AMT T519 Kenworth W925 Conventional

[Bobcat205]

Hello all. Well I was wondering if I could gather a little more info on the AMT KW 925. Well for a while now I been scrounging evil-bay for a nice original example of the kit. Well long story short I found one about two weeks ago in near mint condition still factory sealed featuring the Torsion bar suspension. Well At the time I knew the the AMT W-series were rare let alone the torsion bar suspension and factory sealed. But the price seemed a little heavy. I decided to wait a couple weeks before I made my decision. After reading alot of old threads on the AMT KW's It doesn't seem like we will ever see the 925 ever again, and all we will have left is originals, So yesterday I pulled the trigger on the KW, luckily it had actually dropped $60 on the BIN price so that was good. So my question is, What are these things worth? This is an original T519 factory sealed W-925 with the torsion bar suspenion. But I'm worried that the 925 will never be reissued so I wanted a nice kit for my collection. Any replys are appriated. Thanks! - Brad

[Force]

I don't know how much the tooling for the W-925 were changed when AMT/Ertl did the T-600 kits but the say is that it's not possible to do the W-925 again without some re-tooling...one can wonder why AMT/Ertl did that in modern time, I thought they had stopped modifying tooling irreversable to do another kit as late as in the 90's.

I don't have a clue what a sealed original kit is worth...I suppose it's worth as much as someone is prepaired to pay for it, and we can still get W-900 kits as Revell Germany has one and Revell US has the snap kit, it's only the AMT kits that's no go anymore.

For the Tandem Torsion Bar Suspension it's available on the after market, both from P & P Resin Works and Melbourne Model Truck Accessories, and I have seen some on ebay together with a conversion kit with a resin W-925 cab, hood and interrior.

[highway]

As Hakan said, it's worth what one wants to pay for it.

As for seeing them again, AMT did mess up the models and possibly destroyed them for the T600 kit, but mainly the cab was possibly the only victim of the butchery. I know from having the original releases back in the day, everything in the T600 kit was a direct carryover from the later W925 kits with the spring suspension. Engine, frame, even the interior with the twin sticks and the auxiliary transmission were in the T600, just as they were in the W925. The only differences I ever seen in the two kits were the main body pieces.

[Bobcat205]

I don't know how much the tooling for the W-925 were changed when AMT/Ertl did the T-600 kits but the say is that it's not possible to do the W-925 again without some re-tooling...one can wonder why AMT/Ertl did that in modern time, I thought they had stopped modifying tooling irreversable to do another kit as late as in the 90's.

I don't have a clue what a sealed original kit is worth...I suppose it's worth as much as someone is prepaired to pay for it, and we can still get W-900 kits as Revell Germany has one and Revell US has the snap kit, it's only the AMT kits that's no go anymore.

For the Tandem Torsion Bar Suspension it's available on the after market, both from P & P Resin Works and Melbourne Model Truck Accessories, and I have seen some on ebay together with a conversion kit with a resin W-925 cab, hood and interrior.

Thanks Force. Yeah it sure is a shame that the W925 was sacrificed to make that awful T600. I'm not saying I don't like the T600, But to me it would have made much more sense to produce a whole new tooling for the T600 rather than just put a new body on a 20 year outdated chassis. Its nice that Ertl attemped to make a change and introduce a new kit, But theres really no point in making a model if it isn't a true authentic scale replica. Round 2 has done such a great job bringing some of these old kits back to life that were believed to be gone for ever, Im hoping they can bring the W925 back to life.

[Bobcat205]

As Hakan said, it's worth what one wants to pay for it.

As for seeing them again, AMT did mess up the models and possibly destroyed them for the T600 kit, but mainly the cab was possibly the only victim of the butchery. I know from having the original releases back in the day, everything in the T600 kit was a direct carryover from the later W925 kits with the spring suspension. Engine, frame, even the interior with the twin sticks and the auxiliary transmission were in the T600, just as they were in the W925. The only differences I ever seen in the two kits were the main body pieces.

Thanks, Yeah I don't think I did bad, I gave $140 for it. Its a really nice kit. Yeah I thought it was rather funny when I first found out the T600 was really 90% shared parts of the 925. I think the latest KW I've seen in person with twin transmissions was an '81 W900, As I recall it had a 400 cummins mated to a 6+4. I think a more realistic power train for the T600 would be maybe a 3406 Cat and a 10 speed Roadranger. Maybe Round 2 could retool the cab and bring back the 925. Is it possible to make a mold from an existing part? Couln't an original cab be used to reverse the process to make a new tool? - Brad

[Jim B]

I highly doubt that Round2 will retool the T600 to make it more accurate. If they do reissue it, it will be the same old T625 that AMT issued back in the 1990s.

As for a more correct engine, the 3406B would be appropriate as would a N14 or the Series 60.

[cappy625]

just wondering, would round2 be able to make new molds from an old kit? for example i have a 925 kit opened but not built if i sent them the cab or the whole kit would they be able to use those parts to make new molds?

[Jim B]

I'm not sure, but I don't think it works in reverse.

[highway]

just wondering, would round2 be able to make new molds from an old kit? for example i have a 925 kit opened but not built if i sent them the cab or the whole kit would they be able to use those parts to make new molds?

I'm not sure, but I don't think it works in reverse.

I would say with the technology available today, reverse engineering the molds shouldn't be that hard I'm sure Round 2 could come up with computing power to do it.

[Force]

Reverse engineering has been done in this industry, Revell did that for the Tijuana Taxi and Rommel's Rod, released in 2009 if I remember correctly, the original tooling was missing or destoyed beyond use...so that's for sure a possibillity if one want's to do it.

The question is if Round 2 are willing to spend the money to do it...the later original kits (with walking beam) are not that rare yet as the Movin' On W925 version was reissued many many times up until the T600 came, in fact all my W925 kits are different Movin' On issues.

I guess you can call it bad management and short sighted because AMT/Ertl didn't do a good job when they decided to take a shortcut and use the very outdated W925 kit as a base for the T600, it's not much in that kit that's accurate for a more modern T600 and they would probably have been better off doing a complete new more correct kit, yes it's more expensive to do but I think it would have sold better than this T600 did...and they would still have had the for W925 tooling intact wich allready earned it's keep to make more money of with more reissues as that kit is quite correct for the period it was made.
If Round 2 did a straight reissue of the T600 I think many with me would pass on it, so that kit as it is is most likely "dead".

A more accurate T600 would have a more modern engine and transmission as the ones you mentioned earlier in this thread, there aren't many on the road trucks with the old Hendrickson Walking Beam rear suspension anymore so an 8-bag Air Glide 100, 200 or 400 would be more correct, the front suspension isn't correct for a T600-T800 either, the wheels should be one piece 10-hole for tubeless tires and not the old out dated lock ring wheels that's in the kit.

As you said Brad, the model kit manufacturers are "biting themselves in the rear end" if they don't do accurate scale model kits, the model builders of today aren't that many 6-7 year old kids who doesn't care if things are correct or not, no todays model builders are mostly middleage guys and gals and we are very demanding and fastidious when it comes to model kits as we have developed an eye for details and what looks right or not, and most of us likes to build correct scale replicas.

So if a kit is porly done and inaccurate we woun't buy it, but if they do a nicely done accurate well detailed kit it's another thing and it will have a bigger chance to score a good sale.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Force

[Thatswhatshesaid]

The W925 was announced as a reissue in 2003 but was cancelled.

[Force]

Yes, it was cancelled because AMT/Ertl altered the tooling to do the T600/Canepa 1989-90...someone must have thought the W925 tooling was still usable.

Edited April 13, 2014 by Force

[scummy]

You never know , they been working on the 359 pete small winda for a couple of years and now it's comin out soon . So you never know .

[cappy625]

well if reverse engineering is possible I would gladly send them my 925 kit along with an international 4070a and 4070b kit as well. as long as they send them back when their done with them or send me new ones.

[Bobcat205]

Reverse engineering has been done in this industry, Revell did that for the Tijuana Taxi and Rommel's Rod, released in 2009 if I remember correctly, the original tooling was missing or destoyed beyond use...so that's for sure a possibillity if one want's to do it.

The question is if Round 2 are willing to spend the money to do it...the later original kits (with walking beam) are not that rare yet as the Movin' On W925 version was reissued many many times up until the T600 came, in fact all my W925 kits are different Movin' On issues.

I guess you can call it bad management and short sighted because AMT/Ertl didn't do a good job when they decided to take a shortcut and use the very outdated W925 kit as a base for the T600, it's not much in that kit that's accurate for a more modern T600 and they would probably have been better off doing a complete new more correct kit, yes it's more expensive to do but I think it would have sold better than this T600 did...and they would still have had the for W925 tooling intact wich allready earned it's keep to make more money of with more reissues as that kit is quite correct for the period it was made.

If Round 2 did a straight reissue of the T600 I think many with me would pass on it, so that kit as it is is most likely "dead".

A more accurate T600 would have a more modern engine and transmission as the ones you mentioned earlier in this thread, there aren't many on the road trucks with the old Hendrickson Walking Beam rear suspension anymore so an 8-bag Air Glide 100, 200 or 400 would be more correct, the front suspension isn't correct for a T600-T800 either, the wheels should be one piece 10-hole for tubeless tires and not the old out dated lock ring wheels that's in the kit.

As you said Brad, the model kit manufacturers are "biting themselves in the rear end" if they don't do accurate scale model kits, the model builders of today aren't that many 6-7 year old kids who doesn't care if things are correct or not, no todays model builders are mostly middleage guys and gals and we are very demanding and fastidious when it comes to model kits as we have developed an eye for details and what looks right or not, and most of us likes to build correct scale replicas.

So if a kit is porly done and inaccurate we woun't buy it, but if they do a nicely done accurate well detailed kit it's another thing and it will have a bigger chance to score a good sale.

Yeah I'm with ya man, Couldn't have said it any better myself. When I got my first model truck for my birthday it was the coolest thing (which was a AMT 31005 Pete 359), I didn't care about whether or not the kit was correct or not it was just the fact of being able to build a minature scale truck. That was the whole cool factor of it. But now when we all buy these kits we expect them to be a dead on scale replica. But its really unfortunate about the T600, It could have been a really nice kit if the powertrain was upgraded with the sheet metal. But instead Ertl took a short cut to keep the truck modelers happy. But when we found out what was hiding under the new body the T600 was as good as dead. I actually have two sealed T600A's, I really have no ambition to open them let alone build them, But for some reason I feel I should hold onto them, Good conversation peices I guess. - Brad