"The Rumour Mill"

[SteveG]

On 6/14/2022 at 6:14 PM, StevenGuthmiller said:

I have to say, that if it was the “Super Fly” Grand Prix,  what a huge disappointment that would be!!!!

To bring back that abomination and not the stock ‘72 Grand Prix would be a real kick in the head!

It’s for that reason that I have strong doubts about that possibility.

grand

I wouldn't be doing all-new tooling of 71-72 Pontiac Grand Prix that did not include a stock version and I'm sure John would agree with me on this one.  That would rule out the "Super Fly" Grand Prix as a guess.  FWIW. I'm trying to track down to see if the original 69-72 tooling still exist. It's currently M.I.A.   Like the recently re-issued Californian, that's probably the only way you'll see the Super Fly Grand Prix is if it's in the existing tooling and it's in relatively good shape. 

-Steve

 

Edited June 17, 2022 by SteveG

[Oldcarfan27]

2 hours ago, SteveG said:

I wouldn't be doing all-new tooling of 71-72 Pontiac Grand Prix that did not include a stock version and I'm sure John would agree with me on this one.  That would rule out the "Super Fly" Grand Prix as a guess.  FWIW. I'm trying to track down to see if the original 69-72 tooling still exist. It's currently M.I.A.   Like the recently re-issued Californian, that's probably the only way you'll see the Super Fly Grand Prix is if it's in the existing tooling and it's in relatively good shape. 

-Steve

 

Well, that is the "Superfly in the ointment!"

Thanks for the update, Steve.

[StevenGuthmiller]

5 hours ago, SteveG said:

I wouldn't be doing all-new tooling of 71-72 Pontiac Grand Prix that did not include a stock version and I'm sure John would agree with me on this one.  That would rule out the "Super Fly" Grand Prix as a guess.  FWIW. I'm trying to track down to see if the original 69-72 tooling still exist. It's currently M.I.A.   Like the recently re-issued Californian, that's probably the only way you'll see the Super Fly Grand Prix is if it's in the existing tooling and it's in relatively good shape. 

-Steve

 

Well, that’s good and bad news.

The good news is that we can finally put the “Super Fly” guess to rest. (A very positive development in my view)

The bad news is that the ‘69-‘72 GP tooling might be gone forever.

I think one of those kits could have been a very viable future project for Round-2.

 

 

 

Steve

[Bucky]

Never say never! ('68 Coronet convertible as reference.)

[Robberbaron]

9 hours ago, SteveG said:

I wouldn't be doing all-new tooling of 71-72 Pontiac Grand Prix that did not include a stock version and I'm sure John would agree with me on this one.  That would rule out the "Super Fly" Grand Prix as a guess.  FWIW. I'm trying to track down to see if the original 69-72 tooling still exist. It's currently M.I.A.   Like the recently re-issued Californian, that's probably the only way you'll see the Super Fly Grand Prix is if it's in the existing tooling and it's in relatively good shape. 

-Steve

 

4 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

Well, that’s good and bad news.

The good news is that we can finally put the “Super Fly” guess to rest. (A very positive development in my view)

The bad news is that the ‘69-‘72 GP tooling might be gone forever.

I think one of those kits could have been a very viable future project for Round-2.

Steve

I'm disappointed as well that the tooling is MIA.  If the chassis/drive train still existed, it seemed like it would be a good candidate for a retooled body, ala the '64 Cutlass.

Hopefully it still turns up.  I'm sure the need to recreate all of the tooling vs. just the body would greatly reduce the chance of it happening.

[keyser]

71 Monte may work, forget wb but has to be close. 

[Robberbaron]

10 hours ago, keyser said:

71 Monte may work, forget wb but has to be close. 

I seem to recall the 69-72 GP's have a unique 118" wheelbase.  Montes are 116".

Doesn't seem like much, but it would be enough to throw off the proportions.

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, Robberbaron said:

I seem to recall the 69-72 GP's have a unique 118" wheelbase.  Montes are 116".

Doesn't seem like much, but it would be enough to throw off the proportions.

The Monte's a little shorter, but with a slight chassis stretch, it'll work just fine.

But it wouldn't work for a re-pop of one of the GP kits.

 

 

 

 

 

Steve

[Plowboy]

20 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

I think one of those kits could have been a very viable future project for Round-2.

 

 

 

Steve

And it very well still could be. Round2 has been surprising us lately with kits that some said were gone forever. So, you never know.

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, Plowboy said:

And it very well still could be. Round2 has been surprising us lately with kits that some said were gone forever. So, you never know.

We can hope.

 

 

 

 

Steve

[stavanzer]

After doing a deep dive into the MPC Gran Prix kits via Drastic Plastic and Casey's Proboards Site, it looks like the GP kits did not change much from 68 to 72. Engine and Chassis look to be the same in all kits, which fits with MPC's Tooling & Kit practices. Interior Tub and Seats, and even the wheels appear to be little changed, although without seeing the parts it is hard to tell. The body tooling of course is updated for each new year, but it looks to me, like the changes on the kits were mostly just the Front End and Headlights. The extras (Ski Parts & Crutches, and for one year the Wild/mild 'Put-On' parts) stayed the same. I think that they might still be in the tool, hiding.  I suspect that I am missing some details but the but looks to have had no major changes from 68 to 72.

So, the Sweathogs tooling may contain more parts than we know. It might be worth a "One-Run-of-Fun" before trying to restore the body. But this is all pure speculation, and the tool may very well be either lost or unusable.

[Can-Con]

16 minutes ago, stavanzer said:

After doing a deep dive into the MPC Gran Prix kits via Drastic Plastic and Casey's Proboards Site, it looks like the GP kits did not change much from 68 to 72. Engine and Chassis look to be the same in all kits, which fits with MPC's Tooling & Kit practices. Interior Tub and Seats, and even the wheels appear to be little changed, although without seeing the parts it is hard to tell. The body tooling of course is updated for each new year, but it looks to me, like the changes on the kits were mostly just the Front End and Headlights. The extras (Ski Parts & Crutches, and for one year the Wild/mild 'Put-On' parts) stayed the same. I think that they might still be in the tool, hiding.  I suspect that I am missing some details but the but looks to have had no major changes from 68 to 72.

So, the Sweathogs tooling may contain more parts than we know. It might be worth a "One-Run-of-Fun" before trying to restore the body. But this is all pure speculation, and the tool may very well be either lost or unusable.

The rear of the '69/'70 is completely different than the '71/'72 also

[StevenGuthmiller]

10 minutes ago, Can-Con said:

The rear of the '69/'70 is completely different than the '71/'72 also

What great looking cars!!! ?

 

 

 

Steve

[Oldcarfan27]

5 hours ago, stavanzer said:

So, the Sweathogs tooling may contain more parts than we know. It might be worth a "One-Run-of-Fun" before trying to restore the body. But this is all pure speculation, and the tool may very well be either lost or unusable.

Here's hoping it somehow turns up.

If they would modify the tool again, I'd suggest redoing the nose for stock and custom options (just like the 70 Z28 full bumper) and restoring the roof with cutouts for the desired openings. 

Then it could be run for BOTH the replica stock and the pimp builders.

[Oldcarfan27]

5 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

What great looking cars!!! ?

 

 

 

Steve

Agreed, I love 'em!!

[Motor City]

The '69 and '70 GP look the same except for the grille.  The '71 and '72 look the same except for the grille.  The '69 and '70 have quad headlights, while the '71 and '72 have one on each side.  

[Faust]

I get your horror at the Superfly totally wrecking a nice GP, being a Poncho fan myself, Steve. 

For me, the "Travolta Fever" Trans Am is the same; I love my '80 T/A and consider it a pinnacle of automotive styling, but I still would love a Travolta kit. The great thing about the kit is that you can have something fun and wacky, and use it as a hammer to remind people why we DON'T CUSTOMIZE CARS like this anymore. It's a great laugh and a great shaming tool all at once! Of course I have a real love of the ugly, maligned and totally horrendously ridiculous, so I might be a bad "voice of reason". 

Man, that His and Hers thing shows how bad Barris really was. I mean, it makes the FOXY VETTE look awesome! Again... a good shaming tool on both parts. 

I won't bother if it's a gasser, or another Mustang. I've hardly bought any Round 2 kits lately because they've gotten away from the weird '70s and '80s stuff. the LUV and the Courier are the only ones I've picked up in the last year or two. They need to get their mojo back, and you cannot get more mojo than the Grand Superfly! Heck, keep the targa - it's better that way anyway!  

[Plowboy]

14 hours ago, Can-Con said:

The rear of the '69/'70 is completely different than the '71/'72 also

This illustrates why I prefer the '71 and up Gran Prix. The rear of the car, as well as the front, has much better styling. I have a '72 promo in the stash. But, I lost interest in it. 

[Can-Con]

2 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

This illustrates why I prefer the '71 and up Gran Prix. The rear of the car, as well as the front, has much better styling. I have a '72 promo in the stash. But, I lost interest in it. 

Well, if you want to part with it Roger, message me and maybe we can work a deal.?

Edited June 19, 2022 by Can-Con

[1972coronet]

1 hour ago, Faust said:

Man, that His and Hers thing shows how bad Barris really was.

A former coworker used to call him "Barris the Butcher", whereas I've long referred to him as "Bondo Bandit Barris".  His "works" are frightening enough to cause a miscarriage!

[StevenGuthmiller]

6 hours ago, Motor City said:

The '69 and '70 GP look the same except for the grille.  The '71 and '72 look the same except for the grille.  The '69 and '70 have quad headlights, while the '71 and '72 have one on each side.  

The only difference in the front end between the '69 and '70 was that the '69 had horizontal grille bars, and the '70 had vertical.

The front parking lights on the '69 also had white reflectors on the sides, versus the '70 which had amber.

The white reflector lenses are very difficult to find, which is why you will often see '69 restorations with amber reflectors.

 

Other trim differences include the chrome hash marks on the C-pillar on the '69, versus the "Grand Prix" script on the '70.

Like wise, the hash marks were moved to the lower front quarter panel in '70, replacing the "Grand Prix" and "Model-J" or "Model-SJ" scripts from '69.

The model call out script was moved to the passenger side trunk lid in '70.

 

I'm not 100% sure, but I believe that the back ground color on the Rally II wheel's "PMD" center caps was changed from black in '69, to red in '70 as well.

 

 

 

 

Steve

 

[StevenGuthmiller]

4 hours ago, Plowboy said:

This illustrates why I prefer the '71 and up Gran Prix. The rear of the car, as well as the front, has much better styling. I have a '72 promo in the stash. But, I lost interest in it. 

Well, I suppose that's subjective.

Personally, I prefer the rear styling on the '69/'70.

Cleaner.....less busy.

In my eye, the '71/'72 rear looks too "Cadillac-ish".

 

I prefer the more subdued '69 look, but then I have an obvious bias. 

 

I think the cleaner rear end gives the car a little more of a muscle car bent.

The '71/'72's  lend to more of a luxury car look.

 

 

 

Steve

[Motor City]

What I should have stated is that the '69 and '70 GP looked essentially the same except for the grille.  Emblem and hash mark placement and other minor variations changed as Steve mentioned.

I think the '71-'72 front end on the GP would have looked a lot better with quad headlights and retaining the earlier hood.  I was disappointed when the '71 came out looking like that and have the same opinion of the '71 and '72 Chevelle front end.

[Richard Bartrop]

8 hours ago, 1972coronet said:

A former coworker used to call him "Barris the Butcher", whereas I've long referred to him as "Bondo Bandit Barris".  His "works" are frightening enough to cause a miscarriage!

If you ever read Rod  Custom's account of the restoration of the Hirohata Merc, what they found underneath was not pretty.

That would make an interesting model project.  An old school custom, complete with old school construction underneath.

[GMP440]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:14 PM, s.p.e.c.t.r.e. said:

Here's a few that have had only one release, and are now high dollar collector  kits, hmm, their  all MPC (maybe lost tooling?) . Bed Buggy was announced in  2017 ,still waiting on that one. But it's probably a Funny Car , those are really popular lately.

I dig Show Cars cause I worked for a ISCA agent ( 69-72) as a teenager , moving cars on & off show trailers , and airbrushing t-shirts .

Not factory stock.  Could it be the 1968 Hemi Under Glass Barracuda?