mike 51 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) That's a good point, really. The AMT 5-window and sedan kits share a frame, and it's fine. Tooling a correct 3-window body to offer in new packaging, using the existing frame tooling, could work nicely. The odd thing about these two kits is that the hoods and grilles of both of them should interchange, just as they do on the real cars. But for some odd reason, the hoods, grilles and cowls are different. Tooling money could have been SAVED by getting the cowls right on both models, so the same tooling could have been used to produce both sets of hoods and grilles. AMT realized both kits could share the same frames and guts, but missed it on the hoods / grilles. I forget right off hand WHICH of the two kits has most accurate hood-grille-cowl, but they're both off (I've measured real cars to verify this). But "AMT" is no longer with us and Round2 doesn't seem interested in making (or modifiying) new tools so....if a really good 34 is desired it seems like Revell would be the company to make it. They've got enough "practice" now to really do a great kit if they decided to. Edited July 11, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) But "AMT" is no longer with us and Round2 doesn't seem interested in making (or modifiying) new tools so.... What about the recently re-issued AMT (Round2) '36 Ford (late 2013, I believe) and the '32 Vicky (March 2015), with included parts from the early issues (that haven't been available for years) back-engineered and newly tooled? I believe there are others... Edited July 11, 2015 by Ace-Garageguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) What about the recently re-issued '36 Ford (late 2013, I believe) and the '32 Vicky, with included parts from the early issues (that haven't been available for years) back-engineered and newly tooled? I believe there are others... I haven't seen either of them so I don't know....are those parts "new" or was it a matter of using the "whole" original tooling? I do think "fixing" the 34 would be much more "ambitious". But I'd be happy to be wrong I really would. If they decide to "fix" one, I'd really like a 33-34 Tudor. Edited July 11, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) I haven't seen either of them so I don't know....are those parts "new" or was it a matter of using the "whole" original tooling? I do think "fixing" the 34 would be much more "ambitious". But I'd be happy to be wrong I really would. If they decide to "fix" one, I'd really like a 33-34 Tudor. http://www.round2models.com/models/amt/32-ford-victoria http://www.round2models.com/models/amt/ford-coupe Links to the Round2 site, proclaiming "newly tooled" parts. I believe'em, because there are differences between the originals in my collection and the new ones. Reworking the existing '34 5-window body shell into a good 3-window shouldn't be that difficult, really...assuming all the data for the 5-window exists in CAD form still. Edited July 11, 2015 by Ace-Garageguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) http://www.round2models.com/models/amt/32-ford-victoria http://www.round2models.com/models/amt/ford-coupe Links to the Round2 site, proclaiming "newly tooled" parts. I believe'em, because there are differences between the originals in my collection and the new ones. Reworking the existing '34 5-window body shell into a good 3-window shouldn't be that difficult, really...assuming all the data for the 5-window exists in CAD form still. Thanks for the "proof" Bill..but I woulda believed you without it I hope to see my roadster n tudor from Revell (if I live long enough) I know they *can* do it. Look what they did with the 32s. BTW..do you or anyone else know why the AMT 5 window had a separate rear window surround? Edited July 11, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) Maybe we could get Tamiya interested in doing a 34. I just got their '36 Toyota, while it's "only" a curbside kit, it is beautifully done. Edited July 11, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Longbox55 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 You know, as big as US style hot rods and customs are getting in Japan, I'm somewhat surprised that none of the Japanese kit companies haven't gotten into that subject matter. Granted, they may have a Japanese flair to them, but that's something that could be dealt with easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 (edited) You know, as big as US style hot rods and customs are getting in Japan, I'm somewhat surprised that none of the Japanese kit companies haven't gotten into that subject matter. Granted, they may have a Japanese flair to them, but that's something that could be dealt with easily. Yes they are very popular. The 1/35 folks get all kinds of neat 30/40s cars n trucks....in the "right" scale we could have a lot of new raw material. Edited July 11, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted July 11, 2015 Author Share Posted July 11, 2015 Thanks for the "proof" Bill..but I woulda believed you without it Still, that's what makes these threads so informative. 1 picture = 1000 words Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Still, that's what makes these threads so informative. 1 picture = 1000 words But it *was* words *this* time....the pics didn't make his point. The last 32 Vickie I got was 25 years ago..squashed body in a perfect box and the last AMT 36 I got was even longer ago, perhaps an original issue at that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted July 12, 2015 Author Share Posted July 12, 2015 Cheer up. The new ones are better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Lacy Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 The odd thing about these two kits is that the hoods and grilles of both of them should interchange, just as they do on the real cars. But for some odd reason, the hoods, grilles and cowls are different. There's a good reason for this. The shape of the fenders in the 5-Window are significantly different from the Sedan versions. The 5-Window fenders are much more accurate in shape and size. The Sedan fenders are terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 There's a good reason for this. The shape of the fenders in the 5-Window are significantly different from the Sedan versions. The 5-Window fenders are much more accurate in shape and size. The Sedan fenders are terrible. Yes, and therein lies more of the problem, and I should have elaborated. Which kit came first...5-window or sedan? If it was the 5W to be tooled first, what happened? If I recall correctly, the only difference in 1:1 '33 and '34 front passenger car fenders is how they're shaped to fit the grille-shells. Since AMT realized the frame tooling could be used for both cars, I never understood why, to get the '33 version of the sedan, they just didn't modify the pretty good '34 fenders to fit the '33 grille-shell, and copy the shape of the 5W cowl exactly. Modify the rear fenders slightly to fit the Tudor sedan body, if required. Same thing to get the '34 version of the sedan, but of course, use the 5W front fenders, grille, cowl shape and hood, and simply modify the rear fenders if required. On the other hand, if the '33 sedan came first, the '34 5W is a vast improvement. Which way did it happen?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austin T Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Nope, plenty of them out there already, anyway that is what the resin market is for. If there was wagon or four door I'm sure this would change things. Glad to see you looked into the aftermarket community. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 The sedan came first Bill...so maybe the 4th try (if there is one) might do the trick...or maybe the 5th? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dennis Lacy Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Yes, and therein lies more of the problem, and I should have elaborated. Which kit came first...5-window or sedan? If it was the 5W to be tooled first, what happened? If I recall correctly, the only difference in 1:1 '33 and '34 front passenger car fenders is how they're shaped to fit the grille-shells. Since AMT realized the frame tooling could be used for both cars, I never understood why, to get the '33 version of the sedan, they just didn't modify the pretty good '34 fenders to fit the '33 grille-shell, and copy the shape of the 5W cowl exactly. Modify the rear fenders slightly to fit the Tudor sedan body, if required. Same thing to get the '34 version of the sedan, but of course, use the 5W front fenders, grille, cowl shape and hood, and simply modify the rear fenders if required. On the other hand, if the '33 sedan came first, the '34 5W is a vast improvement. Which way did it happen?? I grew up around '33/'34 Ford's and as far as I know, the front fenders are interchangeable. The inner fender panels that fill the gap between them and the top of the frame are '33/'34 specific, but I can't remember if it's simply in the stamping detail or the actual fit of the part. The '33 Sedan street rod and '34 Sedan stocker came first in the 80's. Everything about the shape of all of the "sheet metal" is horrible. In fact, it just plain sucks. Especially for me because I'm intimately familiar with these Sedans because my Dad has owned an incredibly nice original '34 for 20 years now. I would love to build a basic model of it but the shape of the kit is so bad I just can't bring myself to. The '34 5-Window "sheet metal" is, like you said, a vast improvement in every way. Not perfect, but tons better than the Sedan attempt. The shape of the grille is improved over the "34" Sedan, too. I don't understand, at all, why they decided to make the rear window opening on the coupe a separate part, through. There's no advantage to it and it's certainly not the case on a real one. Just makes extra work for the builder. The biggest issue with the 5-Window, for me, is that the hood is too long. Which is weird, because the shape of the front fenders look right. I'm willing to bet that this was done to accommodate the optional small block Chevy engine because in reality, there's absolutely no way you can fit one with a giant HEI distributor without modifying the firewall and even with the smaller late 50's and early 60's distributor there still has to be a bit of a relief in the very center of the firewall for clearance. Since the firewall is a separate part in these kits it's pretty ridiculous that they couldn't include an additional modified firewall for the Chevy engine. Then again, if the Chevy engine were shoved back (so the hood length was correct) then there probably would be interference issues between it's 4-speed trans and frames center "X". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luc Janssens Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Think it will be a hard sell Greg, better find the best sales wrap to push this idea through... Maybe all the knowledgeable '33-34 Ford people on board, should stick their heads together and form a think tank and build a case on why an all new kit and what the content from it and it's siblings will have to be. This could send a positive vibe towards people in the industry, who're tired off all of the negativity vented here.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted July 13, 2015 Author Share Posted July 13, 2015 Thought fodder for Revell when their new '28-'31 A's run their course. 5 Year plan, gotta keep looking ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted July 13, 2015 Author Share Posted July 13, 2015 Where to go from here ? Maybe just a straight reissue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 This could send a positive vibe towards people in the industry, who're tired off all of the negativity vented here.... I'm guessing the success of the last couple of new models will keep them "happy", very happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) Where to go from here ? Maybe just a straight reissue. It sure would be nice to have both the 36 (and 34too) coupes to have one piece body shells since you can't really build both versions out of one kit. Maybe make the convertibles into roadsters. Sometimes the 2n1 concept just doesn't work that well. Edited July 13, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) I honestly hope the '28-29 roadster and the '30-'31 coupe (assuming we get it) are both out-of-the-park home runs. I WANT them to be successful, and I WANT to buy multiples because they're so good. So I hope they're really really good. And IF they're really really good, and the vocal critics like me buy multiples because we're so dammed impressed with Revell's work, and if everybody else buys a bunch of them...as they're apparently doing with the '57 Ford wagon...maybe Revell (or somebody) will seriously consider doing a GOOD '34 3-window. Many many modelers have wanted a new-tool model-A for a long time (and a source of styrene traditional rod bits), and it's finally almost here. Maybe it's the start of lotsa good things to come. Edited July 13, 2015 by Ace-Garageguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Whatever happened to the AMT 28 Tudor? Gone for good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Whatever happened to the AMT 28 Tudor? Gone for good? It shares nothing with the quite good (even though it's ancient) AMT '28 roadster, and my understanding is that it's an MPC tool. Who knows the real deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 51 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 (edited) I honestly hope the '28-29 roadster and the '30-'31 coupe (assuming we get it) are both out-of-the-park home runs. I WANT them to be successful, and I WANT to buy multiples because they're so good. So I hope they're really really good. And IF they're really really good, and the vocal critics like me buy multiples because we're so dammed impressed with Revell's work, and if everybody else buys a bunch of them...as they're apparently doing with the '57 ford wagon...maybe Revell (or somebody) will seriously consider doing a GOOD '34 3-window. Many many modelers have wanted a new-tool model-A for a long time (and a source of styrene traditional rod bits), and it's finally almost here. Maybe it's the start of lotsa good things to come. I agree..I think the 29 roadster will be a hit...My only concern about it (and the coupe) is that it doesn't have a stock fender option (and providing accurate ones would be a major rework to the frames n body on the roadster) which may limit the interest in them. I'd love to see Revell do a line of 34s like they have with the 32's....but that could take years I might not have. Edited July 13, 2015 by mike 51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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