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89AKurt

Porsche 904 Indy

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Next project idea, simply posting to have some sort of incentive to go for it.  Got the vintage Monogram Porsche 904 slot-car version at GSL, which is completely different than the version with an engine.  Friend had the Monogram Porsche March Indy car at the Phoenix model swap meet, I noticed "Porsche" when we started packing up so got it for $5.  I never knew Porsche tried Indy, looked up the history and saw it was a dismal attempt, so no wonder.  The kit isn't worth anything, and nobody seems to like Indy models, so why not hack it up?  The 904 had the nice Fuches wheels and P7 tires, probably Fujimi.  The Porsche Outlaws & Hot Rods topic inspired me.

I have to catch up with other things before getting possessed and obsessed about this project.

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I'm excited for this one after seeing what you did with the Ferrari 475P! Seeing the 904 body on Fuchs reminded me of a series of renderings from several years ago. A quick search reveals that these created by a company Gullwing America to conceptualize a modernized 904 replica based on a 987-era Boxster/Cayman which they called the P/904 Carrera. I'm not sure if any were actually built.

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3 hours ago, lilcraigford said:

I'm excited for this one after seeing what you did with the Ferrari 475P! Seeing the 904 body on Fuchs reminded me of a series of renderings from several years ago. A quick search reveals that these created by a company Gullwing America to conceptualize a modernized 904 replica based on a 987-era Boxster/Cayman which they called the P/904 Carrera. I'm not sure if any were actually built.

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Yes, that's almost exactly what I'm dreaming of.

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Agreed should be interesting.

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This looks like a great project. The lines of that car are beautiful. 

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10 hours ago, Gramps46 said:

This should be interesting to watch.

 

6 hours ago, afx said:

Agreed should be interesting.

 

4 hours ago, Belugawrx said:

Can't wait to see what you come up with here, Kurt.

 

33 minutes ago, fredo84 said:

Go on !! I will follow it for sure !!!

HA HA, when I get to it.  Don't hold your breath.

4 hours ago, Rider said:

This looks like a great project. The lines of that car are beautiful. 

I hope so.  Already thinking about different air ducts, has anyone vacuum-formed clear plastic and covered with yellow carbon-fiber decals?

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Had to look again to evaluate....  it would be better to cut off and glue some parts together.  The biggest issue is where to put the radiators, I should have copied the fans I just used on the Mongrel.

Wheelbase needs to be adjusted, the rear wheels are too far forward on the 904, the first dimension to set is the wheel line to front of engine against the cockpit.  About 3/4" will need to be cut from the chassis.  Thinking the speedway wing should be kept, since the rocket bunny trend is to have wing mounts to go down and mount low, the transmission is perfect.  Might as well have the front wings on it too.
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The 904 body sure is narrow!  May need to widen the bottom, some sort of skirt ground effects.  The suspension should be easy enough to make a narrower track.
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I also pulled out an old WIP, but this new project is still calling me, like I have an addiction or something.

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16 hours ago, Belugawrx said:

and it will sit just right..belly on the floorB)

A little too well, literally sits on the belly.  Will have to tweak the suspension to raise it.

I couldn't leave this alone, *had to* start it, so I could think about what needs to be done.  First sub-assembly was the engine/transmission.  First hack was to hot-wire the body nose so the suspension could be tacked together.  The engine/trans and turbo halves are permanently glued, everything else is barely tacked.
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Found some parts in my stash box from another Porsche kit, since the wheels have lug holes.  Needed a steering wheel too.  Found some rectangle light lenses and door panels.  The Indy gauge cluster should work in the 904 dash pod.
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First thing to look at is the wheelbase.  The tires stick far out, so need to do flares, perhaps 911 Turbo style.  I may shorten the suspension arms, since it needs to tweaked anyway.  The Indy fuel filler will look nice in that hole.   The kit does not have steerable wheels, that is more important to me, than being able to roll (off the table and shatter).
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I want to use the Speedway wing.  This is about how the longer wheelbase looks.  I could stretch the body where the mold parting line runs behind the grill, or better yet add to the front of the engine bonnet, or a combination.  That tiny air scoop is getting reworked!
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The pop-off valve is the highest, and farthest forward projection on the engine, will have to relocate to the rear of the plenum.  You can see the front of the engine is against the seat backs.  Will definitely extend the footwell!  The angle of the wing support is almost the same as the body rear, I'm expecting to separate it and make it swing back on the rear bolts, and have something like a trailer hitch pin to lock in place, because the engine bonnet needs to open.  Will also need to make an air intake with filter, and exhaust with a muffler, and plumb the waste gate exhaust into that.  I have salvaged parts that will make nice spring/shocks to use.
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Looking at how to fill the wheel wells.  I'm now thinking the chassis does not need to be shortened, will move the engine forward instead.  Have lots of body parts to make wheel wells.
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Now I'm looking at the width.  The Mauser gauge is a really handy tool to have.  The width of the 904 body at the top of the lower belt line matches the Indy tunnel, I should try to keep the quirky lip but need to flare out for modern ground effect skirt.
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There, officially started this project!

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5 hours ago, 89AKurt said:

....... need to do flares, perhaps 911 Turbo style. ...

Man after my own heart!

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6 minutes ago, Russell C said:

Man after my own heart!

:lol:

Thought it would be a good idea to draw on paper, good thing to do.  For starters, the engine without modification, is same height as the deck surface.  I can cut down the intake stacks, and slim off the bottom standoff locator "pins", will also turn the plenum around, and make a bigger turbo-plenum pipe.  I also noticed the rear suspension moves the hubs backward from the driveshaft at transmission point, so when I rework the A-arms, that will be fixed.  I also moved the front track centerline forward a little, the fender will get flared slightly.  The engine bonnet will get sliced and diced, extend only about 3 mm, but will also widen the rear end about 4 mm each side while trying to save the PORSCHE script, then will need to transition flare to the front.  Undecided about adding more air intakes, will make the B-pillar ones bigger for sure.  The lower body sides will get cut off, then rotate the bottom outward, keeping the same piece which will need to be lengthened or made into an intake.  The front will get the air dam treatment, can't have a tiny opening and uplift shape, plus the radiator(s) or oil cooler will go there.  The grill over the engine will be much larger, with screen or photo-etch.  Will open the rear for more grill.  I will make part of the interior tub part of the body in the rear window area, that is lame on the kit.  Making the air filter with pipe, and exhaust with big muffler, should be easy enough.  I know it's going to look stretched out, especially with the wing hanging off the back.

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I'm liking the front flares.  The rear flares, may need to be wider than that, and it's growing on me the more I look.  The ducktail is not happening, have the wing.  Now I see the door latch is something to also add, and the tow hook.  Two wipers, instead of one molded onto the windshield.

One interesting thing regarding the Porsche badge, the Indy kit art shows the nose badge, but the decals do not have it!

I sketched over an illustration to see how the front should look, will stick the round turn signals out, move the rectangular lights outward, so I can maximize radiator opening.  Thinking of an air diverter in the roof trailing edge.  The Indy mirrors would look better than those.

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Can't wait to see what you'll do with this one, one of the most beautiful Porsches to me, just needs the Dann treatment to be THEE most beautiful!

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2 hours ago, bobthehobbyguy said:

Interesting idea. Great start.

I'm just weird, admit it.  Thanks!

1 hour ago, Dann Tier said:

This is going to look SICK!!!....reminds me of Singer Porsches!!

:D They are an inspiration for this project, since they are pushing the envelope on resto-rods.

48 minutes ago, dino246gt said:

Can't wait to see what you'll do with this one, one of the most beautiful Porsches to me, just needs the Dann treatment to be THEE most beautiful!

I can't either, putting aside other things I *should* do, since I'm in obsession/possessed mode.  Dann is also an inspiration to me.

This morning was thinking of sliding door windows, and adding oil pan drain plug with a hole in the pan (like what the Modena has).

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I *had to* work on this today, I'm a a roll with building lately, the creative juices are flowing.  This is the first time I have made a jig, I know real car builders use them.  Found some scrap wood, screwed a smaller piece of plywood for the ground clearance dimension, then I drilled two holes in the pan (will be filled when done) and screwed down.  Then I glued the engine down enough so it wouldn't move, but could still pry off later.
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I cut apart the suspension, glued back together with Testors cement and Flex-i-file liquid cement.  I also got rid of the molded on shock/spring units, used cheap lighter valves that I scrounged, with some modification, and made the bottom mount.  I also added some parts box pieces for Hollywood detail.  The brake disks are from a Fujimi, extra parts, the hub is off-cut from the 904 body.  Cut off the wing support, and drilled holes.  Also lowered the plenum.
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Started the body, cut off the bottom and repositioned.  Using pins reminds me of building balsa wood airplanes as a kid.  I glued blocks at the front, will do for the rear after lengthening the body.
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Loving this thread already Kurt.  Especially like the entire initial thought process you're going through and how you want to realize it. Oh, and the car itself is going to be just wild.  Like a better looking 918 on steroids.    cheers, tim

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On 5/10/2019 at 8:19 PM, bobthehobbyguy said:

Coming along nicely. A jig is a great idea considering the slicing and dicing.

It has made a HUGE difference!

18 hours ago, Codi said:

Loving this thread already Kurt.  Especially like the entire initial thought process you're going through and how you want to realize it. Oh, and the car itself is going to be just wild.  Like a better looking 918 on steroids.    cheers, tim

Thank you for looking!

Today was a marathon, it was sort of bad weather to go for a mountain bike ride (that's my excuse and sticking with it).  First off was the most major cut, using the hot-wire, against the steel ruler.  If I ever want to do weld lines, this could be doable.
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Porsche Baja bug:
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Cut a 5 mm strip from Indy body, all gluing was super glue and baking soda.  I made a block for the back end before I cut it off, glued to the base.  To give it a chance to set up completely, I modified the dash, by putting the Indy gauge cluster in, used the top part of the body for the support, radio antenna tube for the column, parts box steering wheel (Italeri Ferrari California).
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Next step was filling in the wheel wells.  Happened to have appropriate shapes, but cut larger and then Dremeled down.
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Next was making the flares.  I decided to keep with the Porsche trademark Turbo style, starting with the Indy sidepod shape, then using smaller pieces all roughly glued together.
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Then I ground out close to the tire diameter.
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I have not modified the front suspension yet, but know how much it will be narrowed.  Just thick flat body parts used, and some of the cowling along the top of the front arch.
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The front needed to be dropped, to prevent taking off at speed.  Really wanted a big radiator opening.  I used up small pieces to fabricate, lots o superglue and baking soda used.
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Shaped with the Dremel, filed, some sanding.  This is the last time I saw one of the light lenses, the body sort of dropped on the floor, and that ticked me off when I realized had not saved them before moving the body.  You can see I modified the interior so there is legroom.
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Wing is very temporarily tacked on, the support is going to be slightly longer, and of course level the plane.  The pop-off valve will show through the grill, and you can see the turbo really good.
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This reminds me of the Moslier, a really ugly but very fast car.

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Certainly starting to take shape now.  The jig seems to be working well.  

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