What happened to paint??

[FloridaBoy]

I was absent for a few years after the seventies and into the mid eighties. Back in the sixties and seventies, I carefully applied Pactra candies, metallics, solids, and pearls over primered and undercoated bodies and achieved a very nice shine. I used the rattlecans, as down here only a few hobby shops carried airbrushes. I had limited success with them back then, so I used both.

As I commenced finishing some of my nuveau "middle age crisis" models in the nineties and new century, I struggled with airbrushes, but with the advent of Testor's paint and new colors, used rattlecans until my proficiency returned using airbrushes. Airbrushing to me is NOT like riding a bicycle. I virtually had to learn it all over again.

I know in my absence the EPA and other agencies cracked down on chemicals and paint content, which affected our hobby, but do now know how or what. I still use rattlecans and airbrushing but I am really getting into DupliColor and Tamiya colors in the rattlecans.

I have a 2 cars remaining I built in 1962 and 1964 and the paint is incredibly shiny contest quality, smooth, free of orange peeling, etc and I do not touch them. Additionally I have a 1962 Ford at the Salt Lake Museum with its oriignal Pactra shine. But in 1994 I finished a Merc with Testor's Boyd Aluma Yellow, a 40 Ford Coupe painted Kiln Metallic Red, and another 40 coupe painted metallic blue, not clear coated. These paints have lost their sheen, orange peeled, or let the epoxy and glues seep through and are unsightly, so much so that I have deposited them in boxes for refurbishing.

BTW I used Testor's primer before chaging to DupliColor Primer.

What happened to the paint over the years?

Right now on the drying stand for a couple of months, I have some rattlecan and airbrushed cars waiting for the paint to settle before applying chrome and assembling them. Since I used clear coat and polishing abrasive systems and a finishing polish the cars look OK. But the fear of the paint breaking down is always there like a rattlesnake posed to strike. Can anyone give me some of their experience and knowledge as to what to expect. I am asking this question only here because of the standard of quality of building here, and what you guys know, is good enough for me.

Thanks in advance,

Ken "FloridaBoy" Willaman

[LoneWolf15]

Ken,

I really can't comment on Testors paints before 2001 as I was playing in TrainLand using Floquil's line of paints before that. As of 2001 , I have been using Testors enamels exclusively. My only diffrence from what others use method wise is simply this .....

All of my paint mixes consist of 2 parts Testors enamel to 1 part garden variety laquer thinner. I use Testors Aluminum Metallizer as my base coat for my pearls and metallic colors . My standard colors are applied directly to the bare plastic . I use no primer unless I have performed extensive bodywork on the model's body . My clear coats are also Testors enamels, using the same mix ratio as the paint. All are applied with a Paache H series airbrush , using a # 5 head and needle.

In the past 8 years , since rejoining the car building ranks , I have yet to have had one of my paint jobs go south on me . There has never been a complaint from any of my customers who have purchased painted bodies or one of my built ups indicating this either .

Kathie and I still use quite a few of my older builds as paint display examples at our vending tables and they still look as good as the day they were finished. As you know , opinions are like backsides , everybody has one ! I an sure you are going to hear from quite a few others on this subject. This is simply mine .

If you'd like to see exactly what I'm talking about , visit me at www.oldmansmodels.com My Grandpap had a saying , " Visibilty lends itself to credibility " Hope this has helped you out .

Donn Yost

Lone Wolf Custom Painting

[E St. Kruiser50]

Interesting topic.

I too have been in and out of the hobby at times in years gone by. Career, other interests, and family stuff side-tracked me a time or two like most of us.

For me after after a few decades, I've found there are two basic classifications of paints available to us - HOBBY AND AUTOMOTIVE.

Now some may not agree with me here on this and that's O.K., it's just my take on it, SO DON'T GET TESTY WITH ME OR I'LL SICK HARRY ON YA WITH HIS "SILVER BULLETT" .

One of the main differences between the two classifications I mentioned, is that besides the base chemical quality being different, many auto paints, even in spray cans, have a U.V. protector in them, and other aditives which inhibits deterioration, and other aging characteristics, even under adverse weather conditions or high heat, because they'll be exposed to the elements. Some even use different propellants, which can affect quality. And differing solvents can make a huge difference too.

Hobby paints are just that - for a hobbiest, and there is a huge difference, even with the best like IMOHP - Tamiya.

I've been on this forum for awhile and when done right, I never hear anyone complain about the auto paints such a Duplicolor and Plasticote, it's just the hobby paints we mostly hear about here.

This seems to be an ongoing argument, especially from the guys who say they get "GOOD RESULTS" using the "HobbyPaints", but to me "GOOD IS A RELATIVE TERM" LIKE A "10 FOOTER" .

Looks GOOD at TEN FEET .

When I take my stuff to shows, my paint jobs get a lot of attention and I get lots of questions, like

HOW DO YOU GET A PAINT JOB TO LOOK LIKE THAT ???? (EVEN UP-CLOSE )

It's not just the skill of painting that makes them good, but also the quality and the type of products I use.

Then there's urethanes....I LOVE URETHANES .

URETHANES TO ME ARE FAR-AND-AWAY THE BEST PAINTS AVAILABLE TODAY FOR DURABILITY, USER FRIENDLYNESS, AND QUALITY - EVEN THE CHEAP BRANDS THAT I'VE USED CAME OUT BEAUTIFUL, PROBABLY BECAUSE I USED A GOOD REDUCER AND CATALYST.

To me all the auto paints, even in rattlecans, are far better quality now than they've ever been.

IMO, Tamiya is the only HOBBY PAINT that will give you quality, and good repetitive results, even using an automotive clear-coat to seal it, and an auto primer to prep it, and you don't hear complaints here about it when it's done right.

[FloridaBoy]

Dave,

I tend to agree, but maybe those old paint jobs which are now close to 50 years old are holding up, maybe it was because I lucked on the best preparation of the surface, as I really haven't changed much since then, as I primer everything, but now use both Duplicolors primers on the bodies, and sandable primer on the parts trees.

Second, I use a lot of primer, as I really like to seal off the putty, as down here in SoFla the elements like sunlight even if exposed just a smidgeon are always present. I primer every square inch of the car, inside and out, and take great pains to make sure even the inside fenders which are not seen are covered for protection.

Next, I always use undercoat, either copper, light or dark silver metallic, white or light gray.

Like I said I just painted and clearcoated 3 cars, and they have been sitting for a couple of months and have not changed since the day I painted them. I even used an enamel (Testors) on top of a lacquer (Duplicolor primer and basecoat), and a Testors Enamel clearcoat over a Duplicolor color coat. So far, everything is working. They are in my fotki.com album under my name and I will be trying to post them in a couple of days in the work in progress portion of this forum.

Ken "FloridaBoy" Willaman

[Aaronw]

Some chemicals / compouds like lead are just plain gone (lead was used in red, not sure what other colors), but the big changes have been in the volitiles (the solvents and stuff that evaporate) which have been reduced due to air quality laws. In California a lot of this occured in the 1990s. I was working in the paint department of a hardware store and I know many complained about the quality of the new spray paint. I think like everything else the manufacturers have adjusted and found workable replacements to the initial compliant paints.

I know I have either become a better painter or the paints have improved between the early 90s when I built my last model and 2002 when I got back into building. It seems like most of the current paints are far more forgiving than the stuff that was available in the 90s.

Edited October 27, 2009 by Aaronw