Borg-Warner T5 in Resin?

[kalbert]

Feel like I'm asking a lot of obscure questions here, hope no one minds too much!

Working on a project that needs a BW T5 transmission, and I'd rather not buy a whole Turbo Coupe kit to get one. Anyone aware of a resin T5 or something looks like a reasonable stand in? The lump of plastic with what I guess is supposed to be linkage rods that came in the MPC IROC-Z just won't do!

[Casey]

I have a master T-5 ready to go, but haven't made the mold yet. I suppose you want one yesterday?

[kalbert]

Nope, no particular hurry at all. Theres a few projects in line before this one. Keep me in mind when you do it, id be in for a few!

[Jim Whalen]

Hi,

I've got a T-5 in my 1:1 street rod that I'll be doing a replica of some day so I'd be interested in one of these.

Cheers,

JIm

[MsDano85gt]

I want to put t-5's in all my fox mustangs even tho some froM 79-82 had 4.2 v8's and autos only and the srod 4 speed manual but t-d's are direct bolt in on 1:1's so they can nbe glue in too eh?

[Casey]

Can anyone confirm which other kits contain a T5? I think someone mentioned one of the MPC or Monogram Fox Mustang kits, which probably has a V8 bellhousing, too, but a GM bellhousing from a Camaro/Firebird kit would be good to pair with the trans itself. I think the Camaro would need to be '84+, though.

[kalbert]

I built the MPC 5.0 Mustang a long long time ago but I'm pretty certain it was an AOD, or maybe a generic lump of a manual. The MPC Iroc-Z I've got has a really crappy lump of plastic for a transmission with what appears to be an automatic looking bellhousing but it does have a sort of slave cylinder looking spot on it. The one that looks the most like the one on the real Iroc-Z I had is the one in the old Monogram 1/24 92 Firebird but it has no slave cylinder details. The transmission in the Firebird has sort of the right overall shape but has cruddy molded on shift rods! I don't have a Thunderbird Turbo Coupe to compare. The Revell S10 looks like it has a 700R4 and a pretty decent example of it. The Big 1/20 Lindberg 1st gen S10 has what looks like an NV3500 and it has a real nice bell housing, albeit 1/20 and useless!

Edited March 17, 2013 by kalbert

[kalbert]

One more to add... The Monogram 5.0 Mustang appears to have a T5 on it, kind of a crude one but by far the most T5 looking thing I've been able to find. It also has a decent Ford bellhousing. I can gather up everything I have and take some pictures tomorrow.

[Toner283]

The transmission in the Firebird has sort of the right overall shape but has cruddy molded on shift rods!

If it has shift rods it cannot be a T5 unless it is an incredibly poor rendition of one. The T5 is an internal rail transmission and has no external shift linkage at all.

[Casey]

If it has shift rods it cannot be a T5 unless it is an incredibly poor rendition of one. The T5 is an internal rail transmission and has no external shift linkage at all.

I suspect the Monogram 1/24 GM F-body kits had the Saginaw or BW Super T-10 trans, so it may have been carried over untouched until Monogram refreshed the Firebird kit in '91.

The Turbo T-bird's T5 is nice, so no worries there, but the Camaro/Firebird used a bellhousing which rotated the trans 15* counterclockwise, so that's no good for other non-GM F-body applications, and the Ford V8 bellhousing is very different, too. I'll do some looking on the web.

[dimaxion]

T-5's having the internal shift rails and the shifter located at the top directly into the box are Top Loaders . Made to eliminate missed gears while maximizing power ans acceleration such as "Power" or "Speed Shifting" . The T-10 had external linkage . The Factory shifters bound and gears were missed . Then came along George Hurst . To avoid paying his Company for shifters , the Manufactures redesigned to use the obsolete Top Loaders from way back . Just thought you would like to know that . Thanx ..

[Blown03SVT]

I imagine the new SSP Fox body Mustang coming from RM will have a NICE T-5 in it. If there is a C4 Corvette 1990 or earlier it would also have a WC T-5 in it if I recall correctly

[Toner283]

I suspect the Monogram 1/24 GM F-body kits had the Saginaw or BW Super T-10 trans, so it may have been carried over untouched until Monogram refreshed the Firebird kit in '91.

The Turbo T-bird's T5 is nice, so no worries there, but the Camaro/Firebird used a bellhousing which rotated the trans 15* counterclockwise, so that's no good for other non-GM F-body applications, and the Ford V8 bellhousing is very different, too. I'll do some looking on the web

The tailstock is unique for each of the S10/S15 trucks, the Camaro/Firebird, and the Mustangs. The shifter for the S trucks comes out of the tailstock at the very front, just behind the main gear case. The F body shifter comes out of the tailstock at the very rear just above where the driveshaft yoke slips in. The Fox body cars have the shifter come out several inches forward of the Camaro location. I have rebuilt several of each and while similar, they are each unique to the application. I have not had the opportunity to play with a T5 from a T bird so I have no first hand knowledge of the shifter location. Also, the shifter location is different again for each of the Safari/Astro vans and the Isuzu Rodeo T5's. Internally the transmissions are very different depending on application and the engine in front of them. A T5 from an S truck is only good for about 200 ft/lbs of torque and the best of the world class T5's from the Camaros and mustangs (right before GM switched to the T56) was only good for 330 ft/lbs. Even then guys kept breaking them.

T-5's having the internal shift rails and the shifter located at the top directly into the box are Top Loaders . Made to eliminate missed gears while maximizing power ans acceleration such as "Power" or "Speed Shifting" . The T-10 had external linkage . The Factory shifters bound and gears were missed . Then came along George Hurst . To avoid paying his Company for shifters , the Manufactures redesigned to use the obsolete Top Loaders from way back . Just thought you would like to know that . Thanx ..

The T5's were also prone to missed shifts. The factory shifters were about as accurate as stirring a bowl of soup. T5's are notorious for breaking second and third gears when guys beat on them. As I stated above the best of the factory T5's was only good for 330 ft/lbs of torque and a halfway healthy SBC or SBF will easily top that. Even a beefed up T5 with aftermarket internals will get dicey when you get at or above 600 ft/lbs. I have broken the T5 in my Malibu several times through "spirited" driving. That is a big part of the reason that guys started bringing me their broken ones to rebuild - I had gotten good at fixing my own. For a performance T5 the first upgrades should be a good aftermarket shifter, a set of straight cut gears for second and third and a set of billet shift forks. The straight cut gears will howl a bit but are a heck of a lot stronger than the factory gears. The straight cut gears are a big part of the strength and appeal of the legendary M22 "rockcrusher" muncie. When you start pushing the performance levels of a street car it is easier (and cheaper in the long run) to step up to a Tremec or similar if you want a five speed. Or jump to a T56 and get a 6 speed with the double overdrive.

[kalbert]

Here's all I could find today, dug to the bottom of the parts box and my MPC 5.0 Mustang GT motor was MIA, as was some other stuff. Here's what I did find in the Glue Bomb box. At left is the Revellogram '92 FIrebird, not a T5 but at least has a modern semi-real shape to it. I think you are right, it is/was supposed to be a T10 with a long tailshaft. Next is the MPC Iroc-Z, I don't know what that is supposed to be but I did notice lots of other MPC transmissions in the parts box look just like it. At right is the Revellogram '93 SVT Mustang, closer to a T5 than anything else in the parts box, but the case seems a little short and the tailshaft seems a little long. I think the bellhousing from the Firebird looks like it would clean up pretty good, and would be accurate for just about any application other than the Firebird/Camaro. It would probably be a good starting point for the tilted F-body one though, a flat piece of styrene glued on crooked and a little filler is about all it would take.

C4 Corvettes had the wonky 4+3 thing from '84-'88 and then had a ZF 6spd until '96 (or a 700R4 auto). The Revell '90 5.0 Mustang appears to come with a great looking T5!

http://www.modelcarsmag.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=65168&p=789579