What To Use For Primer Under Testors Enamels??

[Ddms]

I just had an odd thing happen with Testors black spray-can enamel.

I was prepping some Tamiya suspension parts for Alclad II. Using an alcohol/purple cleaner mix, I had removed both the chrome and the lacquer undercoat, so I was spraying the Testors on bare plastic. It went on nice and smooth, with no sign of a problem. A couple hours later, I looked at the parts, and they were lumpy as hell, like the paint had reacted to the plastic and bubbled up. It was a real mess.

I immediately dropped the parts in a purple bath. It's now about three hours later, and the paint is loose, and it feels like there isn't any damage to the parts.

I had washed the pieces and let them dry for a couple of hours. I have to wonder whether there was some PP residue on the plastic. Or whether the plastic had absorbed some moisture that hadn't evaporated even after more than two hours.

Or was it the Testors?

At this point I don't know whether to a) prime the parts using Tamiya Surface Primer and then to use the Testors again, or to get some other kind of spray-can enamel, or c) to brush on Model Master glossy black from a bottle , or d) to brush on Floquil black enamel?

Alternatively, I could airbrush on one of the enamels, but I'm a little uneasy about airbrushing enamel - how much to thin it, and with what. I do have some Testors thinner, but I'm much more familiar with airbrushing lacquers and urethane.

These parts are pretty delicate, and I want to handle them as little as possible. So I definitely want to take a "hands off" approach.

Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions?

Ddms

Edited July 9, 2009 by Ddms

[LoneWolf15]

When in doubt... Start with a 2:1 Paint to cheap laquer thinner ratio. It works every single time. One ounce of Testors enamel to a half ounce of hardware store laquer thinner will give you plenty of coverage. As for taking " Forever " to dry , Nope ! The laquer thinner helps the enamel flow smooth , dry quickly , and pull tight to the model's surface with no loss of detail. Shoot your clear using the same ratio .

I wish I had a dollar for every post that comes up about laquers , what primer to use , this works , that does'nt , etc. With all the various opinions on laquers and their diffrent products out there , the newbies end up feeling like they've chased parked cars all day ! I never use primer under Testors solid colors and I use their Aluminum Metallizer under my pearls and metallics as a base coat for reflective purposes. The key is all in the prep work , the smoother the body , the smoother the finish.

The bad rap on enamels , in my opinion , is a bunch of the stuff that follows horses. They are simple to use , and are made for plastic. People just never seem to learn how to use them , even when you tell them how to do it . Bob is correct about Testors spray nozzles , they do suck ! You stand a 50/50 chance of getting a good one. That's why I went to an airbrush long ago. As always ...... Just my opinion !

Donn Yost

Lone Wolf Custom Painting

[MikeMc]

  kurth said:

I found this at Michael's

Is this the same as the automotive product but with a different label?

Thanks

I wish I knew! I've used both this and T135( twice the $$) and really do not see much difference...Bob any input??

[Zoom Zoom]

  MikeMc said:

I wish I knew! I've used both this and T135( twice the $) and really do not see much difference...Bob any input??

I don't really know, I assume they'd be similar if they're both sandable.

That said, Michael's seems to have stopped selling Plastikote primer. It's long gone in stores here. The only place it seems to be available anymore near me is Main Auto Parts.

[Zoom Zoom]

  Ddms said:

I just had an odd thing happen with Testors black spray-can enamel.

I was prepping some Tamiya suspension parts for Alclad II. Using an alcohol/purple cleaner mix, I had removed both the chrome and the lacquer undercoat, so I was spraying the Testors on bare plastic. It went on nice and smooth, with no sign of a problem. A couple hours later, I looked at the parts, and they were lumpy as hell, like the paint had reacted to the plastic and bubbled up. It was a real mess.

Thoughts? Ideas? Suggestions?

Ddms

Everyone seems hell-bent on removing the lacquer undercoat. Here's a novel idea...don't remove it. Unless it's from the era of Mexican-produced chrome on AMT models, it's usually perfectly good and unnecessary to strip to absolute bare plastic. My issue w/chrome parts isn't w/the undercoat, it's with parting lines or inconsistent plating.

I have had zero problems stripping chrome in seconds w/Easy Off, rinsing with water, and shooting the parts with hobby paints afterwards. Anytime you soak parts in chemical concoctions, you run the risk of paint contamination. Chemicals can leach into the plastic, under any leftover clear residue. I used to slave over trying to get that clear off. Not anymore!

[BigGary]

I use two different primers with good results- cheap Wal-Mart Color Place primer, and Krylon H2O acrylic primer. Either works well for me. Recently I painted a body with Krylon enamel straight from the can. Crappy paint job, the nozzle is just not made for that. I stripped it in the purple pool. The Krylon came off, but the Color Place primer did not. It's now baby butt smooth. I'll decant the Krylon and use an airbrush, once the temp drops below 100, like its been for the last 3 weeks. 109 yesterday in North Texas.

Gary

[cosmiccadillac]

  Olle F said:

I know from previous discussions that some of you find this a bit controversial, but here goes:

IMO, primer should only be used when necessary, and in the case of enamel on styrene, it's usually not. A primer is supposed to give you a uniform color, fill scratches, protect the underlaying surface and promote adhesion, so if you don't need all that you don't need a primer either. Hobby enamels are made to be used directly on styrene, so they won't harm the plastic or cause ghosting or crazing like lacquers do. I usually thin it with lacquer thinner, which makes it dry quickly and also seems to help the adhesion. I only use primer after extensive bodywork, or when the difference in color between the plastic and the paint makes it necessary. In the few cases I use primer, I usually go for a flat enamel of the same color as the top coat.

So in short: If your prep work is good and the color allows it, you can skip the primer. The advantages are that (of course) it's easier and quicker to do so, and that you won't clog up emblems and other details with an excessively heavy coat of primer and paint. My bottom line is that the thinner the paint coats are, the better the model will look.

+1 primer is not necessary with enamel. I have since started using it just to straighten the body a bit better to get a nicer reflection, but it is NOT necessary for a nice paint job. I painted this Caddy with NO primer, I used Testors Green Metalflake enamel right over the white styrene. I didn't even clear it

[Ddms]

  Zoom Zoom said:

My favorite combo these days is Tamiya compound on Tamiya lacquer, it's amazing how it often negates the use of Micromesh cloths.

I agree 100%. I just finished a Lotus 25 painted with Tamiya British Green. (It's posted elsewhere.) The paint went on so well that it didn't even need Tamiya Coarse. Just a bit of Fine here and there and a final polish with Finish. Amazing.

My question is this: I've been using Tamiya primer for a long time. It covers so well, and gives such a smooth result, that I'm hesitant to change. I build some 1/43 models, and the Tamiya is thin enough not to cover the details. But it's expensive. So how do you think Plastikote primer compares with Tamiya? Is it available in both grey and white?

I tried automotive primer a long time ago, and it was a disaster - thick and dusty, and it totally etched a Gunze Sangyo Fiat before I even started building it That's something I never want to repeat.

Ddms

[Zoom Zoom]

  Ddms said:

So how do you think Plastikote primer compares with Tamiya? Is it available in both grey and white?

Ddms

Plastikote is nice for auto primer, but it's not going to give you Tamiya primer smoothness. AFAIK, there is no automotive/mass-market primer that's a true substitute for Tamiya's primer.

[59 Impala]

I mostly use Testors little bottle paints sprayed from an airbrush. I used to use Testors thinner until I ran out and used regular Enamel reducer for big cars. I found out that the paint dries faster and goes on smoother. I use it for the flat paints, which are my only primer, and for the gloss paints. I have never had any problems using this method. I spray at between 15 and 20 pounds of air pressure with the paint thinned about 50-50 or just a little more thinner. Dan

[Cornpatch]

I dont use either Testors or Tamiya enamels and or lacquers, so that must make me different than the rest of you.

When I bought my airbrushes, they came with a set of 6 bottles of paint. The paint was in 2 ounze bottles and was made by a company called Createx Airbrush Paints. Throught I would try them and after using them, I got rid of all my enamels and lacquers.

I like the Createx paints as they are kind of a lazy mans paints. They need no thinning, you can buy caps that fit there bottles and fit right into the airbrush and you can paint. There is no paint smell to them, so you can use them right in the house or basement. They can also be brushed on for small parts and detail work. There water based so a little soap and water is all that is needed for clean up.

They come in a mulitude of colors and 4 different types, opaque----pearlescent----transparent----and---flourescent. There also compatable with almost any clear coat and almost any type primer.

My primer of choice, and some of you will laugh and others will debate it, but I like the Rust-Oleum Clean Metal Primer #51502----its always done a good job for me and can be bought almost anywhere paint is sold. If I do a lot of body work, than I prefer the Dupli-Color Gray Sandable Primer, Both get decanted and sprayed thru an airbrush. As with some here, I first coat all my builds with future before doing any type of painting.

Jeff