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Revell 67 Camaro


Phildaupho

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Thanks Tim.

The roll under of the body is probably acceptable given that it is rather subtle unless you look very close.

Update here. Revell sent me pictures of the two cars they used as the basis for these kits.

They both contained what was called the "Bright Lower Body Side Molding" that was standard on the RS (not SS) Camaros. I have found no indication that so far that this upgrade was available from the factory on '67 SS Camaros, but back then, pretty much anything was possible if you knew the right people at the factory.

Given that information, the lack of "roll under the body" as Gerry calls it, or "tuck under" along the lower door and quarter, as I called it in my review, is now explained. So....just go ahead and foil this area and call it an owner-specified RS bodyside upgrade to his or her car....TIM

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Update here. Revell sent me pictures of the two cars they used as the basis for these kits.

They both contained what was called the "Bright Lower Body Side Molding" that was standard on the RS (not SS) Camaros. I have found no indication that so far that this upgrade was available from the factory on '67 SS Camaros, but back then, pretty much anything was possible if you knew the right people at the factory.

Given that information, the lack of "roll under the body" as Gerry calls it, or "tuck under" along the lower door and quarter, as I called it in my review, is now explained. So....just go ahead and foil this area and call it an owner-specified RS bodyside upgrade to his or her car....TIM

Thanks for the thorough review, Tim, and for that update about that lower body trim. Makes sense now - wouldn't have known that myself, since I have only casual knowledge about these cars.

If the two cars they used for reference both had this trim, the logical conclusion is that they both must have had the Rally Sport package. For me that pretty much clinches it that there will be a future RS version of this tool (even though that was a safe bet, anyway).

Looks like this trim was used for the RS package in both the 67 and 68 model years, although it looks like the 68 may have been blacked out, at least when it was paired with the SS option:

post-13594-0-13749200-1409294073_thumb.j

post-13594-0-74976600-1409294095_thumb.j

It's always tough for me to sort out some of the specifics on these 67-69 Camaros, since certain trim packages/options affected each other. For example, a basic (non SS) Camaro ordered with the RS package would have RS identification on the grille and fenders. However, on a car with both the RS and SS options, the SS badges would take the place of the RS badges. However, I believe the RS badging remained in place with the Z/28 option, with the except of the "RS" grille badge for the 1969 model year.

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Almost right. The Z/28 had no badging at all except the Z/28 badges. Neither "RS" nor "SS" appeared on a Z/28.

Obviously no "SS" badging on a Z/28. However, I do believe both the 1968 and 1969 RS Z/28s did have the "Rally Sport" badges on the fenders:

post-13594-0-80356300-1409298469_thumb.j

post-13594-0-82067500-1409298483_thumb.j

Might be a little tough to see, but they're there on both the above cars. The 68 also had the "RS" grille emblem. In 69, they started adding Z/28 grille emblems, so I believe that's why they eliminated the "RS" grille emblem in 69.

There was no external Z/28 badging in 67, just the dual paint stripes.

Another thing that makes it tough to keep all this straight is just how many fake RS, SS, and Z/28 Camaros have been created over the years, and an awful lot of the people doing it don't get all of the details right.

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For T/A racing in 67 and 68, the Penske cars ran American Racing 5 spokes, so one of the Revell C3 Corvette race cars would be a good kit for those. In 67 they ran a flat (not the SS) hood with a NASCAR-like cowl induction air cleaner ducted into the cowl panel. They also ran yellow stripes.

So we need a base car flat hood, AR 5 spokes, Stripe decals, etc to make an accurate 67 Penske car.

Edited by OutaFocus
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And if you want to run Torq-Thrust wheels, you can probably rob them from the '68 Mustang Cobra Jet, because it comes w/ the parts to make a Bullitt car, and they are the goofy wheels that are bigger than they should be that fit *inside* the hollow tires.

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Scott is correct about the 67 Camaro. I don't think Minilites came into play for any team until sometime in the 68 season. Ford didn't run Minilites until 70. I did confirm last night that the Penske Camaro only use the roll hoop with two down bars, a least for most of 67. I know of two "69 Z-28's" in my area that started life as something else. One was a big block 396. It's been tubed and may still have the 396 in it. But it has all the badging and strips of a "Z". It's silver and is a beautiful car but not a "Z". The other one is yellow with black strips. I'm told it was once a six but don't know for sure. It's also very attractive. At least the guy with the Silver car doesn't try to pass it off as an original Z.

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That just goes to show that if they don't have people tracking down 100% correct stock cars to document for kits that things happen so it's not all revells fault

How is it NOT Revell's fault for not getting an accurate example of the correct car? That's like the recent Nova, not having all original factory stock parts on the 1:1 led to the kit not being accurate. Sound like its completely the fault of Revell.

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Obviously no "SS" badging on a Z/28. However, I do believe both the 1968 and 1969 RS Z/28s did have the "Rally Sport" badges on the fenders:

attachicon.gif68blkrszfrnt.jpg

attachicon.gif69camjl8frnt2.jpg

Might be a little tough to see, but they're there on both the above cars. The 68 also had the "RS" grille emblem. In 69, they started adding Z/28 grille emblems, so I believe that's why they eliminated the "RS" grille emblem in 69.

There was no external Z/28 badging in 67, just the dual paint stripes.

Another thing that makes it tough to keep all this straight is just how many fake RS, SS, and Z/28 Camaros have been created over the years, and an awful lot of the people doing it don't get all of the details right.

I don't see what you are referring to when you say there are RS emblems on those cars. I don't see any.

There was no conflicting badging on Z/28s. They had the 'Camaro' script on the fenders behind the front wheel wells, but the only badging on the cars was the Z/28 emblem. Actual 67 and 68 Z/28s had grille, front fender and rear panel Z/28 emblems, just like the 69.

Guido and James are right about another point: There are so many 'other' Camaros that have been adulterated by adding Z/28 emblems to various iterations (including 6 cyl base models, RS, SS, and SS396 models) that you have to be careful about looking at individual units. Is it a REAL Z/28 or is it a poser?

Chevy Parts guys sold A LOT of Z/28 emblems!

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Update here. Revell sent me pictures of the two cars they used as the basis for these kits.

They both contained what was called the "Bright Lower Body Side Molding" that was standard on the RS (not SS) Camaros. I have found no indication that so far that this upgrade was available from the factory on '67 SS Camaros, but back then, pretty much anything was possible if you knew the right people at the factory.

Given that information, the lack of "roll under the body" as Gerry calls it, or "tuck under" along the lower door and quarter, as I called it in my review, is now explained. So....just go ahead and foil this area and call it an owner-specified RS bodyside upgrade to his or her car....TIM

I did mean to say tuck under, but had some stuff going on that distracted me.

I picked one up yesterday to compare out with AMT 67 Z/28 kit I have. I checked the R&MofM custom interior transkit, which is for the AMT, and it would some work to get it to fit given the AMT is a tub interior.

Another thing I noticed is that the Revell kit does have the rear shocks non-staggered, but does have multi-leaf rear springs. As far as I know, mono-leafs were it for 67. Many people upgraded to multi-leaf to address wheel hop. The web is loaded with vendors selling these for upgrades. It wouldn't surprise me that the 1:1's they used as a basis had multi-leafs added. But, this is again something that would be more interest to those doing replica stock and wanting more accuracy.

I also picked up the new ZL-1 and will compare to the AMT and also look at adapting the full detail 2010 chassis to this. Just wondering how to deal with the forthcoming C7.

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I posted a pic and a link to the monoleafs awhile back.

I don't have 67 yet, haven't dug out 69's to check layout, part sharing. Lots of mono's got changed to multileaf, but it is entirely incorrect.

Not as egregious and body/trim flaws, and reasonable to fix sanding the bejeebus out of them, but 2 seconds on Google finds tons of articles. The hemmings link is great looking 67 BB convertible.

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The thing is there are well known authorities of these subjects out there. Mopar muscle= Govier, Ford muscle = Perkins and Gm has Macneish. There are others but these men invented rivet counting! They know the subject they have forgotten more than most of us will ever learn lol. Why are the companies not using them? They pay foose fees for models that don't even sit the way he intended! These guys time would be money better spent. I would also like to point this out. Some of you are hyper critical on these kits and accuracy. How many OWN any collector cars ? That is my other hobby. Now, reason I ask is this. I built a first issue torino cobra for a friend who owns one. I knew the quarter panels were not quite right but I didn't fix them. Guess what? He never even noticed that! He looked at that car for a solid hour when he got it. Even put it on the roof of his real one!! What I'm getting at is that some of you cry that the sky is falling and real owners of these cars don't see the things you guys nit pick about. Buy them, build them and enjoy them. If the little things are too much to take then I suggest you try and restore a real car to a high level. Then you will really see what sweating the details is about. I'm sorry for the rant but it upsets me when I come in here to look at all the exciting new things that every time it turns into a gong show over things that are for the most part easy fixes! Sure they maybe could have done a little better but I'm not going to lose sleep and refuse to buy it like some of you. It's a great time to be in the hobby. Remember that!

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The thing is there are well known authorities of these subjects out there. Mopar muscle= Govier, Ford muscle = Perkins and Gm has Macneish. There are others but these men invented rivet counting! They know the subject they have forgotten more than most of us will ever learn lol. Why are the companies not using them? They pay foose fees for models that don't even sit the way he intended! These guys time would be money better spent. I would also like to point this out. Some of you are hyper critical on these kits and accuracy. How many OWN any collector cars ? That is my other hobby. Now, reason I ask is this. I built a first issue torino cobra for a friend who owns one. I knew the quarter panels were not quite right but I didn't fix them. Guess what? He never even noticed that! He looked at that car for a solid hour when he got it. Even put it on the roof of his real one!! What I'm getting at is that some of you cry that the sky is falling and real owners of these cars don't see the things you guys nit pick about. Buy them, build them and enjoy them. If the little things are too much to take then I suggest you try and restore a real car to a high level. Then you will really see what sweating the details is about. I'm sorry for the rant but it upsets me when I come in here to look at all the exciting new things that every time it turns into a gong show over things that are for the most part easy fixes! Sure they maybe could have done a little better but I'm not going to lose sleep and refuse to buy it like some of you. It's a great time to be in the hobby. Remember that!

Truth. lol

It upsets me more when someone is careless or lazy enough to not take pride and put good solid craftsmanship into their own 1:1 project vehicle than anything. I have a friend who painted under hood of is '86 LX coupe with "heat resistant bbq grille paint" and isnt worried about the rust holes in his torque boxes, or the holes in the floor he's going to patch with flashing and caulk... like... really dude you have an aluminum headed 302 that is a MACHINE and you're putting not fixing the death trap that its in??

Thats the kind of stuff that really irks me. model cars are model cars to me. I love building them, but I do it for me. I dont go crazy detailed on them, or care if they have an uncontrolable flaw. such is life. It's just plastic.

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I don't see what you are referring to when you say there are RS emblems on those cars. I don't see any.

There was no conflicting badging on Z/28s. They had the 'Camaro' script on the fenders behind the front wheel wells, but the only badging on the cars was the Z/28 emblem. Actual 67 and 68 Z/28s had grille, front fender and rear panel Z/28 emblems, just like the 69.

Guido and James are right about another point: There are so many 'other' Camaros that have been adulterated by adding Z/28 emblems to various iterations (including 6 cyl base models, RS, SS, and SS396 models) that you have to be careful about looking at individual units. Is it a REAL Z/28 or is it a poser?

Chevy Parts guys sold A LOT of Z/28 emblems!

1969 RS Z/28s had the name rally-sport on the front fenders behind the front tires.I helped a friend restore a real one.

I'm pretty sure that 68 RS Z/28s had the name rally-sport on the front fenders too.

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Fred, I've restored, shown, and raced lots of stuff. Errors are errors. Not like it's hard to check anymore. Try tracking stuff down pre-internet, using mags, "original" cars, etc. No excuse today. Guys on this board know lots more than I, but sources still plentiful. If we can do it, why can't the source do it?

If 1:1 guys don't care, awesome. Less stress.

Show at any big show, PB, FCA, PCA, JCNA, Meadowbrook, etc. You'll get busted so fast your head will spin.

So problems just yell, can't see anything else. Monoleaf spring is easy fix, I don't care, and shared tooling I hope with 69 is root of that. But trim, body contours, etc. just can't get screwed up.

If modeling a BB SS, don't use SB RS to measure. Figure out what rockers differ, etc. to have more than one version, but get most of it right.

Just like the hair in the burger, you miss it, cool. You see it, and not cool.

Jesse, amazes me that people kluge stuff like that. Some idiot car shows do that, big new motor and cosmetics, no brakes/diff/suspension. Lame and dangerous.

Edited by keyser
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I'm not saying this is a bad kit. The '70 'Cuda and '90 Mustang LX hold those titles currently.

Sorry, can't let this one go by. The '70 'cuda is not a bad kit, in actual fact, if you build one, you'll find out it's the best kit yet of that make and model. We've been over this before. Could it be better? Yes, no doubt, there are about ten minor tweaks that would benefit the body execution, and a couple of minor parts fit tweaks that would help. But overall, it yields an outstanding replica out of the box, gives you a great choice of correct factory options, and provides the basis for kitbashing yet other alternatives. A review of the completed builds of this kit, both on this and the other boards, as well as in our favorite model car magazines, proves this point.

I can't comment intelligently on the '90 LX as I have not built it, but many others have, and I accept their verdict.

TB

Edited by tim boyd
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I don't see what you are referring to when you say there are RS emblems on those cars. I don't see any.

There was no conflicting badging on Z/28s. They had the 'Camaro' script on the fenders behind the front wheel wells, but the only badging on the cars was the Z/28 emblem. Actual 67 and 68 Z/28s had grille, front fender and rear panel Z/28 emblems, just like the 69.

Guido and James are right about another point: There are so many 'other' Camaros that have been adulterated by adding Z/28 emblems to various iterations (including 6 cyl base models, RS, SS, and SS396 models) that you have to be careful about looking at individual units. Is it a REAL Z/28 or is it a poser?

Chevy Parts guys sold A LOT of Z/28 emblems!

Well, to see the Rally Sport embems in the pictures I posted, you'd actually need to LOOK at the pictures... :rolleyes: And I never said there was "conflicting" badging on anything.

My only point in all this was that if you want to build an accurate model of a Z/28 for any of these years (1967, 1968, 1969), you need to do your research, since there were lots of little changes year to year.

I do need to respectfully disagree with you on a couple issues:

The 1967 Z/28 was a quickie rush job to homologate all the mechanical parts (mainly the 302 engine) for the Trans Am class in SCCA. As someone else stated earlier, there were only 602 made. They had rally wheels and the dual paint stripes, but there were no Z/28 badges anywhere on a 1967 Z/28. Here's an article from Jeff Smith at Car Craft: he was able to buy an actual 1967 Z/28 for peanuts back in the day because the guy selling it didn't know what he had, since there was no Z/28 badging on these cars:

http://www.carcraft.com/featuredvehicles/ccrp_0909_1967_chevrolet_camaro/

In 1968, Chevy did add Z/28 emblems at the front of the fenders, but I don't believe there were any Z/28 emblems from the factory on either the grille or the tail panel in 1968. If a standard Camaro was ordered with the Z/28 option, it would still have the Camaro script on the fenders, behind the front wheels. However, a Camaro with the RS option and the Z/28 option would have the "rally sport" emblems in this location, instead, NOT "Camaro":

post-13594-0-97546100-1409397888_thumb.j

The grille would also have this RS emblem in the center:

post-13594-0-90713900-1409398110.jpg

Both of these emblems are clearly visible in the pic I posted previously:

post-13594-0-45037300-1409398178_thumb.j

The rear of this car would also have an "rs" gas cap, too. All of the Rally Sport identifiers remained in place on a 1968 Z/28 with the RS option.

For 1969, Chevy still put the Z/28 emblems on the front of the fenders, but as you stated they also installed Z/28 emblems on the grille and the tail panel. If a 1969 Camaro was ordered with both the RS package and the Z/28 option, the big "RS" emblem in the center of the grille was not included, just the Z/28 emblem on the driver's side. The "RS" emblem on the tail panel would also be replaced with a Z/28 emblem (forgot about that previously). There would, however, still be "rally sport" emblems on the fenders, behind the front wheels, in the location where the "Camaro" script would otherwise be located on a non-RS car:

post-13594-0-37111900-1409399181_thumb.j

post-13594-0-37482700-1409399195_thumb.j

Edited by Robberbaron
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