Oldmopars Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 (edited) I just got the new released AMT/ERTL Payhauler 350. What a nice kit. I want to build a truck and trailer to haul it and I want it to be realistic. The truck brand does not matter, but what should I look for/build to make it able to haul this huge load? How many axles? Would I need standard 2 driven and a drop axle? 3 Driven axles? I assume I would want a larger flotation front tire, but what about the rears? I want it to be era correct, and heavy duty, thinking maybe a Mack DM600, Mack R685ST, White or a REO? It would need a big engine too, any suggestions? Trailer, I know it will need to be big, but how big? How many axles would I need? Would it need a gooseneck dolly? I really have no idea how much trailer I need, and what a good starting point is. Please share your wisdom on this with me. I know there are truck drivers on here as well as just truck nuts. Edited September 18, 2020 by Oldmopars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted September 17, 2020 Author Share Posted September 17, 2020 (edited) Here is a picture I found. Looks like the trailer would be a lot of scratch building. I count 5 axles on the trailer alone. However I did find other pictures of it on a 3 axle trailer. Not sure what is right. Edited September 17, 2020 by Oldmopars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Not the final answer, but here's more information. Wikipedia says the Payhauler curb weight is 36 tons (86 tons loaded). The normal weight capacity for an axle with 4 tires is 20,000 pounds - but it was a little less on most of the trailers that were around at that time. - let's say 18,000 pounds per axle for this heavy duty application. But the axles also have to carry the weight of the trailer. I think what we are not seeing in these pictures is the dolly at the front of the trailer that distributes the load between the dolly and the rear of the tractor. Here's another picture that shows the dolly. Three axles at the rear of the trailer, two axles on the dolly, plus two drive axles on the tractor. Since this truck will have some off highway miles, I'd probably go with a tractor kit that has the Hendrickson walking beam rear suspension rather than a four spring or air ride. hope this helps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShakyCraftsman Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Hey OldMopar Check out my posts on my Pete 359 4 axle heavy haul tractor, my 3 axle Loadking drop nose lowboy trailer, and my 4 axle drop nose lowboy trailer with flip up rear axle. The 3 axle is a 70 ton and the 4 axle is 120 ton capacity. I plan on 3D printing some of the 3 axle and 4 axle trailer parts. The main bed/well of the trailers will be made out of Plastsruct styrene plastic "I" beams, 5/8", 1/2", 3/8" and various other plastic shapes. Right now I only have them designed on Unigraphics NX11, I haven't started them in plastic yet, but there are lots of pictures of them in the posts. The Pete 359 is being built out of an old Revell "Can Do" wrecker kit. It has a Cummins ntc-475 twin turbo, which when worked on can put out over 800 hp! I'm detailing it with all the fuel, oil, air and water lines. Check it out you my get some ideas. Ron G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills72sj Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Here is my triple drive Freightliner and extended deck lowboy trailer. Get at least two of the trailers to start. Have fun scratch building. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim B Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 I don't think there is a dolly in the photo with the blue 3-axle trailer. That looks like the read of the tractor. These articles might help with your build: https://public.fotki.com/modeltrucks25thscale/model_magazine_articles/car_modeller/cm40_nov_1996_conve/ https://public.fotki.com/modeltrucks25thscale/model_magazine_articles/car_modeller/cm39_sept_1996_conv/ https://public.fotki.com/modeltrucks25thscale/model_magazine_articles/car_modeller/cm28_nov_1994_conve/ Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted September 17, 2020 Author Share Posted September 17, 2020 11 hours ago, Muncie said: Not the final answer, but here's more information. Wikipedia says the Payhauler curb weight is 36 tons (86 tons loaded). The normal weight capacity for an axle with 4 tires is 20,000 pounds - but it was a little less on most of the trailers that were around at that time. - let's say 18,000 pounds per axle for this heavy duty application. But the axles also have to carry the weight of the trailer. I think what we are not seeing in these pictures is the dolly at the front of the trailer that distributes the load between the dolly and the rear of the tractor. Here's another picture that shows the dolly. Three axles at the rear of the trailer, two axles on the dolly, plus two drive axles on the tractor. Since this truck will have some off highway miles, I'd probably go with a tractor kit that has the Hendrickson walking beam rear suspension rather than a four spring or air ride. hope this helps What kits would have the Hendrickson Walking Beam? And would it work with triple drive, or just add a standard drop axle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muncie Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 Sorry, I can't recall right off which kits have the Hendrickson suspension... Odd place for it but maybe the Kenworth T600... there are probably others.. The walking beam is a two axle suspension. https://hendrickson-intl.com/Truck/Vocational/RT-RTE A pusher non-drive axle ahead of the tandem could be added. For tri-drive, see Bill72sj's beautiful Freightliner - looks like a four spring with an additional spring suspension for the third axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotnitro? Posted September 17, 2020 Share Posted September 17, 2020 The paystar 5000 has the walking beam suspension i thought..have to check box after work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincen47 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Here’s another one. Looks like a more modern truck and trailer than what you’re going for, but it reinforces your thoughts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted September 18, 2020 Author Share Posted September 18, 2020 On 9/17/2020 at 8:05 AM, Muncie said: Sorry, I can't recall right off which kits have the Hendrickson suspension... Odd place for it but maybe the Kenworth T600... there are probably others.. The walking beam is a two axle suspension. https://hendrickson-intl.com/Truck/Vocational/RT-RTE A pusher non-drive axle ahead of the tandem could be added. For tri-drive, see Bill72sj's beautiful Freightliner - looks like a four spring with an additional spring suspension for the third axle. Thanks again, I thought I had a truck with this on it and it turns out I have the perfect kit. I have an old issue ERTL International 4300 Eagle that I have been slowly working on, but had stalled as I did not really have a vision for it. However it is a perfect compliment to the IH Pay Hauler and it has the Hendrickson suspension that was suggested. However it looks like I may need to add a drop axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted September 18, 2020 Author Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) Well, I now have a direction for this. I did a mock up of what the final product will look like. I used a AMT Lowboy trailer from another build to see if it will work. I think it is going to take a big of creativity to make it fit, but some extensions may just do the trick. I built up the frame, engine and dump box this last week while in a Hotel near a job I was working. Next week I have to fly to to the job, so I can't bring it with me. Anyway, here is where it is currently at with the truck, Payhauler and the type of trailer I will use. I will get a new trailer as this one is in use. Edited September 19, 2020 by Oldmopars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bills72sj Posted September 19, 2020 Share Posted September 19, 2020 What you have there has potential via frame extension. If you get two Lowboy trailer kits you could get very creative with the axle count, dolly possibilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted September 19, 2020 Author Share Posted September 19, 2020 I am thinking I need to order 2 lowboy kits and make a drop deck trailer. I am thinking that the overall height may be too high. If I drop it down, make it longer and maybe even create a dolly it should work. I will extend the sides too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted September 19, 2020 Author Share Posted September 19, 2020 So, I ordered 2 AMT 880 Lowboy kits. My plan is t cut them up, make the lowboy into a much lower trailer like see above, narrow the front to a Goose neck style and add a Jeep Dolly. I may add a drop axle to the rear also. This is going to be fun. I will have 20lbs of styrene and need a huge shelf for it. Below is the direction I am thinking. A bit shorter on the front dolly, but I like the drop down axle at the rear as opposed to a long extended version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mopar - D Posted September 20, 2020 Share Posted September 20, 2020 Scott you’re setting your lowboy up to be an awesome build. I’m going to be following with great interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted October 7, 2020 Author Share Posted October 7, 2020 I have made some progress on this project. I ordered 2 lowboy trailers and cut them up to make one detachable goose neck low boy. I needed a 27-29ft deck and this required 2 kits. I also needed the wheels and tires for the 4 axle in the rear and the 2 axle dolly. 6 axles total for the trailer/dolly/drop axle. The outer rails of the talker use the kit rails, cut, flipped and sectioned back together. The raised deck area was removed and will be reused in the dolly and goose neck. The inner rails and made from a large sheet of styrene cut into 3/4in strips and made into I beams with 1/4in wide strips top and bottom. I wanted the kit parts on the outside because they have details that I would have to recreate if I used sheet. Also the sheet I am using it High Impact Poly-Styrene and it has more flex and give than the kit parts. The kit parts help to make it more rigid. You can see this in the pictures. In the first pictures you can see all the kits being used, lots of styrene. In the last pictures you can see I got some color on the cab of the truck. Its a Duplicolor Ford Gold, I forget what one, but it is a tan/gold. I figured it would be a good 70's color and will work with the kit decals. This is a huge undertaking and has lots of elements to it, so the going is slow. I can only work on it on the weekends right now also because I am always gone during the week. It is way to big of a project to take on a flight with me. Anyway, its progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mopar - D Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Scott looks like you had a very busy weekend building. Your lowboy looks really nice and long. The International is coming along nicely I like the color. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilrathy10 Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Looks good, Man... Always a sucker for a stretched chassis, frame, or whatever... I like your choice of rig to pull this baby, too... Awesome work, Man... I'll be tuning in, next week... Same Bat time...Same Bat channel... ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShakyCraftsman Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Hey Scott Your project is looking great! Ron G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotnitro? Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Very cool looking forward to your updates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRIPTROIT 71 Posted October 7, 2020 Share Posted October 7, 2020 Looking good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted October 9, 2020 Author Share Posted October 9, 2020 What is clear to me from these pictures is, I really need to move that front axle forward. I found out it was an issue with these kits, after I had built the chassis. I'm going to have to get creative so it is not obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldmopars Posted October 12, 2020 Author Share Posted October 12, 2020 (edited) Well, this weekends update is here. I have made more progress on the trailer. The detachable gooseneck was causing my head to hurt. It required a lot of just trial and error to get it to this point. However I think I have something that is acceptable for now. I wanted it to be functional and not just static. So, I copied the real thing as much as I could. In the end, it works and I am happy with it in the rough state. I have more clean up and details to add, but the rough goose neck in there. I put the Paystar on it and I can see that when it is on the shelf, I am going to have to put some supports under it, it is a lot of weight and over time I think it will sag, but it does support it without. I fixed the front axle on the tractor, I had to move it forward. I also finished the interior. I still need to put the glass in, but its ready to go together once the glass is in. I added some decals to the cab. I wanted to use the kit decals, but they were just too old. When I tried to use them, the glue had turned white and chalky. This made them look terrible. So I trashed them and found some from a new kit, the Autocar I did a few months back. Not what I had originally planned for, but I like them, so they will stay. The truck is still just mocked up, lots more to do. No progress on the Paystar 350, but I will get to it next weekend, still debating on if I like the yellow paint I got, or if I want to get something different before I paint the whole thing and hate it. It is a bit more Canary Yellow and I think it needs to be more Orange like a Caterpillar Yellow. I have heard Cub Cadet Yellow is a good match also. Anyway, till next weekend. Edited October 12, 2020 by Oldmopars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRIPTROIT 71 Posted October 12, 2020 Share Posted October 12, 2020 Looks great so far!! Nice work on the trailer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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