A question of curiosity (gluing windows)

[Venom]

Every time I’m about to do it I always wonder which is better or if it even matters... Apply the glue to the window, or apply the glue to the model where the window will be placed???

Nothing is worse than slipping and getting glue on the window where you don’t want it, so I wonder if one way or the other makes this dreaded mistake less likely to happen. 

Any thoughts, personal experience, etc?

[SCRWDRVR]

Which is better I think depends on the project at hand some are better one way some the other. If you use canopy glue or other white glue it takes most of the panic out of installing glass...

[Ace-Garageguy]

I usually tape or jig the window in place exactly where I want it, dry.

Then I'll apply a few drops or a small bead of a white PVA (polyvinyl acetate) "canopy" glue where the parts meet.

It dries clear, you avoid smearing from moving the part around, and it's plenty strong for "glass".

If you get any excess on anything, it cleans off with a damp Q-tip when it's wet too.

My go-to is Micro Kristal Klear, but there are lots more...including plain old Elmers...that work just as well.

They're all water-based, so there's no fogging that you can get with CA, no gooey mess like you can get with epoxy, and no solvent crazing like you can get with tube or liquid plastic cement.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Ace-Garageguy

[Venom]

Interesting, and great info guys. The only glue I ever use is basically modelers super glue and I have never even heard of (PVA/canopy glue)... I’m guessing it is more runny so that it sucks itself up between the tight spots? Also, I never thought to use Elmer’s, but it makes sense that it would work fine, however it seems to me that it would still present the same challenge and I don’t know if it would leave behind any traces if you were to wipe it off.

Bill, is the Micro Crystal Clear a PVA?

[youpey]

58 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

I usually tape or jig the window in place exactly where I want it, dry.

Then I'll apply a few drops or a small bead of a white PVA (polyvinyl acetate) "canopy" glue where the parts meet.

It dries clear, you avoid smearing from moving the part around, and it's plenty strong for "glass".

If you get any excess on anything, it cleans off with a damp Q-tip when it's wet too.

My go-to is Micro Kristal Klear, but there are lots more...including plain old Elmers...that work just as well.

They're all water-based, so there's no fogging that you can get with CA, no gooey mess like you can get with epoxy, and no solvent crazing like you can get with tube or liquid plastic cement.

this is how i do it as well

 

[peteski]

34 minutes ago, Venom said:

Interesting, and great info guys. The only glue I ever use is basically modelers super glue and I have never even heard of (PVA/canopy glue)... I’m guessing it is more runny so that it sucks itself up between the tight spots? Also, I never thought to use Elmer’s, but it makes sense that it would work fine, however it seems to me that it would still present the same challenge and I don’t know if it would leave behind any traces if you were to wipe it off.

Bill, is the Micro Crystal Clear a PVA?

Canopy glue is not thin - it is similar in consistency to Elmer's glue.  PVA just means PolyVinyl Acetate type of glue, and that encompasses several of those water-soluble glues.  If some dried glue remains visible on the "glass"' you should be able to simply peel it off.  It does not stick as well as CA glue.

[Venom]

14 minutes ago, peteski said:

Canopy glue is not thin - it is similar in consistency to Elmer's glue.  PVA just means PolyVinyl Acetate type of glue, and that encompasses several of those water-soluble glues.  If some dried glue remains visible on the "glass"' you should be able to simply peel it off.  It does not stick as well as CA glue.

Thanks Peter.

[NOBLNG]

This is what I use because I have it. It is most likely a watered down PVA of some type.

[TransAmMike]

Exactly what I use but I find if you let a glob of it completely dry the glob or small smears won't come off or remains  visible.  I have that problem right now on acetate side windows I installed that now look like BLAH_BLAH_BLAH_BLAH. Just sayin' LOL.  Maybe I put it on too heavy tho.

[StevenGuthmiller]

My methods will change according to the model, but generally, I'll proceed as follows.

 

I'll start by taping the glass in place with a few strips of thin Tamiya tape to get it into the exact position that I want.

Then I will "tack" the glass with a few drops of UV light setting glue in a few key places to set the glass in place.

Finally, I carefully remove the tape and then seal the entire perimeter of the glass to the body with some 2 part epoxy applied with a tooth pick.

This s a relatively fool proof method to ensure that glue is not smeared onto the exposed glass, and once the epoxy has cured, the glass is very secure.

 

 

 

 

Steve

[Jon Haigwood]

Same thong with the Canopy Glue. Also use it for mocking up parts before final assembly , it is easily removed  

[Venom]

Sounds like I might need to give some different glues a whirl, just to see what it’s like at least. Thanks for the input.

[Tom Geiger]

 

Here’s what I’ve been using for years.

 

And this brand can be found at Hobby Lobby. 

[Deathgoblin]

I usually clamp the clear pieces in place and then apply Testors clear parts adhesive with a brush, thinned a little so it flows under the part.  

[Venom]

[peteski]

I see.  Couldn't you do it like on the 1:1 car and drill bunch of holes and use straight pins as simulated screws?  No glue needed (at least on the window side).

If not, if you could find some sort of glue applicator syringe with a hypodermic need. you could run a thin bead of either canopy glue, or epoxy on the inside corner of the window lip, then place the window in the opening and press it in. The glue in theory would evenly spread onto the lip.

Another idea is to use Bondic (UV cured resin). It already has a hypodermic applicator in a squeeze tube.  Run a thin bead of Bondic in the inside corner of the lip, then put the window in and push it in to spread Bondic evenly. Then set it with UV light. 

Edited December 10, 2020 by peteski

[Venom]

18 minutes ago, peteski said:

I see.  Couldn't you do it like on the 1:1 car and drill bunch of holes and use straight pins as simulated screws?  No glue needed (at least on the window side).

If not, if you could find some sort of glue applicator syringe with a hypodermic need. you could run a thin bead of either canopy glue, or epoxy on the inside corner of the window lip, then place the window in the opening and press it in. The glue in theory would evenly spread onto the lip.

Another idea is to use Bondic (UV cured resin). It already has a hypodermic applicator in a squeeze tube.  Run a thin bead of Bondic in the inside corner of the lip, then put the window in and push it in to spread Bondic evenly. Then set it with UV light. 

Peter, I really like the idea of using pins and never would have thought of it so thanks for mentioning it. I will have to give it some thought, but since I don’t have a way to drill that small it’s probably a no go. I could use a hot piece of tiny wire and melt holes through, but I think that would discolor the glass. ??? ... im thinking that after I paint the trim around the edge of the windows it will be enough to hide tiny amounts of glue. This would be less of a concern if I just painted the outside of the glass, but being a glutton for punishment, I must paint it behind the glass!? This increases my fears of any kind of glue botching the paint where it adheres.

Those holes would have to be just a bit bigger in diameter than a beard hair... where do you find a bit/drill that small? Also, have you ever seared holes through plastic windows? Wondering of the effects... Anyway, I appreciate the ideas you have given. I’m not sure I want to run a continual bead of any sort for fear of it pushing out beyond its boundaries. I really am surprised of the challenge that’s been presented for something so seemingly simple. I’ve installed plenty of windows and never had to put this much thought into it.

[Tom Geiger]

I assemble a lot of my parts with straight pins. I believe it’s a number 72 drill bit. I wouldn’t be too keen on drilling through clear plastic as it’s brittle. If I did I would be using my small battery power drill. I’d put blue tape over the glass and drill through it to avoid scratching the glass in case of slippage and to avoid chipping at the hole. 

You could try to drill both the glass and frame at the same time, but I’d opt to drill the glass flat, then tape it in place using the holes as the template to drill the body.

I would check the pin head size, I believe it’s too large. There are pins with smaller heads, check a crafts or sewing store.

[peteski]

Josh,

Most modelers have a set of #60-#80 drill bits in a standard drill index.  See the following thread for some good info about drill bits.  Don't get the cheap ones from Amazon or eBay. Get the more expensive drill set from a reputable industral tool supplier.  More info below. Some sources are given there by Pete J. and others.

 

The stainless steel fine silk pins I use are 0.021" in diameter.  So for those bit #74 (0.0225") would work well.  Melting the holes on plastic is not a good ideal. That would leave a berm around the hole.

[NOBLNG]

Good info in that thread! I just bought these Vallejo ones the other day, and they are very good quality (made in Spain) and properly sharpened. I would not try melting the holes either, it will make a mess.? What kind of paint is that? If it’s laquer or enamel the canopy glue shouldn’t harm it.

[Venom]

Thanks Peter and Tom... and Peter, that’s a good point about the berm around the holes’ edge from melting.

Well with all these various suggestions from everybody, I’ll have to give it some more thought before I make my mind up on a game plan. Thanks!

[Venom]

Greg, the paint is waterborne.

[Bills72sj]

On 12/8/2020 at 7:57 PM, NOBLNG said:

This is what I use because I have it. It is most likely a watered down PVA of some type.

This what I use as the 2nd step. I first use Testors red (tube) in just a couple of hidden places to give it a strong tack to the roof. I then use a toothpick to "wick" in the Clear Parts Cement pictured above, to COMPLETELY seal the entire perimeter but not all at once. Since the glue will run slowly I tend to do one or two sides at a time and position the parts as to have the excess flow AWAY from the window frame. It some times takes 4 or 5 daily applications to completely seal in a window. I use the same method for attaching chrome bumpers to minimize the "air" gap between the body and bumper. The pieces stay well attached since they are adhered on their entire perimeter.

[peteski]

Most waterborne paints become waterproof once they set.  I don't think epoxy, canopy glue or Bondic would cause it any harm.

[Kit Basher]

FWIW, I recently finished the same GT 40. I also painted the inside of the windows (black). I used a thin layer of epoxy in the rabbet where the window goes. The windows fit well, so just placing them in the opening worked fine. No pressure, so no squeeze out. The hardest part for me was painting silver all the little nibs on the windows that represent the screw heads.