Macro Lense

[peekay]

I have just started photographing my models for the first time using a Canon EOS 400D camera.

I can't get sharp enough focus so I'm thinking of buying a Canon EF 100mm F.28 USM Macro lense for the camera. Would this be a wise choice?

If any of you photography freaks have any advice I'm all ears.

[MonoPed]

Does that camera have a macro function? I shot these pics with a friend's Sony A350 DSLR and the regular 18-55mm lens using the macro function in the camera. These pics have not been altered other than photobucket resizing them when uploaded. I used a pretty high F-stop setting to get depth of field, and let the camera auto-focus.

[Bastardo]

Don't even think about it...

Stick to whatever lens you have now. I'm using my Tokina 28-80/2.8 and my Nikkor 50/1.8, but prior to that my Nikkor 18-55/3.5-5.6 and my Nikkor 18-105/3.5-5.6 did the job just fine.

My tips would be:

- Put your model on a one-color background (a piece of paper or cardboard will do just fine)

- Get enough light on the model (you can also use flash, but try not to flash directly at a model - some kind of difusor would be great to use. If you don't have it, just tilt your flash into the cieling. If you can't tilt it, put one or two layers of paper tisue infront of your pop-up flash.)

- Set the white balance or choose the one (pre set WB settings on your camera) that is the closest to the temperature of your light source(s). Experiment, give it a try. This will make the colors look corect on the pics.

- Set the apperture to the one that assures the best sharpness for your lens and also enough DOF (depth of field). As an example: My Tokina is happy at 28/5.6, my Nikkor is happy at 50/8 or 50/11 and so on. Again: Experiment and see what your equipment will give you.

- If possible, use a tripod or any other non-moving surface you can lean your camera on. A bag of rice can be a great substitute. Also a stack of books. Heck, I've even used my Tokina's lens-hood a few times to stabilize my D90 while taking shots

- Set ISO to the lowest possible value - this will make the images look sharper. Yes, you will need stronger light and/or a longer exposure time - this is why I recomended a tripod.

- Don't get too close - we're not expecting photos of molecules of paint on the dash of your model Step away, capture the complete model or part in the frame and leave at least 15-20% "empty" space around it. This will give you enough manouver room for editing on the PC (straightening, cropping, resizing, ...).

- For the pics of the details, just shoot the piece you want and later on crop the image on your PC. Not sure about the sensor size in your camera (I'm a Nikon guy), but I'm sure 1:1 crop at a low ISO from your camera will provide great shots for the forums. Even my Olympus 550 UZ (not even DSLR) provided some pretty decent 1:1 crop shots of my models in the WIP moments.

You don't need fancy equipment worth hundreds or thousands of "moneys" to make decent shots of your models

Digital photography is great as it lets you experiment and make mistakes over and over again in the search for that perfect setting.

One more thing: Since I've gotten a phone with a better camera (Samsung Galaxy S2) I usually take WIP shots with it Flash on, WB = flourescent, EV compensation = +1. All I need

[Plastheniker]

Peter, what about using a set of simple, versatile and inexpensive "close-up lenses"? I use mine for about 30 years and they turned out to be an excellent investment.

Every camera lense has a thread at the front end where you screw on f. e. filters. Instead of filters you can screw on the mentioned close-up lenses. They look like filters but in fact are magnifying glasses and reduce the focusing distance. They come in a large variety of magnifications (diopters). I use +1, +2 and +4 diopters. Since you can combine them you can photograph the teeth of an ant - if you like. You can use them on any camera lense from wide-angle to tele, so the possible variations and effects are endless. They are available at any camera shop. There are complete sets (however of uncertain quality) from +1 to +10 Diopters starting from € 20,00 online. You only have to consider the thread diameter of your Canon lense ( probably 52 or 55mm).

[Foxer]

I have a Nikon DSLR and use it for taking photos of my models, as I've used 35mm SLR's for over 50 years. Closeups are one of my favorite subjects. I've used many devices for closeups over the years ... screw on closeup lenses, extension tubes, bellows and all serve their purpose. I currently use a 90mm macro lens like you're asking about. Most of these devices can be differentiated by cost ... all work but the best are definably at the higher end. I like the 90mm lens because it allows me to get back from the subject to frame it properly and not have the front of the lens almost touching the subject. Closeup lenses also allow you to set the f-stop to smaller openings than a normal lens for greater depth-of-field ... something you want for sure on a model. My lens goes to f32 and gets the whole 1/25 model in focus.

I understand what you're saying about your regular zoom lens ... most of those aren't meant to focus very close. I use an 18-200mm for most everything, but it sucks taking closeup model photos.

If it's in your budget, DO get this lens ... you will never be sorry!

[MonoPed]

You don't need fancy equipment worth hundreds or thousands of "moneys" to make decent shots of your models

This.

I never did get a DSLR, and still shoot with my cheap Kodak and a desktop tripod.

[Foxer]

Nice photos, Brian. It shows the quality of cameras today and money isn't important in this either ... just making sure it does what you need.

DSLR's are for hobbyists ... and pros ... for the most part, and when you have one there's no other option than the right lens for that camera.

[W-409]

What I do is that I tape a big white poster on a chair. Then I put that outside and take my Camera Stand with me and take the pics without Macro with pretty much zoom. I think that gives the best results, at least for me and it's very simple. My camera is this:

And this is how my pictures look like:

For closeups, like the engine or interior, I use the same camera without that camera stand with Macro setting on. I think it gives sharp enough pictures.

[ScaleDale]

That camera, the eos 400 is the XTi and is out of production. My first DSLR was the eos 450 (XSi) and it is out of production. My current camera is the Canon 7D and is not out of production. The 100mm 2.8 macro is one of my prize lenses and one of the worlds sharpest. It's also $800 and overkill for model photography.

That said, don't put that kind of lens on an outdated camera for model photography. What you do need is a tripod if you don't already have one. One of the reasons most photos aren't sharp is because the camera isn't steady and a tripod will fix that. It will also let you stop your lens down. The smaller the aperture you use the more of your subject is in focus. It's called depth of field. A tripod will let you shoot at f/16 or lower (higher numbers are lower...go figure) I use f/22 and a timer for my close up shots. My exposures are around 1/2 second long.

Lenses can be the death of DSLR owners, at least the death of their pocketbooks... I use my 100mm macro, but I also like my 50mm f/1.4 Canon. I have a 28-75mm f/2.8 Tamron zoom that will focus close and gets a lot of use. If you have a camera shop, take a look at it. If you want a macro that won't break the bank, look at the 90mm macro from Tamron. They have a 60mm macro, too.

Dale

[Len Woodruff]

Don't even think about it...

Stick to whatever lens you have now. I'm using my Tokina 28-80/2.8 and my Nikkor 50/1.8, but prior to that my Nikkor 18-55/3.5-5.6 and my Nikkor 18-105/3.5-5.6 did the job just fine.

My tips would be:

- Put your model on a one-color background (a piece of paper or cardboard will do just fine)

- Get enough light on the model (you can also use flash, but try not to flash directly at a model - some kind of difusor would be great to use. If you don't have it, just tilt your flash into the cieling. If you can't tilt it, put one or two layers of paper tisue infront of your pop-up flash.)

- Set the white balance or choose the one (pre set WB settings on your camera) that is the closest to the temperature of your light source(s). Experiment, give it a try. This will make the colors look corect on the pics.

- Set the apperture to the one that assures the best sharpness for your lens and also enough DOF (depth of field). As an example: My Tokina is happy at 28/5.6, my Nikkor is happy at 50/8 or 50/11 and so on. Again: Experiment and see what your equipment will give you.

- If possible, use a tripod or any other non-moving surface you can lean your camera on. A bag of rice can be a great substitute. Also a stack of books. Heck, I've even used my Tokina's lens-hood a few times to stabilize my D90 while taking shots

- Set ISO to the lowest possible value - this will make the images look sharper. Yes, you will need stronger light and/or a longer exposure time - this is why I recomended a tripod.

- Don't get too close - we're not expecting photos of molecules of paint on the dash of your model Step away, capture the complete model or part in the frame and leave at least 15-20% "empty" space around it. This will give you enough manouver room for editing on the PC (straightening, cropping, resizing, ...).

- For the pics of the details, just shoot the piece you want and later on crop the image on your PC. Not sure about the sensor size in your camera (I'm a Nikon guy), but I'm sure 1:1 crop at a low ISO from your camera will provide great shots for the forums. Even my Olympus 550 UZ (not even DSLR) provided some pretty decent 1:1 crop shots of my models in the WIP moments.

You don't need fancy equipment worth hundreds or thousands of "moneys" to make decent shots of your models

Digital photography is great as it lets you experiment and make mistakes over and over again in the search for that perfect setting.

One more thing: Since I've gotten a phone with a better camera (Samsung Galaxy S2) I usually take WIP shots with it Flash on, WB = flourescent, EV compensation = +1. All I need

Thanks that is good information Dale.

[peekay]

Thanks so much all of you for your time and input.

The divergance of opinion here is such that I'm left not really knowing what to do next. I've already experimented with most of the above suggestions about camera settings and I do use a tripod but even my best shots (see below) are not as fully in focus as all the shots you've posted above. I think the photos I've posted so far are OK for the forum but a magazine is thinking of featuring my models and needs high quality, in focus pics.

I'm prepared to invest some money and the camera I'm using belongs to my son so I was thinking of buying my own anyway. Right now I could get a Nikon D3200 18-55 VR new for $500 (that might sound expensive in the US but it's a good sale price here) - any opinions on that choice? This has more than twice the pixel count (24 million) as the Canon I'm using but a similar lens. Could I expect better results?

[Erik Smith]

More pixels won't help. The lens is the most important piece of the puzzle.

Depth of field is the most troubling part for me - stepping down far enough to get all the parts crisp but those small apertures aren't always the sharpest setting.

I would experiment with you lens - different focal lengths, distances to subject, apertures, etc - take notes, and find the "sweet" spot for your particular set up.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Erik Smith

[Foxer]

You're getting good advice here. The D3200 is a good body for what you want. I had a D5200 but I do a lot of other things with it besides models. I would tend to stay away from the kit lenses ... they are just to get buyers and not the best lenses. It all comes down to your needs, though. I have a Nikkor 18-200mm lens I got with my first DSLR and it is my normal lens ... everything but close ups.

I have the Tamron 90mm Macro for models. It's an excellent lens and seemed better for my needs than what Nikkor had. It stops down to f/32 with great depth of field.

Here's a couple shots with the Tamron lens.

Just remember ... all the photos shown here, including mine, have been reduced for the web ... not great for evaluating a lens.

[MonoPed]

My camera (Kodak Z712is) only goes down to f8.0, but it manages to get the whole model in focus. I always shoot on a tripod, and I use the camera's timer to avoid any camera shake.

[peekay]

More pixels won't help. The lens is the most important piece of the puzzle.

Thanks Erik, that's something I needed to know. I've already done all those experiments but will keep it mind. Thanks again.

[peekay]

Thanks Mike, very sharp photos. I will definitely give that Tamron lens a look.

And thanks Brian, I also used a tripod and timer.

This site is really worth it's weight in gold for such information. Again, many thanks!!!

[ScaleDale]

It's hard to say if more data from the sensor will help in this application or not. If I read right, your son's camera is 12mp and the Nikon you're looking at is 24mp. My canon is 18mp and I consider it super sharp. The issue here is that the image is being stripped of most of it 's detail when it's loaded up to a photo sharing service like Photobucket. The image you posted is compressed 85% down to around 1 megabyte and it's probably 10 or more on your computer.

When you get into DSLR cameras, it's more about the size of the sensor than the number of pixels crammed into it. Big buck pro cameras have sensors the size of a 35mm film negative (so called full frame) and most of the consumer ones have smaller ones (crop sensor). Big is only better if your printing posters.

In regards to depth of field, there is a smartphone app called Simple Depth of Field or Simple DOF for the iPhone and probably something like it for Android. It lets you dial in the lens and distance to subject and see the near and far focal points in terms of distance from the camera and the actual depth of field. I was surprised at how shallow it can be when you are shooting something small up close like a model car. That's how I wound up at f/22 trying to get 6 inches of model in focus. Look it or something like it up for your phone. Use Photography or Depth of Field as a search term.

Dale

[peekay]

Thanks Dale, more good info. Yes, the Canon is 12mp, the Nikon 24.

I didn't realize that about photobucket compression, I'm very much a beginner.

And I'm the only person in Switzerland with no iPhone!