mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 (edited) Hey modelers, I tried to buy 2 sets of (parts I will say) Would rather not give names or what the parts are, I was refused buying them because Im a caster and person would not sell them to me. Im just curious if any other casters have ever had this problem before? I started my business in1994. I have never been refused buying any parts from anyone else because Im a resin caster. I have also never casted any parts etc from any other resin caster and I will not do it. I have been asked by many customers to cast resin parts, and if the part is resin it is for sure NO! Anyone who knows me and has bought from me talked with me etc... know that it would not ever happen. Do I understand where the person is coming from on this? Of course I understand it. Are there casters out there that cast anything resin or plastic from other casters? OF COURSE. We have all seen it before, so yes I guess it does hurt some of us when we want to buy parts. So now I cant buy these parts for my personal use now, I think its crazy. Manny Edited January 14, 2012 by mannyclub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vintagestang Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 That has never happened to me but that is just plain wrong. They can't refuse to sell you something if they are a business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Thanks for your response Patrick. I do agree. It is not a legit business though. Just a side thing. Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemodeler Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 That has never happened to me but that is just plain wrong. They can't refuse to sell you something if they are a business. Patrick, unfortunately a business can refuse to sell you something if they want. There are many reasons why a business may refuse and in Craig's case, it is a fear of copying and reselling that item, despite his refusal to do so. There are ways around that but then that is being sneaky and I haven't found Craig to be that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iBorg Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Every business has the right to refuse service. The only restrictions are (and this varies by state) you can not refuse service based upon race, sex, religion, sexual preference and ethnic orgin. You may think age, but send your 13 year old to buy cigarettes or booze and they should be refused. I'd love to buy Coca-cola fountain mix but Coke only sells it to their licensed dealers. If I were a caster, would I refuse to sell to you directly, yes. Would I buy someone else's product and modify it (don't flame me yet) and reproduce it. Yes. For the most part resin casters do that all the time. How many plastic kits have you seen "modified and corrected" and then cast and sold. You may not like it, but at the core essence of the casting process, it is a fundamental part of the process. How many parts that are cast are straight or modified kit parts? Compare that to the number that are 100% scratch built. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kris Morgan Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Never have had that problem myself. Nor have I ever treated a customer that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Same here Chris, I agree 100% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemodeler Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I think the issue becomes protecting your work when it is sold and copied. The car manufacturers extract a nice royalty from the kit manufacturers when they sell kits, to protect themselves. It has transcended to all levels of kits- Revell must get approval and pay royalities to Goodyear if they want to include tires with the Goodyear name on them. I don't think the top resin casters are copying other resin casters, it probably is more of someone selling a few copies to pay for their resin supplies. If you want to hear problems with people copying your work (stealing is the word that comes to mind) ask Donn Yost how many DVDs he has sold versus how many are probably in circulation! He was just trying to cover his cost of producing the DVD and make a buck or two, not retire to the Bahamas and yet on an earlier topic here members were bragging about how they made copies of Donn's DVD for friends! That is blatant stealing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Hey Mike, Yea I hear ya. I have sold to many other resin casters myself. Parts I mastered or reg. kit parts. It is out of my hands if my parts etc get cast after I have sold them, but i would not refuse a customer. If it is a part that is mastered by someone or myself and gets cast yes I would get upset about it. (some of us casters dont copy others parts) If it is a plastic kit part, with no modifications, who cares everyone casts those. Yea Mike I did read about that Donns Y. dvd's I agree that is steeling. Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
george 53 Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I know QUITE a few casters and call them my friends, not just guys I know who cast. NONE of them will cast someone elses stuff. Their morals won't let them. They're ALL honest guys and just wouldn't do it. We've talked about it and that's how they feel about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Amen George! Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eshaver Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 The same thing happened to me years ago when i was still manufacturing Van accessories ,. I even had design pattents on some of my items . Lot of good it did as "Counterfit" items were rampant in the industry during that time . I saw loads of Bogus A-C filters at the docks of the Houston Ship Chanel seized by the U. S customs destined for a rather large Chain store operation . Ya can't stop some folks , the're just no good. Ed Shaver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Thats to bad Ed i hear you. Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MicroNitro Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 I have a customer that buys wheels from me and a week or two later sells copes of less quality on ebay. I have to do the research to make everything the right size and they just have too copy it. In this case there quality makes them not a competitor. I can see why someone would be hesitant to sell to a competitor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Hey Jim, first of all your stuff is awesome man! That stinks that your stuff is copied for sure. There are some of us that dont copy etc.... so now this means that some resin, or aluminum parts I want to buy for my models I now have to hope that they will sell to me because im a resin caster? I dont think that is right at all. So you wouldnt sell me a set of wheels then? Like I said I do understand, but doesnt it depend on the person and the business without any problems in the past of the current copying parts issues? I figured one set would be sweet on a 69 Nova Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lownslow Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 i buy resin but never copy it or sell it if its OOP resin i might copy but itll be only for personal use Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemodeler Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 i buy resin but never copy it or sell it if its OOP resin i might copy but itll be only for personal use That is how I have always thought it should be- make copies for personal USE, not GAIN! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MicroNitro Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Hey Jim, first of all your stuff is awesome man! That stinks that your stuff is copied for sure. There are some of us that dont copy etc.... so now this means that some resin, or aluminum parts I want to buy for my models I now have to hope that they will sell to me because im a resin caster? I dont think that is right at all. So you wouldnt sell me a set of wheels then? Like I said I do understand, but doesnt it depend on the person and the business without any problems in the past of the current copying parts issues? I figured one set would be sweet on a 69 Nova Manny I will sell to any one even the guy that is copying my stuff. I am just saying I can see how some can get a bad attitude about this. I personal fill life is to short to worry about it and if I keep working hard at making parts the better anyone trying to copy my stuff won't have a chance. I am sorry if I came across like I was justifying someone not selling to you. I was just looking at it from both sides. What do you cast maybe we can work a trade for some wheels Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Johnny Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Just have another friend buy the parts for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 14, 2012 Author Share Posted January 14, 2012 Hey Jim, No problem at all I understood what you were talking about. Pm sent about trading parts. Johnny- Yea I could have done that and I have had many pm's about people who would do that for me and i thank them for the offer. I would rather the person just sell them to me, when Im building the car I would have liked to give them the credit for there parts. Thanks Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boreham Posted January 14, 2012 Share Posted January 14, 2012 Just have another friend buy the parts for you. exactly . . Simple answer You understand the other resin casters comcern/fear and work around it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 What it boils down too is that, that seller will only end up selling less parts. If you master or cast a part and provide it to the public, there will always be the chance that it will be copied. However, not many people will go to the trouble of buying the silicone and resin just to make a few copies when they can just buy them already made. For those that have the sole intention of buying one part to copy themselves and try to sell, that's pretty sad. It is usually well know by modelers who created the initial part. I have people tell me all the time that they think people are recasting my wheels or whatever. I just laugh and tell them that if they want to go to that much trouble, have at it! I prefer that my parts only be cast by very skilled casters as to me, the copy is a reflection of the master I created. I try to make the master as perfect as possible so I expect the same from the copy. The only time I think it's ok to cast someone else's parts is when they are no longer available. Only then would I make a copy and even then, it would only be for me or a close friend. We have to support each and every resin caster out there! Without them, we would not have the thousands of awesome little parts that the model companies never made! You never know what cool things a caster will offer up for sale some day. The only way to have them keep offering new things is to keep them in business! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320wayne Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 Unfortunately Craig, you are dealing with one of the most rampantly unscrupulous parts of the modeling hobby. No offense to those resin casters that actually do have integrity about how they conduct their business practices. I have been doing this (resin casting and creating masters) for about five years now and have seen too many instances where someone was wronged, including myself. There have been certain parts and/or bodies that I have mastered that have ended up on someone elses site with them claiming that the work is theirs. When you call them out they simply lay down the claim that since they made a few little minor changes to the original part that they can now claim it as their own. That being said I can see where some casters may be a little leary about selling their stuff to another known caster. Not that everyone will practice such unethical behaviors but it still leaves the possibility of it happening in the back of your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperStockAndy Posted January 15, 2012 Share Posted January 15, 2012 Oh well, that's their choice to lose the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannyclub Posted January 15, 2012 Author Share Posted January 15, 2012 Right on Ben!! Yea Wayne I hear ya for sure. However I have been in business siince 1994 and have been doing great ever since legit. (DBA, I pay taxes on the business). This is also my main source of income since 1994 and I do side work, body, paint air brushing 1:1 autos. It is true though about other casters casting bodies parts etc, stinks. So you being a resin caster, you have been turned down by another person for buying there parts to use on your builds? That is what happend here, be it that I am also a model builder. So I guess if I quit my business I can buy the parts I would like to have to build. But im sorry to hear about your stuff being copied, ive been there before... Manny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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