ewetwo Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 (edited) I sprayed this 3 weeks ago with Rustoleum 2X ultra “bonds to plastics” primer. Today I sprayed Dupli-Color Perfect Match paint on it. Within seconds this occurred. What did I do wrong? It has to be the primer right? And what primer works with Dupli-Color. I have 5 kits sprayed with this primer on them. Edited February 7, 2019 by ewetwo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 wow! bet that wouldn't happen if you wanted it to... I've seen that before - it's incompatible primer and paint... always a possibility for disaster when mixing brands. Use the Duplicolor 1699 Primer sealer. Skip the Rustoleum primer. Looks like no damage to the plastic so a quick trip thru some Super Clean (the purple pond) will get you back to bare plastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenGuthmiller Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Yeah, your first mistake was using Rustoleum primer! Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewetwo Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 What is a good primer to use? And is any that are compatible with all spray paints? I have a ton of Rustoleum spray paints. Do I use Rustoleum primer for those? Thanks for the imput. It’s greatly appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classicgas Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewetwo Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 OK. I’ll get it tomorrow. Do I soak all of the primed models in the purple pond? The fury is already in there? Or do I spray the Dupli-Color primer over it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spex84 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Wow, is the primer some kind of acrylic enamel? The Duplicolor is probably a lacquer, right? I mix brands all the time, but always test the paint combinations on plastic spoons first. I typically use Plastikote automotive primer with Plasticote, Krylon, or Tremclad(Rustoleum) on top...and Testor's wet look clear on top of all that! The Krylon is pretty terrible, dries with an orange-peel texture regardless of painting conditions, but it can be polished out. Going forward, I'd suggest that you get some plastic spoons and spray them with the Rustoleum primer, and then experiment to find a top-coat that works. Or, strip the bodies and re-primer them with a primer that is compatible with your desired color coat (ie, Duplicolor). Some automotive primers are quite hot and can craze plastic, so again, test before painting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Best to strip anything primed with the Rustoleum so the Duplicolor goes directly on the plastic. Duplicolor makes a couple of different flavors of primers and different builders have different preferences. Some primers are made to spray on thicker so they can fill sand scratches and other problems - but they also fill in molded detail. The 1699 primer-sealer comes out a little thinner, less sanding after primer. A sealer is intended to be a barrier and block anything under the sealer from showing thru the top coats and to also prevent the top coats from attacking anything below. Light coats to start and then start building up layers. I've never been a fan of Rustoleum but that doesn't mean it won't work over another primer. There is a much better chance that Rustoleum paint (not bonds to plastic) will work over Duplicolor primer than the other way around. I'll admit that I'm probably biased, but my opinion is that any of the hardware store paints that say bonds to plastic are meant for plastic shelving and other utility plastics, not the fine work that we do. My rule of thumb for paint advise is that if you have 15 model builders in a room that can all do great paint, there will be at least 15 different methods and none of then will work for anybody else. Experiment, find what works, and that's what you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classicgas Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 (edited) The Duplicolor I showed works fine on plastic. Yes, it is a bit thicker but sprayed properly doesn't hide detail. I always spray 2 or 3 mist coats before a wet one. I use original Easy Off, yellow can to strip paint. Usually removes it overnight. Plastikote works well too if you can find it Edited February 7, 2019 by Classicgas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewetwo Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 Thank you all for your input. It is greatly appreciated. I have my work cut out for me. First stripping the Rustoleum primer. Just to see if Rustoleum worked with Rustoleum. I sprayed the cab of a truck that was primed with the Rustoleum primer with Rustoleum paint and it crinkled in spots. So I guess they are not compatible with each other either. That too will be going into the stripper and the Rustoleum primer in the trash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTallDad Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 As a suggestion... While assembling the kit, save a few large pieces of sprue and use them to test paint compatibility if needed. Yes, spoons will also work, but the sprue contains the exact same plastic as the parts that were on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classicgas Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Ray is right. I will try things on a spare hood from the kit or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youpey Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 i dont remember the rule. you can paint one type of paint over the other, but not the other way. i dont remember if it was acrylic over enamel or the other way. typically i always force myself to use the same type of paint and primer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
440 Dakota Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 your always safest using like products or systems but when mixing brands and types I've always have had success using enamel over lacquer, enamel over enamel or lacquer over lacquer but never lacquer over enamel because the solvents that make lacquer dry quicker are chemically hotter, can't say exactly for water based cause I don't use it but guessing it would be safe over any dried/cured primmer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Enamel over lacquer - YES Lacquer over enamel - NO DupliColor lacquers have a very "hot" base (solvent) and are not really designed to be used on plastics.I'm sure you've seen plenty of vintage AMT kits sprayed with AMT lacquer, and the plastic is heavily crazed-- essentially melted on a very small scale, at the surface. When in doubt, read the MSDS Data sheets for each product you plane to use: https://www.rustoleum.com/product-catalog/consumer-brands/painters-touch-2x-ultra-cover/primer/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 (edited) Was just getting ready to do this same paint format, Rustoleum primer then Dupli-Color Perfect Match. poor thing just came out of the pond from a bout with a “Craft Finish” that was crinkley on purpose. ? color was nice I’m doing the “spoon test” now. primer went down well. Dupli-Color ? We’ll see . . . ? Edited February 7, 2019 by Greg Myers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niteowl7710 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 This is one of those things were I will once again point to just sucking it up and using hobby paints. I know, I know the price of a can of Tamiya primer and paint is more than you all can tolerate. But when it comes down to it, how much money is anyone REALLY saving by using those "big cheap cans of xyz" when we all constantly seeing paint compatibility disasters like this one, or worse yet the paint crazing the body an irreparably damaging it? You got a giant can of paint for $8...how much is your time stripping everything and repainting it all, or trying all the voodoo magik tricks to use paint designed for sheet metal really worth to you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Classicgas Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 (edited) I and others I know have used Duplicolor for years, no issues. As with any hot paint, the key is light coats before a wet coat. I use auto paint exclusively on my car bodies. Never had a issue. Edited February 7, 2019 by Classicgas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 and we should all go out and buy a compressor along with a nice gravity feed airbrush. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewetwo Posted February 7, 2019 Author Share Posted February 7, 2019 (edited) 22 hours ago, Greg Myers said: and we should all go out and buy a compressor along with a nice gravity feed airbrush. I have a compressor and air brush gun. I have to learn how to use them. Just a thought. I could always create this. The Plymouth time capsule. Edited February 8, 2019 by ewetwo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevenGuthmiller Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 1 hour ago, niteowl7710 said: This is one of those things were I will once again point to just sucking it up and using hobby paints. I know, I know the price of a can of Tamiya primer and paint is more than you all can tolerate. But when it comes down to it, how much money is anyone REALLY saving by using those "big cheap cans of xyz" when we all constantly seeing paint compatibility disasters like this one, or worse yet the paint crazing the body an irreparably damaging it? You got a giant can of paint for $8...how much is your time stripping everything and repainting it all, or trying all the voodoo magik tricks to use paint designed for sheet metal really worth to you? Hobby paints are not perfect either. I’ve had enough issues with Testors paints and clear where I have stopped using them. The rule of thumb for me is to use a “good” automotive quality primer, but to be careful of how you use it. We’re painting over plastic, so keep in mind that if you’re using a primer designed for automotive applications, that it will likely be a hotter primer and will need to be handled accordingly. Once you have a good primer base, it absolutely does not matter what you put over it. A good primer like Duplicolor will give you no issues regardless of what you spray on top of it. If you insist upon using some cheap ass bargain store primer, well then you’re guess is as good as anyone’s what you’ll end up with. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewetwo Posted February 8, 2019 Author Share Posted February 8, 2019 I keep learning so much by being a member of this forum and I want to thank everyone for your thoughts and comments. Tomorrow a new primer to try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Spoon test turned out ok. Extra hood test tomorrow. Good idea Lee, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinfan5 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 (edited) Use a good quality primer like Tamiya primers, you wont have issues like this, in my experience, its far better that Duplicolor primers. A real rule of thumb to try and follow is to stay with the same brands when it comes to painting, since you used Duplicolor primer, you should then use Duplicolor paint and then top it off with Duplicolor clear , that ensures 100% compatibly and issues like the cracking will not happen. The other real rule of thumb is to not mix and match paint types, there certain paint types you can and can not mix. When you air brush, you are able to kind of break these rules some to a degree and not have issues, but rattle cans, its a bit different. I everything I just said all has exceptions to it so keep that in mind as well. Put that body in the purple pond AKA Super Clean and it will be as good as new and ready for a fresh coat of Tamiya primer. Edited February 8, 2019 by martinfan5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinfan5 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said: Hobby paints are not perfect either. I’ve had enough issues with Testors paints and clear where I have stopped using them. Well yeah, thats because its the Hobby's version of Rustoleum Edited February 8, 2019 by martinfan5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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