines operating in a multi-billion dollar industry, but commercial machines close to that capability are right around the corner. Don't forget it's not just the toy and hobby market driving the advancement, there will be a time not to far away when your local auto parts store or dealer will have little to no stock and print parts on demand. Probably local printers for appliance, HVAC, pool pump parts, or whatever's needed.  Military use for just that, instant (well quicker than shipping anyway) parts in the field or at sea, is already in the works, civilian machines are right behind.

[FredRPG]

On January 30, 2019 at 2:04 PM, Casey said:

I think the thing most people tend to gloss over is there is a fundamental difference between how 3D parts are created and how a model part is created using a two-part mold. One allows for perfectly (or nearly so, far beyond what the human eye can perceive) smooth parts, with graceful curves and crisp, sharp corners which can maintain their integrity, while the other cannot reproduce these features. I hesitate to add the qualifier "yet" to the end of the previous sentence, because I'm not convinced 3D printing will ever reach that point, and maybe it was never designed to. Perhaps instead of thinking about 3D printed parts as a replacement for traditional injection molded parts, we should be thinking of it as and additional option, with it's own unique limitations and features.

Sorry I meant to quote this, like I said 3-d printing has reached and exceeded this point, just not in a form accessible to anyone outside certain specialized industries. But like cars, personal computers and cell phones, give it another few years.

[Flat32]

At my age I have to look at what is available to me now or within a few months.  Existing printers are good enough to satisfy many modelers' needs, but the skills needed to run them are scarce in the hobby.  This hobby is a showcase of what human beings can do with their hands, minds and a few simple tools. The skills they develop are quite impressive and satisfying to them I'm sure.  Perhaps higher technology could harm the essence of what the hobby is.

[FredRPG]

9 hours ago, Flat32 said:

At my age I have to look at what is available to me now or within a few months.  Existing printers are good enough to satisfy many modelers' needs, but the skills needed to run them are scarce in the hobby.  This hobby is a showcase of what human beings can do with their hands, minds and a few simple tools. The skills they develop are quite impressive and satisfying to them I'm sure.  Perhaps higher technology could harm the essence of what the hobby is.

I fully understand what you are saying. I believe the personal touch will always be there, we're modelers driven my a need to assemble and create, but what will change is how you order your kits. Just like it takes specialized skills to create molds and expensive machines to fill them, those will be replaced by different skills and machines. What you won't have to wait for is packaging, distribution, stocking or be bummed when a kit is sold out. You'll order it, it'll be printed and its yours to assemble, modify, customize, btch about inaccuracies, just like we've always done.

About 20-25 years ago I was designing some store displays for a fruit and veg distributer, he told me in ten years all fruits and vegetables were going to be pre cut and packaged for you, might not even be able to buy a head of lettuce.  I thought he was crazy, but he wasn't too far off. Sometimes the future happens fast.

[ChrisBcritter]

22 hours ago, FredRPG said:

 Military use for just that, instant (well quicker than shipping anyway) parts in the field or at sea, is already in the works

"Praise the Lord and print the ammunition"? 

Edited February 20, 2019 by ChrisBcritter

[FredRPG]

More like praise the lord and pass me that small bracket that holds the sensor pod in place. 

[Richard Bartrop]

On 2/18/2019 at 8:49 PM, Flat32 said:

Perhaps higher technology could harm the essence of what the hobby is.

For the past 60 odd years, the hobby has been about gluing together pre formed plastic parts, and despite the initial handwringing over instant gratification, here we are and we generally seem to be okay with it.  Do you really think it's going to make that much difference to the "essence" of the hobby  if the preformed plastic parts you glue together come out of a printer, or from a mould somewhere in China?

[jaxenro]

What I see this being used for also is prototyping parts for resin or metal casting. I see it as a way to produce detail parts or small kits of unique subjects kind of like what used to be called “cottage industry” kits. From what I understand a lot of these printers take time but printing masters for molds I see as a good thing

[Flat32]

7 hours ago, Richard Bartrop said:

Do you really think it's going to make that much difference to the "essence" of the hobby  if the preformed plastic parts you glue together come out of a printer, or from a mould somewhere in China?

If you view the hobby as building a beautiful detailed scale model from a relatively inexpensive styrene kit it is "perhaps" not so good to see expensive taking over.  I love 3D printing, but I can afford it.

[chepp]

An alternative to buying your own 3D printer is joining a local maker space and using theirs. It's a learning experience and they need to have a printer that is good enough that the layers it "prints" are fine enough for your needs. I belong to one in Upland, CA. Their finest printer is a little too coarse for my taste but I think that they will be getting a resin printer that should be well-suited for making 1/25 parts.

[MrObsessive]

14 hours ago, jaxenro said:

What I see this being used for also is prototyping parts for resin or metal casting. I see it as a way to produce detail parts or small kits of unique subjects kind of like what used to be called “cottage industry” kits. From what I understand a lot of these printers take time but printing masters for molds I see as a good thing

Good point as the '67 Shelby 10 spoke wheels I got from Plamoz were indeed 3D printed, then the molds were cleaned up and then cast in resin. Unfortunately they're no longer available after being out just a short time. I suspect it might have something to do with copyright(?), or it could be the mold wore out prematurely and they just haven't gotten around to making a new one.

[FredRPG]

I'd like to share what can be done, again with the disclaimer that this was set up by some outstanding engineers using advanced machines. These were printed as give-aways for a take your child to work day over a year ago. They printed these on a machine with a large print surface, 100 at a time, 10,000 of them over a weekend. Printed as one piece with no finishing (think of 10,000 Shelby wheels, Bill)  If you look closely you'll see a spiral staircase and DNA strand through the middle. Something that could never be done with injection molding or resin casting. This is why I'm excited about what the technology could bring to our hobby. 

[Pico]

This will be my first printing project when I complete my printer. Took a 1/43 scale model, took 50 images of it, uploaded to a site that used the images to produce a mesh, which I downloaded and modified to make it printable. Then scaled it to 1/24th scale. I now have it in a program that makes the supports for printing (in yellow)  and slices it for the printer. You can hire 3d printers with scanners to do this for you, so you can make in 1/24th anything that can be scanned. Of course, it can be output in 1:1, if you are really serious.

[Greg Wann]

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 7:02 AM, jaxenro said:

I am wanting to get some parts printed 3D but do not have the design skills or software. Is there someone anyone recommends that does this work on a custom basis?

http://www.fireballmodels.info/

Contact Joseph and ask him.  He offers a printing service.  He designed and sent me six master tires for the 88 to 91 Ford Crown Victoria resin kit.  Here are some rubbery resin copies.  I use Polytek PT Flex 70 with some black dye added.

Edited February 22, 2019 by Greg Wann

[Pico]

On 2/16/2019 at 9:02 AM, jaxenro said:

I am wanting to get some parts printed 3D but do not have the design skills or software. Is there someone anyone recommends that does this work on a custom basis?

You can hire a designer through Shapeways to make what you want: https://www.shapeways.com/hire/designer

[Pico]

On 2/16/2019 at 9:02 AM, jaxenro said:

I am wanting to get some parts printed 3D but do not have the design skills or software. Is there someone anyone recommends that does this work on a custom basis?

Hiring a designer will cost you $$, so I suggest you download Fusion360 (it's free) and learn it. You can make anything you want with it and you'll understand why designers cost $$. https://www.autodesk.com/campaigns/fusion-360-for-hobbyists

[Spex84]

Pico---yesss!!  I've been waiting for someone to do exactly what you've done here: use budget photogrammetry or "image to mesh" apps and print the results as a beginning point for a model car body. I imagine the results will be rough, but certainly no worse than trying to carve a body from scratch and get everything symmetrical. Then it's body filler and scratchbuilding as per usual.  The particular body you've chosen is inspiring to me, because I really want to do a Ford Comete at some point!

What app/service did you use to create the mesh from your photos?

[Pico]

43 minutes ago, Spex84 said:

Pico---yesss!!  I've been waiting for someone to do exactly what you've done here: use budget photogrammetry or "image to mesh" apps and print the results as a beginning point for a model car body. I imagine the results will be rough, but certainly no worse than trying to carve a body from scratch and get everything symmetrical. Then it's body filler and scratchbuilding as per usual.  The particular body you've chosen is inspiring to me, because I really want to do a Ford Comete at some point!

What app/service did you use to create the mesh from your photos?

Regard3d: http://www.regard3d.org/

This home brew method makes a body with more unevenness' on it than a professional scan but costs nothing. I notice that you have produced a body from a video game download ( I thought I was the first to do that but you beat me by several years - see my Fiat 8V Supersonic) so you know how to modify a mesh for 3d printing. The mesh will have a very high poly count so you probably will have to reduce it using Meshlab. Preparing it for photos is not difficult but it's necessary to know how to do it correctly. I made a turntable marked in degrees, so that I would be shooting at a consistent angle. If you make too many photos on one side, the mesh will be weak on the other side. Make the background featureless. Use a broad, flat light. Use a small f-stop for greatest depth of field, try to keep the entire model in focus. Strip the model and paint with white primer - no highlights - and add plenty of texture to it so that there are many points for the algorithms to refer to, in making the mesh. I like the idea of a Ford Comete, very attractive little cars. Good luck!

[Pico]

Just got this in. The two gray wheels were printed by Model Builders Warehouse and are untouched - no sanding, no clear finish, no nothing. . The larger wire wheel is from Shapeways. It is painted with Molotow chrome, so you can see the surface detail, which is pretty good; but I gave it a light sanding with 1200 sandpaper to knock down the fuzz. The gray wheel's surface, on the other hand are shiny and almost blemish free. This is the best hobbyist 3d printing I have seen. Contact Randy Ditton - randy@modelbuilderswh@com.

[landman]

21 hours ago, Pico said:

This will be my first printing project when I complete my printer. Took a 1/43 scale model, took 50 images of it, uploaded to a site that used the images to produce a mesh, which I downloaded and modified to make it printable. Then scaled it to 1/24th scale. I now have it in a program that makes the supports for printing (in yellow)  and slices it for the printer. You can hire 3d printers with scanners to do this for you, so you can make in 1/24th anything that can be scanned. Of course, it can be output in 1:1, if you are really serious.

If I read this right, we could reproduce these two scratchbuilt engines that way?

 

Edited February 22, 2019 by landman

[Pico]

19 minutes ago, landman said:

If I read this right, we could reproduce these two scratchbuilt engines that way?

 

It could be done but I wouldn't suggest it, because of the amount of detail you would lose. I suggest you download Fusion 360, learn it, then you could design anything you want. To a higher detail level than you are getting with those kit engines.

[Pico]

You would get much better results resin casting it.