This is crazy!

[my 70 chevelle ss]

I can not beleive this really I mean most of the cars I build are Chevy Gassers so decals are a part of that. I take the time to make them on my Alps as Slixx caters to mopars (why I have no clue) I learned & boy did I learn on here that Clear Coats will harm the decals. I have read a lot on the net. the same thing. You need to wait this long no this long Ok the body was painted three months ago I think I'm safe there I put the decals on 5 Days ago not sure there!. Here comes the clear no matter how long u Waite watch out Tamyia is hot ok found out what that meant. One person I know says use Testors it looks the same to me. So now I have to learn to use a air brush & Future don't even know what kind to buy I can just see problems coming. Now I read Grunz Mr. Topcoat will not hurt decals GREAT no cause u can't get it in this country anymore. I just can not beleive that in this day & age that they can not make a clear that does not hurt decals!. I mean I don't even know how to polish & have used Tamyia over decals no problem but now that I know I'm worried to use it so now I am going to use Future & I pray that I get this right & with an air brush I never picked one up before let a lone using it on a model that I spent time & money on. Why do they sell this clear if they know it hurts decals or I have even read paint if u don't put it on in a time frame. I mean I might as well go out in my garage & paint my Chevelle SS mist it no don't mist it wait no don't wait. What the hell someone has to be making a clear that does not ruin decals. Why do I have the feeling that when I get the air brush & if I buy the right kind of Future after all this the model will end up in the garbage. And why cause of lack of knowledge on my part I really belevie the less u know the better u are.

Thank you

Will,

Edited April 8, 2010 by my 70 chevelle ss

[Karmodeler2]

I can not beleive this really I mean most of the cars I build are Chevy Gassers so decals are a part of that. I take the time to make them on my Alps as Slixx caters to mopars (why I have no clue) I learned & boy did I learn on here that Clear Coats will harm the decals. I have read a lot on the net. the same thing. You need to wait this long no this long Ok the body was painted three months ago I think I'm safe there I put the decals on 5 Days ago not sure there!. Here comes the clear no matter how long u Waite watch out Tamyia is hot ok found out what that meant. One person I know says use Testors it looks the same to me. So now I have to learn to use a air brush & Future don't even know what kind to buy I can just see problems coming. Now I read Grunz Mr. Topcoat will not hurt decals GREAT no cause u can't get it in this country anymore. I just can not beleive that in this day & age that they can not make a clear that does not hurt decals!. I mean I don't even know how to polish & have used Tamyia over decals no problem but now that I know I'm worried to use it so now I am going to use Future & I pray that I get this right & with an air brush I never picked one up before let a lone using it on a model that I spent time & money on. Why do they sell this clear if they know it hurts decals or I have even read paint if u don't put it on in a time frame. I mean I might as well go out in my garage & paint my Chevelle SS mist it no don't mist it wait no don't wait. What the hell someone has to be making a clear that does not ruin decals. Why do I have the feeling that when I get the air brush & if I buy the right kind of Future after all this the model will end up in the garbage. And why cause of lack of knowledge on my part I really belevie the less u know the better u are.

Thank you

Will,

Will,

I have read several post of yours and you seem to be hesitant to go "try" something new or different, and at times you seem to want an answer that will "cure" every problem we all face in this hobby.

I have given you solid, 100% advice that works 100% of the time and it's up to you to go try it. We can't come to your home and do it for you. Several of the tips and advice that others have posted for you have come from them trying different things, failing, and trying something else until it works. You are going to have to teach yourself to airbrush. I did. Most of the people on this board probably taught themselves how to use it. My first time was not pretty, but I taught myself by practice.

I have given you the advice of spoons and practicing on them. If you take that advice, you will find out if the clears you have chosen will work.

There is only one kind of Future and it is available at most grocery stores. It's called Pledge w/Future and it's found in the floor wax isle with the brooms/mops and cleaners. You don't have to thin it and it shoots straight from the gun.

I'm sure you have old car bodies laying around, so use one of them before you try it out on your pride and joy.

You are going to make mistakes. I do all the time and have been doing this 35+ years. I always learn something with each model and I am always continually trying to improve the skills I have.

There are 2 kinds of clears that WILL NOT HURT DECALS. One is Future. The other is Automotive urethanes like PPG Concept 2020. ALso, in the years of modeling, I have never had Model Master Clear Top Coat do any damage to decals what so ever.

The reason there are many different clears available is they offer different applications. Remember, not all models have decals. I love the Tamiya clear and it offers one of the best finishes when buffed out. But one of the limitations with this one is it eats decals. So use it on a non decal model and don't use it when you are using decals.

I offer all this to you because your post, to me, seem to read as if you are always upset with something in the modeling world (photo etch, clears). Maybe I am wrong, but I just want to let you know we all have problems in this hobby. Navigating around them is what makes you the modeler that you will become. GIving up or getting frustrated will only end in disaster. Let the hurdles be a challenge. I have put models aside because I could not figure something out, and it was 3 models later when it hit me on how to solve that problem. Don't let your frustration destroy your passion for building and for the hobby.

If I have read your post incorrectly, I apologize.

If you are one that gets easily frustrated or intimidated by trying new processes, I suggest you switch to gardening.

David

[Scale-Master]

If you clear coat your Alps decals with the same clear you are going to clear the model with there will not be any problems with the clear eating the decals. Tamiya TS-13 clear can be used, and if you mess up the decal by putting it on too wet, you can make another decal without risking the model. You can also use Future for both clearing the decal and the model, but Future likes to run easily. At least it can be removed with Windex.

David makes some very good points, dive in and teach yourself some new tricks, it really is not as intimidating as you seem to have convinced yourself it is. You will have to find out what works for you. Not everyone get s the same results from the same procedures and products. But sharing those results, while it may sound like there is some contradiction, is how we learn. And there are many variables with each product and technique so it is inevitable there will be more than one “right†way to do many things. I know there are things I do that are considered “wrong†by other builders but they work for me. You’ll find out what works for you by experimenting and practice, there is no one right way to do it all.

Oh yeah, once you figure something out, sometimes it still won’t work every time… Good luck.

[vaughn]

If you clear coat your Alps decals with the same clear you are going to clear the model with there will not be any problems with the clear eating the decals. Tamiya TS-13 clear can be used, and if you mess up the decal by putting it on too wet, you can make another decal without risking the model. You can also use Future for both clearing the decal and the model, but Future likes to run easily. At least it can be removed with Windex.

David makes some very good points, dive in and teach yourself some new tricks, it really is not as intimidating as you seem to have convinced yourself it is. You will have to find out what works for you. Not everyone get s the same results from the same procedures and products. But sharing those results, while it may sound like there is some contradiction, is how we learn. And there are many variables with each product and technique so it is inevitable there will be more than one right way to do many things. I know there are things I do that are considered wrong by other builders but they work for me. Youll find out what works for you by experimenting and practice, there is no one right way to do it all.

Oh yeah, once you figure something out, sometimes it still wont work every time… Good luck.

I agree with Dave and Scalemaster. You sound very angry, frustrated. Could not make sense of some of the things you were trying to say. I think I told you that I used Testors Clear on a Jimmie Johnson Nascar. Plenty of decals and all went well. Used Solvaset on the decals first and then spryed with clear. Not happy the way it did my windows but was told different and Revell sent me a new set. No big deal. Its a hobby....relax...enjoy...learn from your mistakes. I try not to use different brand names on the same model. If I start with Testors, I do it all with Testors and likewise with Tamiya. And the Future...you can brush also. If your build is that much of a disaster....turn it into a junker type with rust, dents and all. Maybe you will find that, that is your nich !! Like my Pappy always use to say " Son, if you are dealt a lemon....learn to make lemonade " Good luck

Edited April 8, 2010 by vaughn

[diymirage]

we need to start instituing cliff notes

this is all way to much text

[Karmodeler2]

we need to start instituing cliff notes

Should we also start "instituing" phonetics? or maybe spell check?

Sometimes the advice someone is looking for can not be summed up in one sentence or two. Sorry.

David

[Modelmartin]

Will,

Dave and Mark are amongst the best model car builders in the country. Their advice is sound. You do sound frustrated but keep at it. I have been building for over 40 years and I still run into problems. The other day I mixed up some different brands of lacquer to get an effect I wanted and I got something else which was disastrous! That model is in the trash! Most turn out fine.

As far as decals go I have rarely ever had clears react badly. 2-3 days should be plenty of time to dry. Use decal setting solution. It helps the decals lay down on curves and shapes better and helps eliminate bubbles.

Don't give up. You are investing in building up your skills and knowledge right now with the mistakes and it would be a shame to lose that investment.

[Modelmartin]

Should we also start "instituing" phonetics? or maybe spell check?

Sometimes the advice someone is looking for can not be summed up in one sentence or two. Sorry.

David

That guy needs a better edmukashion in English.

[Scale-Master]

I'll try to keep this short for those of you who have thus wise attention spans.

One point I left out but was touched on subsequently is the dry time of decals before clear coating. 24 hours is usually suitable, but a minimum of 3-4 days is preferred.

Why?

Sometimes what appear to be fully dry decals can have moisture trapped under the decal. These areas may not manifest themselves as bubbles, but the lack of adhesion can allow the decals to be "attacked" by the clear since there is no support under those spots. What you get is seemingly random damage.

By letting them dry longer, the moisture has a better chance of evaporating out.

So, it would seem even with more than a few sentences earlier, I did not provide all the pertinent info to the query.

Do we really want to pare down the info requested by one for a few others who probably won't read or use it? No, I don't think so.

Maybe if we took the time to read and learn and applied that philosophy to our building there would be a few more improved models and satisfied modelers?

That should be a sufficiently long enough post to deter the non-interested viewers… Yes, there is some sarcasm in there too… Enjoy!

Edited April 9, 2010 by Scale-Master

[Harry P.]

I'll try to keep this short for those of you who have thus wise attention spans.

One point I left out but was touched on subsequently is the dry time of decals before clear coating. 24 hours is usually suitable, but a minimum of 3-4 days is preferred.

Why?

Sometimes what appear to be fully dry decals can have moisture trapped under the decal. These may areas not manifest themselves as bubbles, but the lack of adhesion can allow the decals to be "attacked" by the clear since there is no support under those spots. What you get is seemingly random damage.

By letting them dry longer, the moisture has a better chance of evaporating out.

So, it would seem even with more than a few sentences earlier, I did not provide all the pertinent info to the query.

Do we really want to pare down the info requested by one for a few others who probably won't read or use it? No, I don't think so.

Maybe if we took the time to read and learn and applied that philosophy to our building there would be a few more improved models and satisfied modelers?

That should be a sufficiently long enough post to deter the non-interested viewers… Yes, there is some sarcasm in there too… Enjoy!

Mark, your effusive yet restrained missive is both eloquent and perspicacious.

[Scale-Master]

Why thank you Harry, very kind of you to say. I like your articulate style and I accept the compliment for the most part. But I’m not 100% sure “effusive†is correct in this case, certainly not the esoteric interpretation of “a large gushing femaleâ€. I’ve been called worse, but at least never an antitermilogicalexactatudinarian.

[Harry P.]

Why thank you Harry, very kind of you to say. I like your articulate style and I accept the compliment for the most part. But I'm not 100% sure "effusive" is correct in this case, certainly not the esoteric interpretation of "a large gushing female". I've been called worse, but at least never an antitermilogicalexactatudinarian.

[Modelmartin]

Mark, your effusive yet restrained missive is both eloquent and perspicacious.

Harry, you are very shrewd to sense those qualities in Mark, and articulate in pointing them out in your subtle message which was, contadictively, somewhat demonstrative.

[Scale-Master]

Harry, you are very shrewd to sense those qualities in Mark, and articulate in pointing them out in your subtle message which was, contadictively, somewhat demonstrative.

Contadictively?

[Harry P.]

Contadictively?

My, my... aren't we being persnickety!

[Scale-Master]

Sorry, just another unrestrained sporadic repercussion from my existence of yesteryear as an oversized garrulous school marm…(?)

Ironic original title of this thread considering its current tangent, is it not?

[Harry P.]

It's funny how things go sometimes...

I think we might have scared off the original poster!

[Modelmartin]

effusive yet restrained

Isn't that like loud yet quiet? Unrestrained is a synonym for effusive. Somewhat contradictory, methinks. Your meaning does comes across, actually, I think. I was just having some fun wit ya! The thing that is crazy that there are enough of us left in this world to have fun with words and not have people impugning our personal character and ascribing nefarious qualities to our persona for doing so!... for a little while, at least.

[raymanz]

Will,you've just got some advice by the BEST Model Builder's there are. Use it,it's sound advice! But,you sound like your intimidated by try new things. You don't become a master builder overnight,it takes years of trial&error too get a system down that's comfortable to you. Read some of How-to books also helps,give suggestions to start with. Good Luck with your project and if something goes wrong try and figure out what it was and learn from your mistakes.

[Scale-Master]

Isn't that like loud yet quiet? Unrestrained is a synonym for effusive. Somewhat contradictory, methinks. Your meaning does comes across, actually, I think. I was just having some fun wit ya! The thing that is crazy that there are enough of us left in this world to have fun with words and not have people impugning our personal character and ascribing nefarious qualities to our persona for doing so!... for a little while, at least.

Yeah! What he said! Harrumph!

[Harry P.]

Effusive yet restrained...

What I meant was, he was being loquacious while simultaneously being succinct. I thinct.

[Jordan White]

You all use big words! Me do not know!

[59 Impala]

Will you guys speak English Please? I'm all cornfused now. Dan

[Modelmartin]

I thinct.

Therefore you is.

[RJWood]

Will somebody bring a dickshunary