ford flathead 4 banger question

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hey guys,

I'm looking for reference photos for a hopped up version of the 4 banger flathead in the 31 woody Revell kit. The kit comes with an ohv conversion and a few other speed goodies. I'm looking to plumb and wire it for a dragster so the water inlets will be capped off. 

[1930fordpickup]

google riley overhead valve head photos. Not positive but I think this is the correct heads. 

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=riley+overhead+valve+heads&qpvt=riley+overhead+valve+heads&qpvt=riley+overhead+valve+heads&qpvt=riley+overhead+valve+heads&FORM=IGRE

[Ace-Garageguy]

That engine represents a Riley 2-port overhead valve conversion head on the Ford Model-A and B bottom end.

The TWO individual cast-alloy valve rocker covers are the immediate identifier.

It can be set up several different ways, using an essentially stock ignition system, to a front-driven magneto. There's also a more radical 4-port with the intakes on the other side.

Here's a couple of pix. Google image-search "Riley OHV head" for more.

            

 

Edited June 2, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

[plastic-mechanic]

http://www.secretsofspeed.com/

[Ace-Garageguy]

http://www.secretsofspeed.com/

Entirely different head from the one kitted.

BUT... that engine DOES show one of the front-driven ignition setups possible. You could put a mag up front on that housing too.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

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the kit has the 2 port set up for sure. would old an school dragster (hamb ha/gr style) have the stock or front driven mag ignition? it looks like there's an oil line from the pan to the crank case as well. 

[Ace-Garageguy]

the kit has the 2 port set up for sure. would old an school dragster (hamb ha/gr style) have the stock or front driven mag ignition? it looks like there's an oil line from the pan to the crank case as well. 

Either. Just depends on the depth of the pockets of the builder, or how good a machinist / fabricator he was.

The tall Vertex magneto came out in the late 1930s and could be adapted to just about anything. There was also a Harman Collins mag, and some others.

This Riley-headed engine runs a later-model 4-cylinder distributor in the stock location (while the top-right picture in the thread runs a Vertex mag in the stock location).

Edited June 2, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

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thanks for the feedback Bill. The vibe I'm going for is a homemade jalopy style, very early front engine dragster. The builder would have little budget which leads me in the direction of a stock 4 banger, but those speed parts are so cool in the 31 woody kit. 

[modelfink]

I like this set up. wish i could find a pic of the other side

[Ace-Garageguy]

That's the Riley 4-port I mentioned above. It's not the same as the one kitted, the Riley 2-port, and has the 4 intake ports on the opposite side from the 2-port.

You can't make them out in the photo above, but there are 4 intake ports there.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

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Ahhhh… I see. 

[plastic-mechanic]

http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/1930rileyvalveinhead.htm

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/banger-basics.251717/

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/motor-banger-thread-links.161498/

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/more-free-banger-literature.84385/

http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25673

http://www.nwvs.org/Technical/Engines/EngineRileyGrpThumbs.shtml

 

[modelfink]

Great info! Thanks!!

[modelfink]

I'm thinking about converting the 2 port in the AMT kit to a 4 port with some scratch building. I'm also wondering if there were manual fuel pump conversions. my current build will not allow for a gravity fed fuel delivery. The fuel would be pumped from the front mounted tank.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Lotsa old race cars had hand-operated fuel pumps, easy enough to do on a drag car. A pump in the cockpit pressurizes the tank, and the fuel is delivered to the engine. Tanks were even mounted in the cockpit. Surplus aircraft air tanks could be used, and then the advent of the Moon tank came along. It's easy enough to drive a pump from the fan belt too. What's historically accurate depends on the exact time period you want your model to represent.

Electric fuel pumps are also an option, originated in England around the late 1920s, plenty of 24V aircraft surplus just after the war, 6V and 12V pumps made specifically for vehicle use available widely in the US by the '50s (SU Petrolift pump available as early as 1933)  etc.

EDIT: This old midget has a hand air pump just to the right of the steering wheel used to pressurize the fuel system.

 

Edited June 15, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

[modelfink]

Thanks for the info. I will probably convert the model A engine to a model B and use a parts box mechanical fuel pump on the lower portion of the block on the exhaust side. It's really about aesthetics. does a front mounted gas tank make it look to heavy in the front? Does it make it look cooler? A gas tank could feasibly be mounted above the carbs in the cowl. 

I also have to mount the battery up front since the driver is on top of the rear end.

[plastic-mechanic]

http://s18.photobucket.com/user/TopEndSpeedShop/library/Model A Heads?sort=3&page=1

[Art Anderson]

Also, bear in mind the firing order of a Model A or Model B:  1-3-4-2

 

Art