LR3 Posted October 20, 2011 Author Share Posted October 20, 2011 I have limited material access in my little country village so I started carving the cockpit interior out of pine. It is a doable do but more difficult than I would like. I tried to find some Polyurethane foam. The local florist is my only source so far and it has a crush factor and nothing will stick to it. Can anybody clue me into a product source and type material I can order from the web? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LAone Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 im drawing a blank as to what the name was, but its a foam thats used for making signs. i think its the same stuff darren-b is using on his lowrider truck build. hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Sprinter Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 Syd Here's a first pass at designing a 4 bar frame for your sprinter.. I will do a refined version as well as a top and front view. This will work using 3/16 tube (1 1/2" real size). I hope you can solve the interior material problem as I struggle with that too. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Sprinter Posted October 22, 2011 Share Posted October 22, 2011 Syd; I've refined the plan and think this will work for your project. It should fit the body nicely. The wheelbase turned out to be 89 1/2 inches, just right for this monster. I hope you can use some or all of this. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 (edited) WOW - GREAT!!!! and Fast! You do good work Ken. Yes on the drawings particularly the front axle. Any other details and dimensions you can give us will make it that much easier to build. If you can when you are done, try taping the drawings to the wall for pictures. If you can get the camera flat to the drawing when photographing you can make the picture a plan plate but seeing as you say you are sending the drawings to me, I can also post pictures people can use as full size print out plans. Be interesting to see where we make the panel breaks which I guess will be established by the "birdcage"?? Not up on the terms. MF says the bodies will now be delivered without panel lines so anyone can establish their own layouts. By not having a frame following the cockpit edge (like most of the vintage sprinters did) it will be easier to make up cockpit padding that meets the cockpit edge (the frame really gave me fits carving a seat for the earlier design.) Edited October 23, 2011 by LR3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Sprinter Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 (edited) I'm glad you like the progress. The birdcages are suspension componets for a live axle rear end. They encase the axle and position the radius rods, shocks and torsion bar arms. You should use wishbone type radius rods for this era of sprinter. I will include more dimensions but the vellum paper is 1/8" grid so each square is scale 1" by 1".If you print the sheet, the grid disappears leaving only the drawing, so I will send you the original. Sometime too much dimensioning clutters up the sheet and makes it confusing. IMO. You will need a Jacobs ladder as well to position the rear side to side. It's like a fancy sway bar used by most all sprint cars. Edited October 23, 2011 by Old Sprinter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Sprinter Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Okay Syd the plans are race ready. I will get them off in the morning's mail for you. You really got to post your build, now, as I can't wait to see this come together. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted October 27, 2011 Author Share Posted October 27, 2011 The chassis drawings are great and the mounting details really help as it is hard to pull that info from web pictures. I will post salient prints as the construction moves on. Here is one example. With the frame much lower than the cockpit rim I can now make the seat a drop in module meeting the cockpit edge. Didn't understand the need when making the original frame like a 1930's sprinter. Renshape and other materails have been proposed but all seem pricey so I will use wood for the final seat. Smoothing the back curve using "Fixall" from the hardware store helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 3, 2011 Author Share Posted November 3, 2011 What I don’t know fills volumes. Kurtis was using torsions bars on his midget race cars in the late 40s and his larger KK2000 cars from around 1950 had a look similar to MF’s Vintage Sprint car. So actually I stumbled into a plausible 1950 design with a torsion bar car. For those wishing to build the earlier version type sprint car with a Deuce kit frame, here are some plans of a Kuns sprint car. Google Hillegass Sprint Car for a detailed set of pictures showing a complete restoration of this era sprint car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 3, 2011 Author Share Posted November 3, 2011 Rambling on (not a planner) looks like this version should just be called "4 bar" instead of by a date. It will basically follow the plans Ken Meaders sent; I will post sections that can be printed on letter size paper as I go along. There will be modifications. Front axle seems like a place to start so I can see how it will fit to the frame. Can only build out to the spindles as the brakes will not fit through the frame. I am hooked on TDR's disk brakes but darn it, MF's Halibrand wheels will not fit over them. Wish I had discovered that before finishing up the brakes. One could probably sand the calipers down enough to slip in but mine are finished. Even then they barely fit inside my old Deuce wheels. Anyway - back to the front axle - made up spindles. And began work on the rear axle. The brake mounting plate is scratch built as it was not available with the donated brake parts. Old wheel/tire is just for reference (from a prior model). All this scratch building helps the budget and at my age I have more time than money. I can drag this pair of builds out all winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 7, 2011 Author Share Posted November 7, 2011 Testing the rear axle assembly. This is where the TDR Quick Change rear end would work the best because you slide a tube through it for an assembly. Salvaging an old kit part, the axle tube is locked in place and the complete rear end can not be added to a completed chassis. The "4 bar" chassis will have to be assembled around the rear end. The earlier vintage chassis dropped over the rear end with no problems. As I am not sure I can align all the pieces during assembly I glued the axle/wheel back plate to the brake caliper mount plate. I have TDR bolts on order as most bolt applications wind up in blind holes and these will be much cheaper in the long run than metal bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 7, 2011 Author Share Posted November 7, 2011 I made up the parts for the 4 torsion bars but can not assemble them until I have a frame to solder the casings to. In case anyone else wants to build the Vintage Sprint Car as a "4 Bar" these full scale copies of Ken's plan will print out on letter size paper. Just paste them together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 7, 2011 Author Share Posted November 7, 2011 And the plan views. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 9, 2011 Author Share Posted November 9, 2011 Finished the rear axle shock and radius rod mounts. Inside mount pieces are loose until I get the radius rod ends on order from TDR. Not sure of their dimensions. I can’t visualize what something will look like so I have to keep laying things out to see what will fit where and what clearances will be required. There will be some deviations from Kens plan as the physical parts are laid out and I can see the clearances for real. The new Vintage Sprint bodies do not have molded in panel lines so we can make our panel cuts fit any particular frame layout. Based on how this frame will be set up I plan to cut panels as shown when the new body is available. Be interesting to see how this turns out with a full body pan except for the possibly required quick change rear end clearances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 11, 2011 Author Share Posted November 11, 2011 I am following Meaders drawings for the most part but felt the chassis ends were too contemporary for the vintage body so I bobbed them. This will allow the body cut outs around the suspension to hide behind the wheels and the end result, I hope, will be more like the red car posted earlier. I have laid the pair of frame sides on an earlier picture to get an idea of where to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 14, 2011 Author Share Posted November 14, 2011 Ah shucks - at my age I can't remember anything. Forgot the extended length of the quick change rear end. I can still jam it in but it is tight and shortens the wheel base another 2". Now I see why Ken drew the torsion bars low and extended. I Have rebilt this chassis too many times to do it again. Forgot that I had to build it around the kit rear end (really would be smart to get the TDR quick change for ease of assembly) and didn't like the first try. Then it takes a few re-solders as the frame is tweaked into position. It is a little fiddly to position the hoops inside the body also. Position, check, nip ends, position, check, etc. then hope soldering doesn't change things. Wish TDR would get moving on their open wheel racer plan. I am not a scratch builder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 17, 2011 Author Share Posted November 17, 2011 Taped everything in place to be sure they fit. Much easier to handle the motor with the upper frame member staying below the carburetors. This will make it easy to drop the seat in as a prefabricated module also. Based on the heft of this model I believe I should make the torsion bars and arms out of copper and solder them in place. Not sure the styrene ones will hold up to handling etc. although adding the shocks will help strengthen the running gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Sprinter Posted November 18, 2011 Share Posted November 18, 2011 Looks good, Syd. What material have you decided on doing the seat out of ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 Very impressive work so far! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted November 19, 2011 Share Posted November 19, 2011 Outstanding and I hope you keep making progress. Great fun to watch you build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 19, 2011 Author Share Posted November 19, 2011 Temporary installation of the steering box and firewall. Looks like there are good clearances. I hope I can extract the steering for chassis painting later (Easier to jam things in than extract.) I will need to make a final fitted dashboard for the new body. Someone had asked what material I plan to use for the seat. I obtained some carving foam from Amazon. It had been suggested earlier as Poly something, anyway it turns out to be a denser version of the foam florist use. I only saw the 5 Lb. density, which is what I ordered. They make a 10 Lb. density that would be better I think. Anyway, this will be much easier to cut to shape than pine. I will cut it in at the bottom so that a shoulder holds the seat on the upper frame rail. I am not much of a carver so I will still form the seat curve by filling in with a Spackle like substance called "Fixall" like I did for the first Sprint car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted November 22, 2011 Author Share Posted November 22, 2011 Used the Vintage version of the dash to test how instruments, ignition and fuel shut offs might look. Pretty simple dash requirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted December 6, 2011 Author Share Posted December 6, 2011 Seeing as this will be open wheel with disk brakes I guess brake lines are in order. Kludged together a brake system. The master cylinder will probably be hidden by the seat module and I doubt the coupling to the front/back brake lines will be in view so I didn't spend time detailing them. The only thing that will be seen is the brake handle. Not really sure why I went to the effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostreet Posted December 6, 2011 Share Posted December 6, 2011 Looking good, What are you using for the brake line? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR3 Posted December 6, 2011 Author Share Posted December 6, 2011 Looking good, What are you using for the brake line? Just some wire I had laying around. This is a mix of parts and scratch built items to fit inside a Vintage Body from the Madd Fabricator. No action plan - just add a little here and there while waiting for the final body. I am getting ahead of myself because the more I add the more I am afraid will interfere with fitting everything inside the body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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