Current Cup models coming?

[randyc]

I was a big fan in mid 80s.  When qualifying was only on a "local" radio station in NC.  Up till about the CoT.   I think the last thing I built may have been the Lowe's Jimmy Johnson 2006 car when they retooled the kits, Maybe a DE Jr kit too?.   I was losing interest at that point and don't remember building much.  I still have a LOT of NASCAR decals in a box.  

[Vietnam Vet67]

So what all of you are saying is let the cars race the way they come off the assembly line with their front and rear plastic bumpers and their V6 engines and their air bags and everybody will flock to the race tracks. You can't compare the cars of the 60's to todays vehicles. Things change and nothing can stop that.

[Force]

That's not what I'm saying.
The proposed changes will in my opinion make the NASCAR Cup cars loose what distinguished NASCAR Cup racing from other saloon car series.
I mean, they use large wheels with low profile tires and center nuts, air jacks, 6-speed sequential transmissions, individual rear ends, exotic materials in almost any other series and NASCAR haven't had that so far.
I don't think these changes will make the cars go slower (wich NASCAR has tried to do for the last 20-30 years) or be any cheaper for the teams as they all have to start from a clean sheet and can't use anything from the old cars as mostly everything except for engines are obsolete if all changes go through...so it will most likely favor teams with large budgets.
I like the limitations the current rules has regarding the wheel size, tires, brakes, 5 lug nuts on each wheel, 4-speed H-pattern transmission, rigid rear axle and so forth...and for me they can go back to using engine programs based on current production engines instead of the for NASCAR developed special non production engines they have used since 2006-2007.
If you're not careful and letting the development go too far too fast it can kill the series instead of making it go forward, that has happened lots of times before in motor racing...less people watching and fewer teams will do that.

Edited June 19, 2020 by Force

[stavanzer]

3 hours ago, Force said:

If you're not careful and letting the development go too far too fast it can kill the series instead of making it go forward, that has happened lots of times before in motor racing...less people watching and fewer teams will do that.

Amen, Brother! That is what is currently killing F-1, for me. I like Parades.....

But, Not on Racetracks.

[gks1964]

12 minutes ago, alexis said:

Amen, Brother! That is what is currently killing F-1, for me. I like Parades.....

But, Not on Racetracks.

and INDY!!

[bbowser]

6 hours ago, Force said:

I like the limitations the current rules has regarding the wheel size, tires, brakes, 5 lug nuts on each wheel, 4-speed H-pattern transmission, rigid rear axle and so forth...and for me they can go back to using engine programs based on current production engines....

I totally agree with Force.  The current limitations are what link the sport to it's past and make it interesting.

[Force]

NASCAR has a hard time filling up the 40 car racing field for every race as it is now, it's often only 38-39 cars showing up, and the field used to be 43 cars until 2016...who knows if they will ever fill the fields after the changes...it may get too expensive for the smaller teams.
Well it's enough ranting and it's time to move on.

[Mikey56]

I've read with interest what has been posted on here.  Unless I missed something, I don't think any changes to the drive line have been mentioned. At least I don't remember reading about it. I don't think IRS (independent rear suspension) is in the works. I've heard about sequential shift, but don't know if that's on the board or not. Guess we will all have to wait and see what 2021 brings.

Now...back to modeling....several have voiced displeasure about NASCAR and what not, but that doesn't stop us all from modeling cars of the past. SJRM has brought back several oldies but goodies and has plans for more after purchasing a lot of the older molds from Monogram/Revelle.  I like these kits because of the way that they were done and the modifications that you can make to them. With that said, I'd love to see a current cup body made along with the correct chassis for it. I think it would lend itself to being very detailed and having fun doing it.

[Merkur XR4Ti]

Salvino's JR has said they would like to investigate getting the former Revell molds for the Gen 6 cars and to make kits of the current Camaros and Mustangs in Cup.

[Dave Van]

On 6/21/2020 at 11:31 AM, Force said:

NASCAR has a hard time filling up the 40 car racing field for every race as it is now, it's often only 38-39 cars showing up, and the field used to be 43 cars until 2016...who knows if they will ever fill the fields after the changes...it may get too expensive for the smaller teams.
Well it's enough ranting and it's time to move on.

How many are showing up at IndyCar races??? 32-36 max.  So it's not a NASCAR only issue. SCCA Trans Am may have the best fields considering they still have teams run from peoples home garages. 

[horsepower]

On 6/10/2020 at 6:52 PM, Dave Van said:

The new coming car is basically a IMSA spec  racer.  You must buy your cars from NASCAR and no mods allowed.......Go generic car Go!!!!!!

The fact they may require Chevy (Illmor) engines in all cars will be the death....Ford will walk away....and I will too. 

The current chassis are all identical to the point that the majority of the parts and pieces are pre cut and have a chip that has to be in place during tech, and yes they do run a reader over all of them to make sure. And EVERY chassis has to be taken to the NASCAR tech site to be checked to make sure it's built exactly as the rules state and it HAS to be done before the body is even started to mount on the chassis NASCAR issues each and every chassis an ID plate with a number that corresponds to the inspection and if it is repaired that requires replacement of parts it has to return to NASCAR's tech shed and they pull up all of the information that was put in on the original inspection it better match exactly or it is likely going to be confiscated and the team will get a pretty substantial fine for unapproved changes to the chassis.

[Dave Van]

3 hours ago, horsepower said:

The current chassis are all identical to the point that the majority of the parts and pieces are pre cut and have a chip that has to be in place during tech, and yes they do run a reader over all of them to make sure. And EVERY chassis has to be taken to the NASCAR tech site to be checked to make sure it's built exactly as the rules state and it HAS to be done before the body is even started to mount on the chassis NASCAR issues each and every chassis an ID plate with a number that corresponds to the inspection and if it is repaired that requires replacement of parts it has to return to NASCAR's tech shed and they pull up all of the information that was put in on the original inspection it better match exactly or it is likely going to be confiscated and the team will get a pretty substantial fine for unapproved changes to the chassis.

Being in the sport in some way or shape since the early 80's I am well aware of the current regs and the required RFID Chips mandated. BUT today you can still make changes to a chassis and as long as they pass inspection they are OK. HAAS had a chassis mod that made them so good until all others found out. In 2022 there will be NO MODS at all. SPEC racing only. Almost ZERO parts will transfer from 2021 to 2022 car. This all done as a cost saver......right. 

[ZTony8]

From what I've read the changes seem to make the new cars very similar to an Australian V8 Supercar.

[Force]

On 4/12/2021 at 5:19 AM, Dave Van said:

Being in the sport in some way or shape since the early 80's I am well aware of the current regs and the required RFID Chips mandated. BUT today you can still make changes to a chassis and as long as they pass inspection they are OK. HAAS had a chassis mod that made them so good until all others found out. In 2022 there will be NO MODS at all. SPEC racing only. Almost ZERO parts will transfer from 2021 to 2022 car. This all done as a cost saver......right. 

Yeah right. 
Like it will save costs to have to do a whole new car with everything new except for the engines wich still are going to be the same spec, new independent rear end, new sequential gear box, new larger brakes, new larger alloy wheels and lots of carbon fibre and other exotic materials, nothing can be re-used from the car they have today, not even the chassis and drive train.
I don't like the coming changes at all and I think it will benefit the large big budget teams most like Hendrick Motorsports, Joe Gibbs Racing, Stewart-Haas Racing, Team Penske and Richard Childress Racing wich is half of the cars in the Cup starting grid, and the independent teams with small budgets will get a lot more costs, at least initially, and the racing will most likely not be any closer than it is today.

[Dave Van]

Add to it the 2021 Cup chassis is not legal for any other national series.........LOTS of scrap coming!! 

[Vince66]

Actually cup and xfinity cars find their ways into the old K&N West or East series 

[Force]

21 hours ago, Dave Van said:

Add to it the 2021 Cup chassis is not legal for any other national series.........LOTS of scrap coming!! 

There are a lot of "cheap" parts coming on the market soon.
Jerico transmissions, Ford 9 inch rear ends, wheels, brakes and other obsolete racing stuff no one can use in these series anymore.
The NASCAR teams are allowed 12 "active" chassis for each car number and 4 "inactive" chassis set aside for future use (to replace a chassis damaged and irrepairabe after a crash or something like that), and there are 40 teams in the field...all teams don't have that many chassis available to them but the large big budget teams for sure do so there will be lots of left over parts after the change to the new car spec in 2022

Edited April 14, 2021 by Force

[Dave Van]

I ask a buddy that works for a team about a Ford 9"......he said they will be REAL cheap........because most are bent a few degrees for better tire tracking. OK....so how about the center members??? You'd need to change all the gears out for street.....almost the cost off one from a street supplier!! 

I'd buy a roller if it was a car/team I like and had a complete body. I saw one go on FB the other week for $2500.......no gears, driveline, gauges etc.....but good chassis and body. 

[r60man]

I love racing, and I pretty much just build racing vehicles.

NASCAR is between a rock and hard place. The concept of "stock" cars went out in the mid-60s when they went to running Ford Chassis under every car on the track. Safety and other concerns made NASCAR want to move in the direction of a "common template" car, a car that Dale Earnhardt Sr. fought against very much. NASCAR used his death to get the idea through, so now no makers have an aerodynamic advantage.

Quick question, Can I buy a Toyota Camry with a V8? No, I can not. To be fair though most of the things we see running as stock cars are as far from the street versions as you can possibly get.

The single lug wheel is also seen as a safety measure. Other racing series have been using them for 50 or more years. You know the insane penalties for missed lug nuts? Those will be going away.

But there is the crux of the situation, how does it change the racing? Does it make it better? It depends. We are not seeing single driver dominating like they did in the past. This season so far, 9 points paying races, 8 different winners, with the three makers each taking 3 wins. That's pretty good, and a lot more entertaining. How about the races themselves? They are doing different things now, Bristol in the dirt was a good race. Running the Road Course at Daytona was fun, and adding more variety to the schedule.

I really like the direction that NASCAR has been moving since they got rid of Brian France who was destroying the series single handedly.