PRO

[oversteer]

I was looking around on ebay and came across built models.The models were really good and were described as being built by a "pro".These models were going for $300+.Since I'm new to the culture can someone clarify what makes one a "pro",is it a 9 to 5 or something?Also why would someone pay so much for a built model?Thanks!

[Railfreak78]

The only thing that really bugs me about a lot of "Pro" builders that sell online is that when I see them here ( there are a few ) or elsewhere, is that they do not show in progress pics. There is no proof they built it. No proof of what it really is underneath. It could be a great build or one that has an engine from a toy. Then as mentioned want a lot of money for it. Seems fishy to me. I love eye candy and I saw one certain build by a member here I really wanted to buy until it went to high and then that was when I thought to myself wow no build for it.

[MrObsessive]

Gotta give kudos to Paul Hettick (Robbbbb57 on eBay) as well!

He recently had a '59 Rambler that he turned from wagon into a four door hardtop on eBay. The model went IIRC for something over $500!!

Now Paul put quite a bit of work into that model------first turning it from a wagon into a four door. Not to mention, making it a hardtop.....and also correcting the too long wheelbase. The wheelbase and fenders actually represents an Ambassador which the model in its original form is not. Interior had to be corrected and then the whole thing painted for what Rambler offered in 1959.

Lots of work for sure------I think the price he got for it was a bit low considering one doesn't know how much time went into all the converting.

He must work in kind of an assembly line fashion as he has a different car on eBay each week.

I couldn't do that type of work as now the hobby would become a job, which would sound the death knell of this hobby for me indefinitely!

[Dragline]

Before I came to this forum I was buying kits off eBay. I was/am buying long out of production items I could not find elsewhere and I was scoring some cool stuff now and again. I'm a "Frugal" guy, so I usually bow out of kits that seem overpriced or overhyped [iE: Item Description "Super RARE Polar Lights Charger Funny Car" with 45.00 price tag... Ya sure????]

Be that as it may, I ended up buying kits I wanted at prices I thought reasonable. During these searches [and there were many] I came across these "Pro" built kits. Soooooo, I started searching for them, usually after my initial legitimate searches were done and I was just kind of browsing. I noticed a few trends in the way these "Pro" built cars were auctioned.

That Paul Hettig [spelling] guy has some really nice stuff. The craftsmanship was very good but they are mostly replica stock cars of models I am not interested in. Then, there is that other guy mentioned. Incredibly detailed F-1 cars well over the 1,000.00 mark. Well worth it IMHO, but since I build, they have limited appeal outside of my admiring them, then moving on. Very appealing to guys who collect these one of a kind works of art no doubt.

There was another guy too. His auctions kinda looked like the Paul Hettig [spelling] guys. Same well done replica stocks, but again, since I build and they were of subjects I had no interest in I simply admired them and moved on. That and the pictures for both of those guys auctions tended to be on the smallish side so details were a little difficult for me to see. And, if I were to pay a few hundred for a BUILT model car I'd require engines with full detail and perhaps brakes and other stuff like that. Not a criticism mind you. But for a builder, that would be a deal breaker for me if that's what I was in the market to buy.

Then there is the rest. I call them the 'Rest', since that is where I choose to lump them.

Crudely built, mostly box stock models that cannot stand up to close scrutiny. Usually currently available kits with questionable paint jobs and sloppily applied BMF treatments. RARELY ever detailed engines and often painted in colors not standard with accenting paints in clearly incorrect colors. Just an overabundance of ameteurishly built OOB models that scarcely require even the most casual glance.

Then, there is that one guy who seems to get PREMIUMS for his painted and decaled 1/25 scale bodies marketed as slot cars. Mostly well painted if not cleverly decaled drag racing subjects that seemed to garner 200.00 to 300.00 price tags. I was floored by the prices and even toyed wth the idea of stealing his thunder and doing my own. But alas, I have no use for duping the slot car people out of their hard earned money and would rather they learned the reward of doing it themselves with a good paint tutorial. I know that there are a great many who would rather just buy a pre-painted body so I just ended up laughing the whole thing off and occasionaly watching a few of the auctions myself, marvelling at the prices they would end up selling for.

"Pro" modelers?

If you perform a service and get paid for it, regardless of that service, you are considered a "Pro" by a universal standard. Now, whether that service is at a "Pro" level is another issue altogether.

Bob

PS: Edit. I'll give you an example. As a young guitarist, I had the opportunity to get up on stage and play some songs with an established band many years ago. While I had some chops I was still far and away not at the level of the guys on stage. When it was over I was applauded for my efforts [i was 16 I believe] and afterwards was even given 15 bucks as part of the bands way of saying, "stick with it kid, you are on your way". Was my performance "Pro"? At the time I thought so, but I'm certain it was not. The point is, I was paid for my performance and was therefore a "professional" musician.

The "professional" part of my chops would not come till some years later so the audience got an amateur guitarist being paid for what was essentially and amateur performance.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Dragline

[Jairus]

I have Paul's auctions pop up in my email anytime he has one listed. I almost always check them out... especially the Fords and big Mercurys. The paint and finish detailing is first rate most of the time. Only flaws I have noticed is usually window fitment seems a bit off and some of the chrome trim around the window glass seems not so smooth. I acknowledge that this is my biggest problem as well. Which is probably why I notice it in the first place.

Pro means Professional. Selling your wares for payment! I have no problems with anyone wanting to make a living with their hobby. Someone wise once told me that "if you can make a living doing what you love then you will be happy for the rest of your life!"

I suspect Paul is either retired or selling other stuff privately. Because the work that goes into some of his builds on ebay is in no way enough to live on! But he does have a loyal following as demonstrated by the huge number of bids on each auction by closing date.

If you want to see a few of what I consider the very best Professional painter/builder examples. Check out some of the beautiful work Chris Clark posts here on this forum! He has that window glass thing down pat and his bare metal work.... BEAUTIFUL!

Edited April 22, 2010 by Jairus

[Harry P.]

I guess anyone can call themselves a "pro," but the accepted definition of a "pro" is someone who performs a service for money, but there is no direct correlation between being a "pro" and being good at what you do.

If you make money doing what you do, you're a "pro,"... but that doesn't necessarily mean you're good at it. So don't assume that every "pro" built model out there is built to some sort of high level of skill. Some are, some are not. Buyer Beware, as they say...

[oversteer]

Ohhh wow thanks now I understand!Excellent replies,thanks for the insite.

[meaneyme]

I think it all depends on how you look at it, to me, a well built and clean model means everything to me specially because I lack the expertise or talent to create models, I am more of a collector. I personally buy from one of the forum members here, don't want to say his name because as he says "I don't build to sell" or in other words, I don't want to make this a job. One thing I will tell you though, I love his stuff and would still pay more if I had to. Only a collector can appreciate how much effort is put into these kits!

[cotto]

I think it all depends on how you look at it, to me, a well built and clean model means everything to me specially because I lack the expertise or talent to create models, I am more of a collector. I personally buy from one of the forum members here, don't want to say his name because as he says "I don't build to sell" or in other words, I don't want to make this a job. One thing I will tell you though, I love his stuff and would still pay more if I had to. Only a collector can appreciate how much effort is put into these kits!

I know what you mean Kevin as I have 2 from him also, you hit the nail on the head with your reply. I am also a collector even though I do a little building here and there but cleanliness and paint are always on the top of my list also and even though I buy from several other people, I prefer his models because of that. I think his price is very fair also. I would love to buy from others here too but I do have my limitations when it comes to paying for some builds. I am not saying they are not worth the money they are charging, I just know when I can't afford some of them.

[Chillyb1]

Then there is the rest. I call them the 'Rest', since that is where I choose to lump them.

Crudely built, mostly box stock models that cannot stand up to close scrutiny. Usually currently available kits with questionable paint jobs and sloppily applied BMF treatments. RARELY ever detailed engines and often painted in colors not standard with accenting paints in clearly incorrect colors. Just an overabundance of ameteurishly built OOB models that scarcely require even the most casual glance.

I hope you will make room for one more category (as yet unnamed). I sell all my builds on eBay because: 1) I don't wish to harbor a collection, 2) I enjoy the building not the owning, 3) I'm not sentimental about them, and 4) I can use the money to purchase kits and supplies to keep this perpetual-motion machine going.

I do not consider myself a pro nor should others; this is an avocation and, regardless of the fact that I get money for a good (and maybe a service, too), it is not a way to make a living. I do not bill myself as a pro builder in my auction listings but I do highlight recognition of my work by contest judges and magazine editors (meager as those accolades may be). And while I do not make the kind of money Paul Hettick and a few others do, I make enough to satisfy my modeling needs. Would I like to get more from my auctions? Of course. Am I jealous of Paul? A little.

But I hope you'll agree that these are not "crudely built...models that cannot stand up to close scrutiny."

[Dragline]

Those are models of excellent quality indeed. They are in the minority when it comes to what the eBay crowd generally offers.

I hope you get what they are truly worth.

They are a cut above.

Bob

EDIT: Chillyb, I wish to seek some info. What would you ask for these builds? If I were to decide to sell a car I built [Perish the thought], what would I expect for it?

These builds are exceedingly nice but seem mostly box stock. Clearly, a nice finish is important, but what if there is extra detail?

What does the xtra detail bring? Your builds [in particular, the VW] are superbly built but seem stock. What is your experience in added detail and what it brings? I know you do detailed builds so any insight you provide will help us all undertsand the line of demarkation.

Edited April 22, 2010 by Dragline