1/12th Trumpeter GT40

[Cato]

Thanks - think I will give tubing a try.

All six of these pumps can't be fuel related? Can you give a run down on function?

Would be nice to find an 1/8th scale Cobra kit wouldn't it?

Yes they are the fuel system. The GT's carried the fuel cells in the outer 'pontoons' next to each seat, under the doors. Remember these were endurance racers-the thing runs for 24 hours. To my knowledge, two of the three pumps per side ran full time and one per side was 'back-up'. They were probably 'selectable' from dash switches. I may be wrong-maybe Len or any guys with better knowledge can chime in. Here's a shot at LeMans in '66:

Here the cells are shown out of their monocoque shells. I think Firestone made these. Note they have two access openings-one at the front that the fuel from the filler enters, which then crosses over (in front of the dash) and feeds the 'passenger' side. The second opening is what's in the car under the plate right next to the seats. The tanks had to fuel evenly so that side-to-side weight distribution remained constant. Hope I'm right so jump in and correct me if I'm mistaken.

1/8 Cobra? I'd have been fine with a 1/12! Had a chat with some of the TDR guys about it last year and offered photo documentation of my engine, trans and other original parts (windshield, wheels, steering wheel etc). Rick thought maybe someday in the future but they had a full agenda of the parts you see them releasing now. Daytona Tim chose his name because he used to have a Daytona replica he had built. So I'm sure someday those guys will bring out a killer kit.

There's a guy floating around the forums called BMWMech who has actually begun to scratch a 1/8 Cobra 427. I and a few of the Cobra forum members helped him with references and dimensions and he actually built a near complete brass chassis-then has disappeared! He does beautiful work as I've seen several of his other models including Ferrari.

I'll have to be content with my 1:1 ( ) but I can't put it on my desk...

[LR3]

Good info. Wasn't thinking about the two tanks so two set of pumps. At my age the brain slips a cog now and then. I think Trumpeter might have tried to simplify things. They plumb from a tank to the inboard pump on the left side then to the fuel filter. The out board pumps are fed from the tank and have parallel in and out but then go nowhere I can see. The right hand combination is the same but does not pass over to the filter that I can see. Not much room to play around in there.

[Pete J.]

Not quite right. According the Lee Holman(Holman Moody) there was a Bendix aircraft fuel pump submerged in the right hand tank. There was a single crossover pipe about 2" in diameter that ran under the seats. How would you like to be sitting on that one. You may see a different configuration now on restored cars as the cars were converted to exterior fuel pumps, one on each side and the crossover pipe was eliminated for safety reasons. Apparently the Bendix pumps were prone to shorting out and associated fire problems. On restored cars with two fuel pumps they are individually controlled with a switch on the dash.

[Cato]

Not quite right. According the Lee Holman(Holman Moody) there was a Bendix aircraft fuel pump submerged in the right hand tank. There was a single crossover pipe about 2" in diameter that ran under the seats. How would you like to be sitting on that one. You may see a different configuration now on restored cars as the cars were converted to exterior fuel pumps, one on each side and the crossover pipe was eliminated for safety reasons. Apparently the Bendix pumps were prone to shorting out and associated fire problems. On restored cars with two fuel pumps they are individually controlled with a switch on the dash.

Pete,

Thanks for sharing some new information. I have some questions about the info you acquired from Lee Holman, an excellent source as his dad's team prepared and modified the three MK II's for '66. Regarding the fuel system, was he referring to the way his team modified the three cars or the way the cars came from FAV? I found no conclusive evidence in the Pearce/Cotter book "Holman-Moody" regarding the way the fuel systems were designed other than the fact that the team jointly developed the Firestone cells.

I was mistaken that the crossover pipe was in front of the dash. It is indeed under the seats but there is also a tubular connector to the fill necks as I described.

From the book "The Ford GT", citing SAE Paper 670066 by Jos. Macura and Jonathan Bowers:

"Figure 29 shows the complete fuel system in the vehicle. Three electric fuel pumps are used in this installation. Two of these pumps are connected in parallel and are used at all times unless the engine runs out of fuel. In such an emergency, the driver switches over to the third fuel pump. This enables the driver to return to the pit for refueling.

At the outset of the program, the standard production mechanical fuel pump was used in conjunction with one emergency electric pump. During vehicle testing, some mechanical fuel pump arm failures were experienced when running on the electric pump. Unloading of the arm caused a non-follow condition because of lack of fuel pressure. The mechanical fuel pump was then replaced by two electric pumps."

There is an illustrated diagram which clearly shows this layout but no in-tank pump. This collection of SAE papers documents Ford's development program on the cars, not how later teams may have modified them. NO WHERE however, can info be found that six pumps were mounted as Trumpeter has done. I have quite good photos that Stauffer's restoration of 1046 (the kit chassis) has only the three on the left side. So does chassis 1015. Here is 1046, the car Trump replicated for this kit:

Remember, it's a Shelby car not a HM.

And yes, restored cars are never exactly as the cars were at LeMans in '66.

Your avatar shows you(?) seated in a GT. Care to share that info? If original, which chassis and if replica did you build it?

[LR3]

Trying to see through objects it looks like the outboard pump is in parallel as stated to the middle pump. The middle pump looks to feed the inboard pump in a connection with the tank then the inboard pump goes to the filter.

Frankly too complicated with the little room available so I will basically repeat the model instructions. Now I wonder why my pumps are located so low as seen in the following picture on the left? The picture on the right is from the Trumpeter display. The pumps there are about a quarter inch plus higher giving access to the pump connections. Cato - are yours like either of these placements?

Also notice the neat display AN to flex line mating. I wonder if he mounted the connections then mated the flex? If I was to make this model again (can't afford to) I would use RM Motion or Detail Master AN connections as the flex is then inserted inside the connector.

You can see there are three input holes for the filter so someone could bring a fuel line from the righthand side to the filter. (not covered in the instructions).

Edited July 11, 2010 by LR3

[Pete J.]

Pete,

Thanks for sharing some new information. I have some questions about the info you acquired from Lee Holman, an excellent source as his dad's team prepared and modified the three MK II's for '66. Regarding the fuel system, was he referring to the way his team modified the three cars or the way the cars came from FAV? I found no conclusive evidence in the Pearce/Cotter book "Holman-Moody" regarding the way the fuel systems were designed other than the fact that the team jointly developed the Firestone cells.

I was mistaken that the crossover pipe was in front of the dash. It is indeed under the seats but there is also a tubular connector to the fill necks as I described.

From the book "The Ford GT", citing SAE Paper 670066 by Jos. Macura and Jonathan Bowers:

"Figure 29 shows the complete fuel system in the vehicle. Three electric fuel pumps are used in this installation. Two of these pumps are connected in parallel and are used at all times unless the engine runs out of fuel. In such an emergency, the driver switches over to the third fuel pump. This enables the driver to return to the pit for refueling.

At the outset of the program, the standard production mechanical fuel pump was used in conjunction with one emergency electric pump. During vehicle testing, some mechanical fuel pump arm failures were experienced when running on the electric pump. Unloading of the arm caused a non-follow condition because of lack of fuel pressure. The mechanical fuel pump was then replaced by two electric pumps."

There is an illustrated diagram which clearly shows this layout but no in-tank pump. This collection of SAE papers documents Ford's development program on the cars, not how later teams may have modified them. NO WHERE however, can info be found that six pumps were mounted as Trumpeter has done. I have quite good photos that Stauffer's restoration of 1046 (the kit chassis) has only the three on the left side. So does chassis 1015. Here is 1046, the car Trump replicated for this kit:

Remember, it's a Shelby car not a HM.

And yes, restored cars are never exactly as the cars were at LeMans in '66.

Your avatar shows you(?) seated in a GT. Care to share that info? If original, which chassis and if replica did you build it?

Lets start with the avatar first. The answer is neither. Confused? Actually it is a "continuation" car. The car is Lee Holman's personal car. He was gearing up to build continuation cars. The Historic racing society recognizes continuation cars as new cars built to original specifications by the original builder. There are continuation Cobras that were done by Carrol Shelby. I know it is an interesting distinction, but with a few exceptions, these are essentially cars made from NOS or new parts made to original specification, with updates for safety.

So not a recreation because they are a continuation of the original build. His chassis was build at Titus in England from the original panel jigs that survived the Abey Panel fire, so they are original in all aspects except for some very minor details. He outright owns all the original blue prints from the Mark IIs and manufactures all parts to original specs. His cars are essentially, new original cars.

His fuel system is changed for safety, in that the car has two fuel pumps on each side and the crossover is eliminated(hell of a fire hazard). Why I am sitting in his car? A year and a half ago, Matthew Wells, his brother, and I were privileged to visit his shop in Charlotte, N.C. and spend the day with him photographing the cars and listening to his stories.

I think the one thing that is very unclear to most, is the role that HM played in the Mk IIs. It helps to understand if you know the position the HM played with Fords racing effort. HM was much more than a racing team. From Ford's perspective, HM was a racing factory. They were huge. They had everything needed to fabricate racing cars on a large scale. All the Mark II white metal chassis were ship to HM and the building was done on site. Engine, suspension, trans axles, all of it was installed by HM. From there the cars were given to the racing teams and three were campaigned by HM. Between seasons they all came back to HM to be refurbished and were then sent back out to the teams. That is why you will see them all together in a shop at various time. This is a similar role to what Alen Mann played with the Mk I's. HM in this role, was more behind the scenes and did not get a lot of the credit they should have. Incidentally, Lee was an integral part of the team and was involved directly with the campaign. I have seen several picture on his wall in Charlotte, that have him on the pit wall at Le Mans. The man knows more about the cars, that just about anyone living today.

Incidentally, George Stauffer's car was restored at HM, because he his the major repository for all things Mk II. How that came about is an interesting story also. When Ford got out of racing they did so because they were afraid of legal actions and went on a rampage destroying everything to do with racing at corporate. They were trying very hard to divorce them selfs from all bits racing, not just the GT 40's. Since HM was involved with a lot of stock car and rally car stuff, they when to HM and made them the owners of all the racing stuff along with all the responsibility for it. Holman has a letter that gives him the rights to all of it. He actually can use the Ford logo and the other racing trademarks to produce parts. Kind of interesting. He literally has stacks of original blueprints for Ford racing cars.

The bit about the Bendix submersible fuel pump was one of the stories that he told us that day in January of '09. He did not clarify whether this was original, or if it was an engineering development and I was not wise enough to ask. I do know that he was adamant about the safety of it. There very well may have been multiple pumps. I have a drawing of the lay out but it is a Mk I's somewhere and Lee said that the system was different in the Mk II. The subject came up when discussing the originality of his car.

You are quite right about the filler necks. Being on both sides of the car, I did question the cross over tube and he said that the cars could be filled from either side and the crossover took care of the balance. Quite a simple system. The comment about Firestone is correct. They did develop the fuel cells, but bailed early in the program. It was about the time of Ralph Nader's rampage and corporations were running scared. Firestone also supplied some early tires.

I will have to dig through and see about the entire fuel system and the relation between the Mk I and Mk II's. Have fun with the build.

Edited July 11, 2010 by Pete J.

[Cato]

Syd,

My pump arrangement is just like yours-buried between the firewall and the bulkhead. The Trump example is obviously modified-they knew it wouldn't work the way they designed it. Theirs is mounted forward more-at the edge of the floor plate. I will try to build mine like the photo of 1046 above-on an aluminum plate, bolted to the firewall so they're all easy to mount and plumb. I will not mount the driver-side pumps.

Len,

Thanks for the new info about your trip to H-M with Wells. I hope someday he will use all the documentation gathered to do his own kit. (I can imagine what that would cost). I know why they didn't proceed with a trans-kit of this Trump.

Is this Lee's car that you sat in?:

Last I saw in the '90's, the price for one of these was $725K. Do you know how many have been sold?

Yes, I learned a great deal of what you wrote from Pearce's H-M book. I'm aware of the 'factory' concept and the reliance of Ford on H-M for the program on MKII's. I'm familiar with their 'continuation' status also. It seems more fitting for H-M rather than the Safir cars. The Cobra world is always debating which Cobras are 'real', 'replicas', 'continuations' or 'fakes'-it gives me a headache sometimes.

Thanks for sharing and any new info you present is appreciated.

[Harry P.]

What a great thread this is! So much good information...

[LR3]

Good idea to move the pumps out to a mounting plate Cato. I just don't have the energy to take the cab off and try to remove the pumps. I tried various tricks to solve the problem. I used wire flex to jump over the fire wall sill to feed the parallel pumps. I tried tubing for connections to the pump going to the filter. Painted one line aluminum to simulate flex. Now I see that I also have to paint the feed line (since been done.) I used an R B Motion AN connector to hook up the wire flex from the filter to the carb. I think anyone being serious with this model might wind up using #4 flex from Detail Master and either Detail Master or R B Motion AN connections for a clean hookup to all the fuel items.

I tried white glue to mate the kit AN connections to their woven flex. It did not wick and looked great but in handling them during hookup I managed to part all the connections.

[Cato]

Good idea to move the pumps out to a mounting plate Cato. I just don't have the energy to take the cab off and try to remove the pumps. I tried various tricks to solve the problem. I used wire flex to jump over the fire wall sill to feed the parallel pumps. I tried tubing for connections to the pump going to the filter. Painted one line aluminum to simulate flex. Now I see that I also have to paint the feed line (since been done.) I used an R B Motion AN connector to hook up the wire flex from the filter to the carb. I think anyone being serious with this model might wind up using #4 flex from Detail Master and either Detail Master or R B Motion AN connections for a clean hookup to all the fuel items.

I tried white glue to mate the kit AN connections to their woven flex. It did not wick and looked great but in handling them during hookup I managed to part all the connections.

Overall, a good solution Syd. Looks fine and with the oil coolers in place and the line, it will 'busy-up' that area and mask the faking we're forced to do. I've only been able to get white glue to work on the glass mountings-didn't think it would hold the tiny fittings.

I thought RB and Detail Master only did 1/24, 1/25 parts-they do 1/12 as well? If so I will try the rubber hose first with their fittings or also buy their flex line if not happy with the hose. I originally built the Cobra with braided lines for the oil system but then switched to the black woven fiber cloth from Aeroquip and used their nickel fittings. It's lighter than the braided and much less bling-more the vintage look.

[LR3]

Overall, a good solution Syd. Looks fine and with the oil coolers in place and the line, it will 'busy-up' that area and mask the faking we're forced to do. I've only been able to get white glue to work on the glass mountings-didn't think it would hold the tiny fittings.

I thought RB and Detail Master only did 1/24, 1/25 parts-they do 1/12 as well? If so I will try the rubber hose first with their fittings or also buy their flex line if not happy with the hose. I originally built the Cobra with braided lines for the oil system but then switched to the black woven fiber cloth from Aeroquip and used their nickel fittings. It's lighter than the braided and much less bling-more the vintage look.

Looking at the oil coolers - it looks like they have a fitting at the top for the left cooler only. They are just letting the right one sit untended. I saw one reference photo that showed some other container on the right side next to the cooler with a line from the cooler to it but I could not see where it went from there. With my leaving the right hand pumps in place I would not have room for it but others might if you have any reference photo for that area.

Edited July 12, 2010 by LR3

[Cato]

Syd,

Aside from the view of 1946 above, the best I have is these two views of restored and vintage-raced 1015. Think these were taken at Goodwood in the last few years.

The car was reputably restored very close to '66 LeMans spec and only reliability and convenience items for vintage racing changed. (Like the braided hose).

The aluminum 'shelf', turkey pan and distributor cover are removed here for pit maintenance. Note the blue chassis and the weld beads on the headers.

Now I'm speculating here but it's possible that the coolers were both plumbed and operating in the 24 Hour Race. I have no race-day shots showing the coolers clearly. Modern vintage events are seldom more than 30 laps or possibly one hour, like the LeMans Revival event. So that much additional cooling is unnecessary now. Pure guess so show me otherwise-I'd love to know.

BTW- I'd love to see ANY vintage reference photos you or any readers of this thread may care to share. I'd like to do mine with as much '66 detail as possible. I hope we can compile and share info in this one thread. Would be helpful to any kit builders sitting on the sidelines too.

Edited July 12, 2010 by Cato

[Pete J.]

Syd,

My pump arrangement is just like yours-buried between the firewall and the bulkhead. The Trump example is obviously modified-they knew it wouldn't work the way they designed it. Theirs is mounted forward more-at the edge of the floor plate. I will try to build mine like the photo of 1046 above-on an aluminum plate, bolted to the firewall so they're all easy to mount and plumb. I will not mount the driver-side pumps.

Len,

Thanks for the new info about your trip to H-M with Wells. I hope someday he will use all the documentation gathered to do his own kit. (I can imagine what that would cost). I know why they didn't proceed with a trans-kit of this Trump.

Is this Lee's car that you sat in?:

Last I saw in the '90's, the price for one of these was $725K. Do you know how many have been sold?

Yes, I learned a great deal of what you wrote from Pearce's H-M book. I'm aware of the 'factory' concept and the reliance of Ford on H-M for the program on MKII's. I'm familiar with their 'continuation' status also. It seems more fitting for H-M rather than the Safir cars. The Cobra world is always debating which Cobras are 'real', 'replicas', 'continuations' or 'fakes'-it gives me a headache sometimes.

Thanks for sharing and any new info you present is appreciated.

Yep, that is the car. This view shows an original location for an oil catch tank. As you can imagine these beasts had to have a lot of oil. 427 dry sump would require it. Incidentally, did you get to hear it run. He fired it for us and standing behind it would qualify as a religious experience. I have a HD video of it from about 4 feet directly behind the engine. Kind of like the start of the movie Grand Prix.

As far as I know he never sold one. As he explained it, for $750,000 the boys that can play in that neighborhood would rather drop a million plus and have an original car. Perhaps some day soon the originals will get to be worth enough that $750,000 for a continuation car will look like a bargain. Want to shoot yourself? He told a story that in the early 70's all the cars were back a HM in the back and someone came buy to try to buy one. He offered $5000 and John told him to go home and get his trailer. The guy came back with the cash and John loaded up two of the cars and the guy drove off. At the time they were nothing but useless old used race cars.

Edited July 12, 2010 by Pete J.

[Cato]

Pete,

Thanks for the great first-hand info. Yes, the noise is glorious through those headers. I get to enjoy exactly that noise with mine with the sidepipes removed. Even with them on it's virtually the same as the pipes contain no packing.

Since the cars were raced in '66 with the nose-mounted oil reservoir, I'm speculating that Lee built this car with the '67, MK IIB arrangement. That deleted the nose tank and put this reservoir here. It's opposite the driver position for balance and adds to the rearward weight bias.

If you've got any snaps of the car from that visit to H-M please post them or a link. Can't get enough reference.

Yes, in those days, there was nothing sadder than last years racecar.

[Pete J.]

Pete,

Thanks for the great first-hand info. Yes, the noise is glorious through those headers. I get to enjoy exactly that noise with mine with the sidepipes removed. Even with them on it's virtually the same as the pipes contain no packing.

Since the cars were raced in '66 with the nose-mounted oil reservoir, I'm speculating that Lee built this car with the '67, MK IIB arrangement. That deleted the nose tank and put this reservoir here. It's opposite the driver position for balance and adds to the rearward weight bias.

If you've got any snaps of the car from that visit to H-M please post them or a link. Can't get enough reference.

Yes, in those days, there was nothing sadder than last years racecar.

Yes, that is the IIb configuration, to some extent. It was a race to race configuration depending upon if the spare tire was required or not. Same thing with the suitcase carriers. His also has the roll cage with the rear hoop inside the firewall, though he doesn't have the passenger side door top cut off. Also the coolant hoses run around the passenger side ala 'b, not up the center tunnel. Yes, I can imagine the cobra would sound very much the same. Nothing quite like it

[Cato]

Again, thanks for the great info-I'm guessing right at least! Can you explain the passenger door cut-off? I can't picture what that means.

Actually, it sounds a little meaner as I have a lot more solid lifter cam in it than they raced with...

[Pete J.]

Again, thanks for the great info-I'm guessing right at least! Can you explain the passenger door cut-off? I can't picture what that means.

Actually, it sounds a little meaner as I have a lot more solid lifter cam in it than they raced with...

Actually, the Mark IIb was a result of a letter that Mark Donahue wrote to John Holman, outlining some modification he thought would be beneficial to the car.(Lee gave me a copy) One of the recommendations was to modify the car so a driver could escape if it was on it's top. The result was a modified passenger door. They cut the dog ear(top)of the door off parallel with the window and riveted that in place. That way at least the passenger side door could be opened if the car was upside down. I can not say if all the cars were modified that way, and I am sure the in restoration, a number of the cars were converted back. It is a subtle change.

[Cato]

That is fascinating and little-known history on the cars. You were very fortunate for a GT-lover to be on that trip and soak-up all the knowledge that the originators offered. Wish I was there...

[LR3]

I am going to miss the stories on this thread when I finish up. Trying blue racing stripes with thin plastic tape due to my lack of finish painting skills.

[Cato]

It looks good on the roof eyebrows and louvers Syd-can't tell about the nose. That part is a little blurry.

What's your plan to do the windshield black gasket-mask and spray? I see you have the glass in already. I found it easier to do the gasket without the glass.

[LR3]

It looks good on the roof eyebrows and louvers Syd-can't tell about the nose. That part is a little blurry.

What's your plan to do the windshield black gasket-mask and spray? I see you have the glass in already. I found it easier to do the gasket without the glass.

Gave a gasket some thought and decided my hand was not steady enough to paint it. Even though it is glued in the windshield will pop out I am sure (it already has more than once). I hadn't thought of using a sharpie to do the gasket until just now. I may give that a try tomorrow. I was hoping no one would comment on the lack thereof. Funny how you can pretend to ignore troublesome areas. When I am finished I will take a shot from farther back to give a better depth of field. I just wanted to see how the tape would react to the complexity of the roof.

[Pete J.]

Yes, that is the IIb configuration, to some extent. It was a race to race configuration depending upon if the spare tire was required or not. Same thing with the suitcase carriers. His also has the roll cage with the rear hoop inside the firewall, though he doesn't have the passenger side door top cut off. Also the coolant hoses run around the passenger side ala 'b, not up the center tunnel. Yes, I can imagine the cobra would sound very much the same. Nothing quite like it

Actually, I reviewed a bit of the video and I am wrong. The oil tank is an IIa configureation. Remember that at Le Mans they required a spare tire, thus the oil tank in the spare well came later.

[Pete J.]

I brought up this photo again to point out a couple of interesting bits that you can see from this side. Notice that the oil tank has a sight gage(the round thing on the side). It made it real easy to check minimum oil levels. You will also notice that there are a number of oil lines going to the the brace between the shock towers. That is because that is hollow and was used as a collection tank. Lee also does not run the clear velocity stack. He claims that the car runs slower with it.

I will also tell another story about this car. Lee was running it at Le Mans once(he didn't say why) and on the mulsanne straight at 170 mph the engine quite, but the car kept accelerating. He said it scared the begeebers out of him. He explained that at that speed the wind noise overcame the engine noise and you couldn't hear the engine any more. When he got back to the pit, he asked Dan Gurney if that ever happened to him. Dan said that it happened every time. During the real race he said it was a good thing. Endurance racing is really hours of boring and each time it happened it woke the drive up with a rush of Adrenalin.

[Cato]

Syd,

Found yet another fuel arrangement. This shot taken back in the day at possibly H-M or Shelby shows an engine going in.

Note that two pumps are vertical-can't see a third. You can see the filter routing. Only proves that probably, only a few cars were built alike even in the same year and Mark.

I don't know if Sharpie will be opaque enough on the smooth plastic surface. It will be shiny too-not like rubber. A little masking tape and a light mist of flat black will do it-c'mon Syd!

Actually, I reviewed a bit of the video and I am wrong. The oil tank is an IIa configureation. Remember that at Le Mans they required a spare tire, thus the oil tank in the spare well came later.

Pete,

I have to differ with you this time my friend, regarding the dry sump. Here's a shot during THE race with the front tank AND required spare in place.

Now this is 1047 which was driven by Gurney and Grant, DNF'd and was a Shelby car. (I think Carroll is third on the left in the foreground) Maybe we're both right-H-M did the rear tank (I have not seen any race evidence of that) and Shel did the front one.

It only points out how hard it is to find data as the cars were changed so much THEN (to race at Daytona, Sebring, Neurbergring etc) and changed years later in restorations.

[Pete J.]

Syd,

Found yet another fuel arrangement. This shot taken back in the day at possibly H-M or Shelby shows an engine going in.

Note that two pumps are vertical-can't see a third. You can see the filter routing. Only proves that probably, only a few cars were built alike even in the same year and Mark.

I don't know if Sharpie will be opaque enough on the smooth plastic surface. It will be shiny too-not like rubber. A little masking tape and a light mist of flat black will do it-c'mon Syd!

Pete,

I have to differ with you this time my friend, regarding the dry sump. Here's a shot during THE race with the front tank AND required spare in place.

Now this is 1047 which was driven by Gurney and Grant, DNF'd and was a Shelby car. (I think Carroll is third on the left in the foreground) Maybe we're both right-H-M did the rear tank (I have not seen any race evidence of that) and Shel did the front one.

It only points out how hard it is to find data as the cars were changed so much THEN (to race at Daytona, Sebring, Neurbergring etc) and changed years later in restorations.

Right you are! I've not seen that photo. I also noticed that in this photo it shows from deflectors on the lower air intakes to route the air to the oil coolers that I have not seen before. Most of the cars I've seen do not have those. These cars were run and modified on the fly so there is no "right" configuration for the season, only a "per race" configuration and sometimes that changed during a race. Makes it very difficult to do a "correct" model.