#28 Havoline Thunderbird and future stock car building questions

[Clp0808]

Hey everyone, I am building the #28 Havoline stock car the black and white version and have a few questions athe kit and for future stock car builds.

1) The instructions say to paint the chassis gloss black but the box shows like a light gray color.  Which is correct?  This will be my 2nd NASCAR  build and I'm  not going for 100% accuracy nor a super detailed kit (not till I become more familiar with stock car building) but a "looks good/accurate enough" build.

2) Where should I mask off for the two tone paint?  Can't really see placement points and there really isn't much info for the black and white car.

3) After gluing the front and rear fascia on there is a seam (obviously).  Do these seams exist on the real cars or are they completely seam free?

4) My first ever completed stock car is the #30 Pennzoil 1993? Grand Prix.  I hollowed out the wheel backs like I usually do to help the wheels go on and have all 4 corners touch the ground.  Car looks good, however (my opinion) it seems to sit a bit high for a stock car.  Am I right?  If so what tips do y'all have for lowering the kits and by how much (scale wise)?

5) The engines that are in the cars from the respected manufacturers (ie, Ford small block in Thunderbirds) or they built by another company?  Would like to add plug wires to a future build.

6) Where is the best place online to get reference material on wiring and plumbing a stock car?  

Sorry for the long post but I have tried to look things up myself and figured I get advice from those who actually do the builds.  Thanks for any help anyone can give me.

 

[Fabrux]

Several different colors in the chassis were used up until the early 90s by which point they switched to a uniform light grey across the board. The engine would be a Ford design of 358ci but are usually built by a specialty shop or in house by the biggest teams.

[Clp0808]

Thank you for that information. So would I be correct to assume whatever car I build (Pontiac,  Ford, Chevy) the engine would follow that manufacturers firing order for a small block?

[Fabrux]

That would be a reasonable assumption.

[Kyleap]

Gm products all used Chevrolet engine blocks no matter , Pontiac, olds, Buick, the Fords all used Ford blocks I forget what year they all went to a pretty much universal block I think it was around 2000 or so maybe I'm incorrect 

[swede70]

On 5/10/2022 at 7:41 PM, Clp0808 said:

1) The instructions say to paint the chassis gloss black but the box shows like a light gray color.  Which is correct?  This will be my 2nd NASCAR  build and I'm  not going for 100% accuracy nor a super detailed kit (not till I become more familiar with stock car building) but a "looks good/accurate enough" build.

2) Where should I mask off for the two tone paint?  Can't really see placement points and there really isn't much info for the black and white car.

3) After gluing the front and rear fascia on there is a seam (obviously).  Do these seams exist on the real cars or are they completely seam free?

4) My first ever completed stock car is the #30 Pennzoil 1993? Grand Prix.  I hollowed out the wheel backs like I usually do to help the wheels go on and have all 4 corners touch the ground.  Car looks good, however (my opinion) it seems to sit a bit high for a stock car.  Am I right?  If so what tips do y'all have for lowering the kits and by how much (scale wise)?

5) The engines that are in the cars from the respected manufacturers (ie, Ford small block in Thunderbirds) or they built by another company?  Would like to add plug wires to a future build.

6) Where is the best place online to get reference material on wiring and plumbing a stock car? 

Greetings and doing my ambassadorial bit as such things go...

1. I suspect that the instructions and paint recommendations researched and recommended across plastic kit manufacturers is some of the less prestigious work within the company and oftentimes reflects a largely lame effort to promote sales of common hobby items situated next to the plastic kit section of a department/hobby/hardware store versus reflecting much in the way of accuracy.  Before long a new builder will refer to the instructions regarding paint choices scarcely at all, relying instead on textual and photographic resources to inform the way.

2. Although perhaps making too much of things for a novice, usually I'll collect a great many images online and across digital image archives - to speak little of gathering period magazines and related items such as programs to best establish how a topic was configured and at what venue.  Think like a restoration and fabrication facility with deep resources to establish the best informed estimate regarding how things should be - then act.  A well-researched succession of choices regarding how something should be configured and finished basically defends itself from critics, whereas some better informed 'heads' won't strictly respond with important information or insight unless they feel their input will be appreciated; i.e. telegraph respect for the topic and due seriousness and those lurking in the shadows will notice and will contribute if they believe what they might afford in terms of insight won't go to waste.

3.  Careful review of period reference would best relate how things are handled and done, whereas I'd guess the seams were largely correct.  With a head in a book or for analysis of images one can in time come to 'own' a topic, becoming something of a lay authority given few might strictly pose a question plus pursue the matter to a logical end.

4.  Indeed - if a scale topic doesn't look good on wheels; i.e. if the ride height is off, if a wheel is hanging in space, if the track is incorrect or if wheel and tire dimensions call attention to clumsy scaling or telegraph the impression that one is looking more at a toy rather than something to be taken seriously - then yes, best to alter or correct things should this be within the realm of the possible for you.  Appreciate too that most builders/modifiers of plastic kits purchase more than one example, and silently if not off screen test this spare kit or kits to destruction as they learn to alter the ride height, expand or narrow the track, steal items from one kit and adapt the use of such to another, etc.  Yes - multiple kits were hurt or rendered so much trash for my experimentation consistent with learning what I felt I needed to, whereas basically wrecking things for harboring ambitions too great or unestimating the difficulties to be encountered is pretty standard experiential stuff. 

5.  (Here I fluffed my answer for not really reading your question, although still some insights to share.  M.K.)  Yes - some manufacturers will develop a reputation in relation to work done on a particular tool consistent with having on offer the best rendition of whatever one strictly desires, although this is not to say that a box stock build (all parts afforded from the same tool or kit) strictly leaves one debilitated.  Proceed in stages and expense looking forward.  You may be in the market for a pre-wired distributor to keep matters simple at this stage.

6.  Sources online vary greatly - to say the very least.  Expect to take some lumps for climbing a learning curve consistent with developing an understanding of how the actual racing cars are configured, how they developed, and how the rule book evolved consistent with affording what you'll see or discover.  I would suggest developing a period magazine and book collection, while I highly recommend developing familiarity with the new online digital image archives in the form of Petersen Publishing/SAE, Revs Stanford, Getty Images, etc. as soon you'll come to rely upon such heavily.  Even something like a Google image search pounding away with a succession of search terms altered just a bit to conceivably capture everything (example: 'NASCAR AMC', 'NASCAR Matador', 'Donohue Matador', 'Penske NASCAR', 'Traco NASCAR', 'Marcis NASCAR', etc.) basically taps out all the possibilities and fills up a stick drive with most everything that would be free.   Deeper resources typically demand deeper pockets, while actual vehicle and race series message boards can and should be identified and tapped. Good luck then...

Mike K./Swede70

Edited June 8, 2022 by swede70

[chris coller]

Here's a pic of my build. You can use this for reference. What decals are you using? I used Powerslide. I used the extra red on the 87 option stripes to cover some of the bleed through. 

[TransAmMike]

Ya get anything done on this model Clint? IMO, It's the best looking Davey Allison car (great guy may he rest in peace). Did this kit years' ago but was packed away for a move and never unpacked.