Modeling Machines

[Harry P.]

Uo until now the only power tool I've ever used in modeling is a Dremel. But seeing some of the fantastic machined parts others are creating, I'm getting the urge to join the "power tool posse". I'd love to be able to turn and/or mill my own parts out of aluminum, brass, nylon, whatever. I know very little about modeling power tools (lathes, etc.) About all I DO know is the name "Sherline"...I've see the name mentioned many times.

So I'm asking any machining pros out there: Is Sherline the "Rolls Royce" of modeling power tools? Are there other brands? What sort of basic assortment of tools would be a logical start? I'm assuming a lathe and a milling machine. I've heard of some sort of "all in one" tool (Unimat???).

I don't have an unlimited budget, but I don't want to buy junk.

Any suggestions are welcome...

[CAL]

  harrypri said:

Uo until now the only power tool I've ever used in modeling is a Dremel. But seeing some of the fantastic machined parts others are creating, I'm getting the urge to join the "power tool posse". I'd love to be able to turn and/or mill my own parts out of aluminum, brass, nylon, whatever. I know very little about modeling power tools (lathes, etc.) About all I DO know is the name "Sherline"...I've see the name mentioned many times.

So I'm asking any machining pros out there: Is Sherline the "Rolls Royce" of modeling power tools? Are there other brands? What sort of basic assortment of tools would be a logical start? I'm assuming a lathe and a milling machine. I've heard of some sort of "all in one" tool (Unimat???).

I don't have an unlimited budget, but I don't want to buy junk.

Any suggestions are welcome...

Sherline is the the RR of modeling tools.

Unimat was good once upon a time. So if you can find an old used one it is probably okay I have used an old steel Unimat that worked very well.

The new Unimat is mostly plastic and not very true or ridged enough to be neither a good tool for fine work, accurate for precision work, or built sturdy enough to last a long time.

On top of that it has both motor problems and chuck problems.

Sherline is the way to go, unless you find an old Unimat, otherwise there isn't anything else to look at.

A mill and a lathe is pretty much all you need. And I think you can get into a Sherline milling machine and a Lathe for about $1000.00. Of course you could spend a lot more on a Sherline CNC.

From there everything else is pretty much an add-on, like a helix cutter, rotary table, motor control drives and other very specailized tools. But then you can pretty much build anything.

A machine shop is very handy to have around. I miss having access to one.

One of these days I will get my own Sherline.

I hear there is some cheap Chinese tools out there but I haven't seen a source for them or know if they are any good.

Edited July 19, 2008 by CAL

[old-hermit]

Harry, you're gonna spend more than $1000.00 on a Sherline lathe & mill.

Plus you will need a LOT of additional add on's to do what you want.

http://www.sherline.com/prices.htm .

If you can't swing a Sherline, Micro Mark, Harbor Freight, Smithy and several others sell a mini lathe and mill for around $600.00 each. But you will still have to buy the attachments seperately.

Shop around and talk to people who own different brands to figure out what will do for your needs.

[RyanSilva]

Go with the top brand..if your gonna shell out the money. Il only buy a sherline..thats my mentality right now though..it could change if i find a reall cheap deal locally though. Yes you can buy cheaper..like chinese ..but why? some..have lousy tolerences and wiggle. automotive forums has a machining section on the model car part of the forum..lots of info there. One thing to remember..is buying a lathe from overseas..usually comes packed with grease o stop rust..so you need to tear it apart and clean it with kerosene

[cruzn]

Harry..

I am a CnC Operator of Lathes and Mills. Haas, Mori seki etc. Milltronics are some of the ones I run.

I don't have One at Home, yet, but when I do I will Buy One of these.

From a Company called grizzly.

http://grizzly.com/products/Combo-Lathe-Mill/G4015Z

That should Last You til you tire of it.. But You won't.

It is all Metal No Plastic Parts except for the Knobs and such.

Of course there are More Manufacturers around You Just have to Look for them..

There are some Monthly Magazines that deal with the Home Machinist. I saw two at the Local bookstore Last night. check them Out for ideas and different companies.

[Guest Davkin]

If you are a newbie to machining or you are more interested in using machines to support your hobby rather than BE your hobby DO NOT buy the chinese machines! Experienced machining hobbiests call these machines "Assembled kits" for a reason. They have all kinds of little issues to deal with to get them precise and productive in general. Grizzly, Micromark, Cummins, Harbor Frieght, they are all essentially the same machines manufactured in the same factory in China. Also, even the smallest of the Chinese machines are kinda big and clumsy for model car work. I bought the Harbor Freight Micro Mill and Mini Lathe years ago and regret it. They've been somewhat useful for my R/C hobby but have been too imprecise and big and clumsy for small scale modeling. I'm sure an experienced machinist could get these things humming a long nicely, but I'd rather spend my time modeling than tinkering with my lathe. Get a Sherline setup if you get anything at all. Out of the box they work great according to all accounts I've heard and they are smaller and easier to use for machining the small stuff we do, heck, look what Augie did with a Sherline!

David

[CAL]

  Davkin said:

If you are a newbie to machining or you are more interested in using machines to support your hobby rather than BE your hobby DO NOT buy the chinese machines! Experienced machining hobbiests call these machines "Assembled kits" for a reason. They have all kinds of little issues to deal with to get them precise and productive in general. Grizzly, Micromark, Cummins, Harbor Frieght, they are all essentially the same machines manufactured in the same factory in China. Also, even the smallest of the Chinese machines are kinda big and clumsy for model car work. I bought the Harbor Freight Micro Mill and Mini Lathe years ago and regret it. They've been somewhat useful for my R/C hobby but have been too imprecise and big and clumsy for small scale modeling. I'm sure an experienced machinist could get these things humming a long nicely, but I'd rather spend my time modeling than tinkering with my lathe. Get a Sherline setup if you get anything at all. Out of the box they work great according to all accounts I've heard and they are smaller and easier to use for machining the small stuff we do, heck, look what Augie did with a Sherline!

David

I agree, I know a guy that did amazing stuff with a Sherline. He was making 1/24-1/25 Hemis right down to the valves on a Sherline.

Plus those others are almost as expensive as a Sherline, and they do not have all the attachments the Sherline does. Eventaully, you hit a limit with what you can do with a MICROLUX. Smithy doesn't have anything small enough, and Grizzly is the same money as Sherline.

[Guest Davkin]

Well, the Proxxon stuff is probably pretty good, but it better darned well be for the money they want for it! I tried the newer Unimat stuff, (ie, the "Cool Tool") and that was a mistake as well, could only do very, very light machining and imprecise at that. I'm trying to sell my HF stuff, hopefully some day I'll be able to save up for Sherline equipment. Keep an eye on ebay, every now and then someone is selling a package deal for a good price.

Also, keep in mind, with machines, the basic mill or lathe is actually the cheap part, you'll spend two to three times what you spend on the lathe and mill for accessories over time.

David

[Harry P.]

Thanks to all for your input.

It looks like most of you think that Sherline might offer the best "bang for the buck". I'm going to check it out. Like I said, my budget isn't unlimited, but I'd rather spend a bit more up front to get a good machine that'll last. It's cheaper in the long run to do that, rather than buy a bargain-priced machine that'll break down soon. The Chinese-made machines don't seem to impress you guys, so I think I'll check into Sherline.

[Harry P.]

I've been checking out prices on the Sherline website.

Ouch!!! Those babies are NOT cheap!!!

[mikemodeler]

Harry,

If you are not in a big hurry, you can surf craigslist and maybe find what you are looking for. The nice thing about craigslist is that you can post a "Want to Buy" ad and maybe someone has one they want to get rid of.

I do not know much about mills and lathes but would have to think the old adage of "you get what you pay for" rings true with this.

Best of luck in your search.

Mike

[MikeMc]

Harry between chicaga and Milwaukee you should be able to find some good clean used tools....Atlas, Bridgeport..et al....I bought an atlas 8" lathe with tools for under $500. in Milwaukee.....

[Harry P.]

I'll be keeping an eye out for used ones.

[Len Woodruff]

Can someone post a link to the Forums that talk about Sherline. I am planning on getting one later this year and would like to get help using it.

[Harry P.]

There are a lot of them.

Here's one:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/archive/index.php/f-165.html

[CAL]

  harrypri said:

I've been checking out prices on the Sherline website.

Ouch!!! Those babies are NOT cheap!!!

They have gone up a lot since the last time I looked at the.

They used to have a real basic lathe from about $375 and a mill around $600.

[Harry P.]

  CAL said:

They have gone up a lot since the last time I looked at the.

They used to have a real basic lathe from about $375 and a mill around $600.

I was looking at the "combo" mill/lathe unit. Couple of thou$and. Geez!

Edited July 21, 2008 by harrypri

[Guest Davkin]

Ya, but if you bought a chinese lathe and mill and all the equivalent accessories it wouldn't cost much less and would require some tinkering to make them work at all and they'd never work as well for scale modeling, they are just too big.

If even a used Sherline setup is more than you're willing to spend I wouldn't bother at all. Machining is not a cheap hobby that's for sure, but you're much better off spending the money up front for machines that are high quality and appropriate for the kind of machining you plan to do.

David

[Harry P.]

I'll have to think about it. These things cost WAY more than I had figured.

[Guest Davkin]

There is one cheaper alternative for a lathe Harry...Taig. I don't beleive they make a mill though, and they are rather simplistic and don't have nearly as many accessories available but they are quite a bit cheaper and will do fine for basic lathing operations but if you ever decide to upgrade to Sherline a Taig would basically become dead weight unless you find a buyer to unload it on.

David

[Harry P.]

I'm thinking that it's best in the long run to bite the bullet and get the good stuff.

I'll have to wait until I get a little more cash flow going, though...

[Ron L]

I like my Chinese lathe. $500 got me the lathe plus a set of mini tools (regular 1/4" tools are too big for modeling), a live center, and other various tools. It also includes gears if I ever want to cut threads. I'm sure the Sherline is great, but bang-for-the-buck it is not. The base model doesn't have a power fed carriage, which won't give you smooth results unless you're really patient, and you can not cut threads with it.

Check out http://www.mini-lathe.com/ and decide for yourself if the "shortcomings" are worth the saved bucks. For me it was, and I've been happy with it for over 3 years now. The only problem I've had is the power switch went dead, and I replaced it with a higher quality one that cost a whopping $1.50. I cut mostly plastic and resin on it, with the occasional aluminum parts. I wouldn't cut drill rod or stainless with it (T6061 is already taxing it at times), but what do I need that for in non-operational scale models?

I also got a mini-mill from work last year but I haven't used it. Again, for most materials used in scale modeling, most of the milling required can be done with a file and/or rotary tool.

[Brian Fishburn]

  cruzn said:

Harry..

I am a CnC Operator of Lathes and Mills. Haas, Mori seki etc. Milltronics are some of the ones I run.

I don't have One at Home, yet, but when I do I will Buy One of these.

From a Company called grizzly.

http://grizzly.com/products/Combo-Lathe-Mill/G4015Z

That should Last You til you tire of it.. But You won't.

It is all Metal No Plastic Parts except for the Knobs and such.

Of course there are More Manufacturers around You Just have to Look for them..

There are some Monthly Magazines that deal with the Home Machinist. I saw two at the Local bookstore Last night. check them Out for ideas and different companies.

Note that this quote is from a machinist, and of the brands he named, Sherline isn't one of them.

I'm going to be branded a heretic for this, but I wouldn't have a Sherline unless it was REALLY cheap.

You can spend less, and get a lathe that can do so much more. I have a 6" Craftsman (Which is a different nameplate on an Atlas) and it can do tiny stuff just fine, and isn't limited to modeling applications.

But, there ARE guys doing nice things with Sherlines. I won't deny that.

[cruzn]

  Brian Fishburn said:

Note that this quote is from a machinist, and of the brands he named, Sherline isn't one of them.

I'm going to be branded a heretic for this, but I wouldn't have a Sherline unless it was REALLY cheap.

You can spend less, and get a lathe that can do so much more. I have a 6" Craftsman (Which is a different nameplate on an Atlas) and it can do tiny stuff just fine, and isn't limited to modeling applications.

But, there ARE guys doing nice things with Sherlines. I won't deny that.

Brian...

Thanks for Your Note.. although I am a CNC Machinist I am not an authority On Grizzly Machines . I have been to their showroom In Springfiled Mo. and Have tested Out the Machine in question that they have there, and was Impressed with what It could do.

another One that I have good things about is SmittyBilt..

Duane drew of Arrowhead and Mark Smackle (sp) of MAS use these Machines and look what products they can Put out..

they Have Nothing But Prise for those Machines.

Dwayne

[Gregg]

I have stood over the shoulder of Mark Smackal and Dave McGowan, who use huge machines.

I am amazed at what you can do with a lathe.

It's not so much the size, but the tools that you make yourself to create some incredible parts.

Just watching these masters in action was an honor.

I have seen some of Augie's demo's over the years before he left us, and he had that Sherline done to a science.

I guess it depends on a few things:

What you can afford

Can you afford the space

What do you want to to do with it, ie: be limited to manini things (sorry, small things)

Upgradeable?

CNC-adaptable?

It's a lot of research, searching, and asking questions

It's one of those things where I wish someone would just have an easy answer for me/us/you/them/er/uh/duh

Trying out different ones may help you decide

I look at the parts and accessories for the units to see what I am getting in to

This is a long standing series I have had in the works for years.

Hope to get working on it soon.

my one cent (recession, sorry)