Forum Contest Idea

[Harry P.]

4. Those who demonstrate poor sportsmanship in any way, shape or form should be barred from future entry. That goes for non-first-place people who are thin-skinned and unreasonable, and for people who gloat too much about winning.

And exactly who gets the fun job of enforcing rule #4?

[charlie8575]

I would say the judges, just like a real contest.

Which does bring up a question I hadn't considered, nor did I see addressed: who does the judging?

Charlie Larkin

[DRG]

While I personally like this idea I fear, from past events,it will do nothing but start a flame war again.

[jsimmons]

4. Those who demonstrate poor sportsmanship in any way, shape or form should be barred from future entry. That goes for non-first-place people who are thin-skinned and unreasonable, and for people who gloat too much about winning.

Well, given the proposed anonymous nature of the entries, there's really no way to enforce that. The only thing I can think of is at the point at which they upload their pictures, we make them click through a "don't be an ass-hat" screen before they upload their pics. I've been a programmer for over 30 years, and am fully aware that users ignore click-throughs (hell, I ignore them), but when someone acts like a jerk, we can at least point them to the click-through warning as evidence that they were informed of the rules, and that they chose to ignore them.

Edited May 7, 2011 by jsimmons

[jsimmons]

I would say the judges, just like a real contest.

Which does bring up a question I hadn't considered, nor did I see addressed: who does the judging?

Charlie Larkin

There are no judges. It's a people's choice/popular vote thing. Pictures of the finished model must be submitted *before* the end of the build phase, and when the build phase is completed, all of the submitted pictures are made available to be voted on by the general public. After a reasonable amount of time is allowed for voting, the voting is closed, and at that point, entrants can start owning up to the models they submitted, and posting their WIP log in the Workbench forums (if they so desire). They can also post their finished model pics in the Under Glass forum. I imagine a day or so after voting ends, winners will be announced.

Only completed models can be submitted, and all pictures must be submitted by midnight (eastern time) of the last day of the build phase.

[jsimmons]

While I personally like this idea I fear, from past events,it will do nothing but start a flame war again.

Yeah, and that's been discussed. The forum moderators will have to be ready/willing to step on people's necks when they act poorly. I guess this whole thing depends on whether or not the forum moderators want to have to deal with it. I guess fotki could be a good place to use for photos, but I have an unnatural distaste for free photo sites and really don't like creating accounts everywhere. I even pay for my own web hosting site. It has unlimited disk space and bandwidth, so if a place is needed, maybe I could host the pics there.

[charlie8575]

If it's totally anonymous, I think this eliminates the personality issues, or at the minimum, curtails them substantially.

I say let's try it.

Charlie Larkin

[DRG]

I will give you credit as you seem to have thought this through very well. You are to be commended for that as so many people come up with ideas and never think them through. I, as said before, like the idea and it is one I would support. I still fear flame wars getting started due to the personalities of some members, but with proper enforcement of the rules this should be able to be overcome.

I'm all for it, lets do this.

[Harry P.]

How (or to whom) are entries submitted? You said "photos are to be uploaded to a contest site." Who's site? This site? A remote site? Uploaded by whom? The entrant?

Or are you seeing a new "Model of the Month" area of the forum where people can just post their entry themselves?

If people are allowed to submit more than one photo of their entry, who sorts through the pics and decides which one to post as "the" entry?

Any limit as to total number of entries per contest period? Per person? Both?

How will judging/voting work? A poll here on the forum, or some other way?

What, if anything, does the winner get?

More questions as they arise...

[DRG]

Just my suggestions.

Upload pictures to a Model fo the Month thread on the forum.

1 picture per entry. ( better make it a good one)

No more than three entries per contestant.

Voting done by poll

His model is the model of the month. ( that's enough of a prize isn't it)

Like I said these are just my thoughts.

[highway]

How (or to whom) are entries submitted? You said "photos are to be uploaded to a contest site." Who's site? This site? A remote site? Uploaded by whom? The entrant?

Or are you seeing a new "Model of the Month" area of the forum where people can just post their entry themselves?

I'd have to take a wild guess and say since John said to avoid favoritsm, if it would be a separate area of the forum just like you do with Real or Model and Auto ID Quiz, all entries would have to be sent to him for him to open the thread. Otherwise, everyone would know who built the model because, obviously, it would have our names beside the pics.

@highway - There's no reason to get all twisted over the scale restriction.

Also John, I was not getting all twisted over the scale restriction, I was simply trying to get you to reconsider that rule because not only do regular shows and contests in a building not restrict scale, but also it would open the idea to those who build other scales. I myself really don't have an issue personally with it, since I would probably enter a 1/24 or 1/25 scale entry like most others here would, too. I was simply thinking of those others on the forum who may like to participate in this but don't regularly build anything but larger (or smaller) scale models. I'm sorry for your misunderstanding my point I was trying to get across.

[Harry P.]

I'd have to take a wild guess and say since John said to avoid favoritsm, if it would be a separate area of the forum just like you do with Real or Model and Auto ID Quiz, all entries would have to be sent to him for him to open the thread. Otherwise, everyone would know who built the model because, obviously, it would have our names beside the pics.

That was my point... somebody has to be in charge and run things every time... accept the entries, post them up, set up the poll, announce the winner, etc.

Just doing Auto ID and Real or Model every week, as simple as they are, is a PITA... staging and running a monthly contest is even more so. But hey, as long as he's willing to be that guy, and do all that, I say go for it!

[Nick Notarangelo]

To see how to pull it off if your interest gregg or harry contact John Lester at www.starshipmodeler.com and he can tell or show you how to pull it off.

[Harry P.]

To see how to pull it off if your interest gregg or harry contact John Lester at www.starshipmodeler.com and he can tell or show you how to pull it off.

Not me... I have enough to do already... I'm not interested in taking this on, too.

If this idea is going to fly, someone else is going to be doing it!

[jsimmons]

How (or to whom) are entries submitted? You said "photos are to be uploaded to a contest site." Who's site? This site? A remote site? Uploaded by whom? The entrant?

Or are you seeing a new "Model of the Month" area of the forum where people can just post their entry themselves?

If people are allowed to submit more than one photo of their entry, who sorts through the pics and decides which one to post as "the" entry?

Any limit as to total number of entries per contest period? Per person? Both?

How will judging/voting work? A poll here on the forum, or some other way?

What, if anything, does the winner get?

More questions as they arise...

File Location - Well, the location of the files is "yet to be determined". I certainly have the room on my web page, and I could easily use my skills/experience as a programmer to code a page that would allow submissions, and they could even be stored on my site since I have unlimited disk space/bandwidth available (and it's already paid for so no worries with respect to how much it's gonna cost. My vision is that each entrant can post up to five images (restricted to 800x600 pixels, and a file size that's no larger than 100-150K). Someone suggested more images, but for now, I'd like to keep it at five, at least for now.

Which Picture is Used? All of the pics posted are presented. The only person involved in choosing them is the person that posts them. It will be physically impossible to post more pics than what is mandated as the maximum. Once the pictures are posted, the entry will receive an entry ID, and with that ID, the entrant will be able to modify/replace any pictures he's already posted right up until the build phase has expired.

Number of Entries per builder - A builder can enter as many different cars as he wants. Selecting what category to enter a given model will be part of the picture upload process. Each car would be a different entry. He can enter multiple cars in the same category.

Voting Procedure - I haven't quite worked out how voting would occur. I assume that poll entries in this forum can be links, so we could simply link to an entry's pictures, or maybe a thumbnail could be used as the poll description instead of text. This obviously has to be thought out some more.

What do the winners get? - Scorn and/or admiration from their peers. There is no physical prize unless we want to try to get some sponsors lined up to donate kits, resin, paint, or some such thing like that. Maybe do like Trak does and put the winning models in a rotating banner at the top of the forum, or maybe a winners page in MCM. I certainly wouldn't mind seeing one of my models in a well-respected national magazine. Since it would only happen 2-3 times per year, I don't think that would put too much of a strain on companies that sell us stuff.

[jsimmons]

That was my point... somebody has to be in charge and run things every time... accept the entries, post them up, set up the poll, announce the winner, etc.

Just doing Auto ID and Real or Model every week, as simple as they are, is a PITA... staging and running a monthly contest is even more so. But hey, as long as he's willing to be that guy, and do all that, I say go for it!

I was thinking timelines more along the lines of 4-6 months. That would give time for most folks to build for at least the first two categories.

For the super-detail guys, they would probably be chompin' at the bit to say SOMETHING to someone about what they're building, but if they want to enter this contest with the model, they can utter so much as a peep until after the contest they've entered. For instance, let's the next contest starts in June. Let's also say I started building my Grand Sport Corvette sometime in the same time frame for the super detail category. Chances are that I won't be able to finish it for the end of the June contest (let's face it, I work for a living and have other stuff to do as well, just like everyone else here). However, it's entirely possible to finish it in time to enter it in the January contest. The only caveat is that I can't mention it in any way/shape/form in the forums (or any other forums for that matter) during the entire time I'm building the car. The only time I can talk about it is AFTER the build phase of the contest for which I submitted it as an entry.

So, as long as you haven't discussed your build in any way, the veil of anonymity is intact.

If I do it right, it will require very little maintenance on my part.

BTW, I was planning on retaining only the pictures of the winning entries so that disk space can be reclaimed.

[DRG]

Well John, I'm a member here just like you are but it sounds to me like Harry has given his blessing.

So let's get this thing going.

[Harry P.]

Well John, I'm a member here just like you are but it sounds to me like Harry has given his blessing.

So let's get this thing going.

Don't forget about Gregg... he's the guy who will ultimately decide yes or no. You might want to PM him and send him a link to this thread in case he hasn't seen it yet.

[DRG]

OOPS

[spud]

There have been several references about other sites Model of the Month, one site BMC has a tri-annual contest that runs rather smoothly. The current topic is Indy Cars. There is only one class, a wip must be done, and it is judged by popular vote. Some topics are chosen by popular vote and some are chosen by management.

This doesn't have to be as difficult as some suggest. I do like the 1:24-1:25 rule. You can detail a 1:6 far easier than a 1:25. In fact what's to stop someone from entering a 1:1? All cars are kits made by assembling parts and the detailing is so accurate and realistic.

[jsimmons]

There have been several references about other sites Model of the Month, one site BMC has a tri-annual contest that runs rather smoothly. The current topic is Indy Cars. There is only one class, a wip must be done, and it is judged by popular vote. Some topics are chosen by popular vote and some are chosen by management.

This doesn't have to be as difficult as some suggest. I do like the 1:24-1:25 rule. You can detail a 1:6 far easier than a 1:25. In fact what's to stop someone from entering a 1:1? All cars are kits made by assembling parts and the detailing is so accurate and realistic.

That's why I suggested the scale restriction - the larger (and smaller) scale kits are more expensive, and the larger scale kits are easier to detail. I didn't think it would be fair - especially in the super-detail category - to put 1/16 cars up against 1/43 or even 1/24-1/25. To avoid the hassles involved with maintaining a multiple-scale sub-category, I thought one scale would make it easy and simple to understand.

As far as the WIP thing, I think a WIP would skew people's vote, and the models would gain votes simply based on the amount of work that went into them, not to mention identifying the builder before voting takes place. We're only interested in the final product, not the path that was taken to get there (as far as voting is concerned). Like I said earlier, a WIP log would be more than welcomed AFTER the voting phase of the contest. This would serve two things - letting people know who built what, and seeing the WIP log.

[PeterC(MrMondeo)]

Just one question from over the pond, i have found that most threads get a lot of responce bassed on the fact of the type of car, i.e American cars.

Now the UK has a ltd supply of American car kits , we tend to have a lot of Tamiya, Revell, Aoshima etc which tend to be Euro and Jap kits.

If i was to enter a Euro car of some form i feel ( and this is just me , i think ) that i would be at a disadvantage on votes.

If say i was to do a Tamiya XR4i kit, it would be nowhere near as popular as say a Chevrolet kit of some form.

So because of that it may put me off ( and maybe others ) from entering ????????

So i cant see anyway the votes not being Biased , from the stand point of what type of kit is built , Unless you have seperate catorgories ????????

sorry had to post this

[jsimmons]

Just one question from over the pond, i have found that most threads get a lot of responce bassed on the fact of the type of car, i.e American cars.

Now the UK has a ltd supply of American car kits, we tend to have a lot of Tamiya, Revell, Aoshima etc which tend to be Euro and Jap kits.

If i was to enter a Euro car of some form i feel (and this is just me, i think) that i would be at a disadvantage on votes.

If say i was to do a Tamiya XR4i kit, it would be nowhere near as popular as say a Chevrolet kit of some form.

So because of that it may put me off (and maybe others) from entering ????????

So i cant see anyway the votes not being Biased , from the stand point of what type of kit is built , Unless you have seperate catorgories ????????

sorry had to post this

I honestly didn't know what a XR4i was, but when I googled it, I actually found a picture of a 1:1 pro-stock car. Anyway, I suppose you might have a point - I certainly am not that enamored with euro cars, but a well-built model supported by outstanding pictures would probably stand a pretty good chance of being voted on. When you get right down to it, a people's choice contest is the most unpredictable kind, and your only hope is that most of the voting public likes your entry more than the next guy.

I'm thinking that for the first couple of contests, we should not have themes at all, and instead just have the three main categories, just to see what kind of entries we get. If it looks like changes need to be made (and if there's continued interest in the contests), it would be relatively easy to make those changes.

One thing you should probably consider - the vast majority of people on this forum are from the U.S, and therefore, are probably more incluined to vote for a model of an American car. If you aren't from the U.S., and you want to enter a model that isn't somehow "Americanized" (tailored to an American automotive palette), it would certainly behove you to consider that probablity before entering a model. I'm not saying it WILL happen that way, but at the same time, you honestly shouldn't expect a different outcome.

Edited May 12, 2011 by jsimmons

[The Creative Explorer]

and the larger scale kits are easier to detail.

I think you are sadly mistaken in that comment It doesn't sound like you've build big-scales, but the main problem is part-supply. Most detailing items needs to be scratchbuild, the bigger the scale, the more difficult it gets. Since the flaws will amplify.

After the part is made, it does place easier than a small-scale, but that's it.

[Monte's Motors]

I beleive if this contest idea becomes TOO serious, that hurt feelings, fights, and the like probably will develop.

As example that these very things happen NOW without the contest.

I would like a contest but, the #1 rule should be ONLY FOR FUN .

Rule #2, entering the contest and fighting later over not winning or the winner was junk, should receive a one week ban from posting. HEY remember rule #1.

I'm ALL FOR A CONTEST