SamBred Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 What makes a car show quality? Finishing a car is a great feeling no matter what others think about it. Knowing you built and assembled the whole car. Putting a car on your shelf at home may be what you like and good enough but what are some of the things that make a car great and will be able to hold up at a model show?
bobthehobbyguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 Basics are the most important things to consider. No ejection pin marks , mold lines and seams. Second is paint. No runs, dust, and no orange peel. Once you get those two down pat. You can consider adding details. Any details added need to be down flawlessly and in scale. Otherwise don't bother to add it as it will detract from the model.Look at the rules for box stock for any contest you may want to enter. Great way to get the basics down pat.
Ace-Garageguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) Bob's pretty much spot-on...get the basics done as close to perfect as possible. Make everything fit. Get the paint even, glossy and slick. Remove all mold parting-lines, flash, and get any bodywork you do absolutely right. No excess glue. Bumpers level and symmetrical. Foil work crisp with no jagged edges, waviness or wrinkles. Panel lines addressed. Any added detail MUST be done clean. This quality is what you're shooting for (Lindberg '53 Ford 1/25 scale model by Marcos Cruz) Edited August 23, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy
Russell C Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) Achieving the allusive 'show quality model' level is basically building something that - if magically expanded to 1:1 size - could be mistaken for being a fully functional vehicle. So, imagine using so-so quality black thread for plug wires, and blowing those up to 1:1 size. An ordinary person might then say, "Man, the insulation on those wires sure is hairy." Or for an outside door lock, "Wow, this thing isn't even round, it doesn't look shiny like stainless steel, and there is no slot to put a key in." That's the level of detail a person can get carried away with.Btw, the door locks on my avatar's 911 woody wagon are bits of aluminum paper clip wire, chucked into my motor tool and polished flat and into perfect circles, with a vertical slot scribed into them with an xacto blade. Beats a dot of silver paint, and it wasn't especially hard to do. Plus, as a wire where you just see the ends, they also serve as pegs to hold the handles much better to the sides of the car. Edited August 23, 2016 by Russell C
Pete J. Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 This subject brings to mind and old joke. When asked for directions, "How do you get to Carnegie Hall?" an old musician replied, "practice!" Well this is true, but only to an extent. You don't have to have a perfect model, only one that is better than anything else on the table. Bob is quite right. You start with the basics. You get rid of everything that doesn't belong on the real deal. Mold lines, ejector pin marks, miss sharpened pieces, flash and anything else that doesn't belong. You take care of all the gaps, creases and panel lines. Then you get to the paint. No boogers, hairs or dust in the finish. No fish eyes or orange peel. An even color throughout(unless you are doing an intentional fade). Highly polished with no irregularities or scratches. All the bright work the same as the paint. Foil or chrome paint even and without flaws. Any black trim smooth, even and no jagged edges. Then make sure that you have all four wheels on the ground and the tires aligned. If the wheels are posed in a turn, the steering wheel should be turned in that direction. The engine should look like the real deal. Wires drooping as they should and in scale. No tarantellas sitting on top of the distributor. No magically floating generators or A/C compressors. An on and on.......... I short, make everything as good as you can, period. No short cuts, no "it's ok" and nothing less than your personal best.Then when you put it on the table, listen up! There will be critiques. Some polite, others not so much, but any time someone has something to say, they have seen something you haven't. You may disagree with them, but look at your model again and see if it could be improved and try to do so on the next model.Last, find a mentor or two or three. Modelers are generally a group of sharing, well meaning people who love to help you improve or just share technique. Don't be afraid to ask questions. At contests do two things. Judge the category you compete in. Critically look at all the models on the table and decide what is good and what isn't. When you find the best model on the table, go talk to the builder and ask questions. Chances are the builder is quite proud of his model and would love to talk about it. When the contest is over, find the judge and ask them to evaluate your model for you. Don't ask them "Why didn't I win!" That is rude and will get you no were. Ask them what they saw on your model and hear what they say. Don't argue! The contest is over! Let is go and try to learn something!Oh an last, don't listen to all the accolades on this or any other board. People have learned to keep quiet on the board and only complement you no matter what your build looks like. Not their fault! To many flame jobs and raving diatribes no matter how well intentioned your build. Take the complements with a grain of salt!This last part is the hardest. My best and worst experience was doing that. One of the great model builders, Drew Hierwater, judged my model early in my career and he did me the favor of critiquing it for me. Hardest thing I ever did was to sit down at the bench and tear, what I though was a great model, apart and redo it. After doing that, I learned so much and the redone model won me an all expense paid trip to Japan, all thanks to a session with a great judge and person.
Ace-Garageguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 Another few words of advice:One, you have to be your OWN harshest critic. Pay attention. Look carefully for flaws, things that are just a little off. Like Pete says, no short cuts, no "it's ok" etc. Hold yourself to a high standard of craftsmanship, and compare your work, brutally honestly, with the work of people whose models you admire.Two, try taking photos, good clear in-focus photos, of your models and look at them on a decent monitor, enlarged significantly. It's the best way I've found so far to locate defects and see things I'd probably miss and let slide otherwise.
bobthehobbyguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) Gotta agree on photos. Pictures will show you things that you will see that the plain eye won't show.Also when you sand away ejector pin marks and mold lines go over those area with luquid glue and then sand them again. This eliminates ghosting. Be sure to prime parts as it is a good check to make sure that you hhaven't missed something.Also when you add detail make sure it is in scale. Nothing iis worse than spark plug wires that look like garden hoses. Reasearch is important to get the correct size for items. Also if you are doing something like a chassis make sure that tubing is the correct size. Again if its not its not going to look right. Edited August 23, 2016 by bobthehobbyguy
BigTallDad Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 This subject brings to mind and old joke. When asked for directions, "How do you get to Carnegie Hall?" an old musician replied, "practice!" Well this is true, but only to an extent. You don't have to have a perfect model, only one that is better than anything else on the table. Normally I would agree with you, but the upcoming Modelpalooza in Orlando judges by different rules (AMPS?). They say "you're competing against yourself" and there might several silver awards but no gold! The best model on the table does not automatically get first place.That reminds me of kindergarten: when using crayons, staying within the lines and using correct colors earns a gold star; staying within the lines and using incorrect colors earns a silver star, and so forth.
plastic-mechanic Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 Normally I would agree with you, but the upcoming Modelpalooza in Orlando judges by different rules (AMPS?). They say "you're competing against yourself" and there might several silver awards but no gold! The best model on the table does not automatically get first place.That reminds me of kindergarten: when using crayons, staying within the lines and using correct colors earns a gold star; staying within the lines and using incorrect colors earns a silver star, and so forth.i tend to come away from a show remembering the models which were created with some imagination. time and practice will hone the mechanics, but imagination and originality can't be bought. models built outside the lines are winners, too.
Snake45 Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 I thought you were asking because of seeing the term "show quality" on eBay or something. I was going to say that like the terms "tactical" in the gun world or "racist" in politics or "awesome" in general, it's been used so often and so incorrectly that it now has no meaning whatsoever.
MeatMan Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 Wow! A lot of good stuff here. Having never created a show quality build, I do know that it takes patience, and attention to detail. Perhaps one day I'll take a shot at one, but as of now those two things elude me. That's why I came back to the hobby in the first place, to improve in those areas so it will help me at work.
Ace-Garageguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) i tend to come away from a show remembering the models which were created with some imagination. time and practice will hone the mechanics, but imagination and originality can't be bought. models built outside the lines are winners, too.Imagination and creativity are great (and the part of the hobby I enjoy the most) but no matter how "original" a model is, if basic things like paint finish and fit and simple neatness are lacking, there's no point in showing up (if winning is part of your desire). Edited August 23, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy
Jantrix Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 I wrote this last year about how to be competitive at contests. Check it out if you've a mind to. It covers a lot of whats been mentioned and some other stuff.
plastic-mechanic Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 Imagination and creativity are great (and the part of the hobby I enjoy the most) but no matter how "original" a model is, if basic things like paint finish and fit and simple neatness are lacking, there's no point in showing up (if winning is part of your desire).i may have overlooked the OP's desire for winning, but rather interpreted his query as "how should i present my efforts in order to not be embarrassed".let's take a hypothetical situation. there are two model builders and each has a brief spot on the local PBS television station. first one, Reverend Grumpy, we'll call him, makes wild, creative, concoctions of all mediums: plastic straws, leftover nuts 'n' bolts garnered from jewelry bought at flea markets, and other materials from household items anyone might have laying about. he demonstrates a rather cavalier demeanor and freely admits his models are a product of his mind. heck, he doesn't even make believe he's a real mechanic or know what the "little round thing on top of the motor" (not engine!) is called. people love his ingenuity and breaking of convention; he's even got a deal with a printer and may be publishing a book - or two - showcasing his works. second builder, Forester Nautilus, we'll call him, has an entirely different approach to his hobby. his sole purpose is to get to the finish line first and he's not a bit ashamed of the fact. why would he? he researches his models beforehand to the Nth degree. he will even paint the needles on the gauges the correct color and not be bashful pointing it out if you don't! one look at his red face and veins bulging on his neck will give you pause to contradict his dogma. his models can only be correct if he casts his own parts from exotic no-obtainium, and has the decals specially drawn by the elves which live in the woods beyond the abandoned mines. people love the realism of his models, oooh and ahhh at his vast collection of trophies, and will even pay him to build models for them. so who's the winner? should one not display his models in fear of criticism my the general populace? if each modeler is pursuing the hobby in the manner which makes him happy, isn't that the whole point? well, that, and having 400 unbuilt kits which will be sold for pennies on the dollar at your estate sale.
Ace-Garageguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) i may have overlooked the OP's desire for winning, but rather interpreted his query as "how should i present my efforts in order to not be embarrassed"...so who's the winner? should one not display his models in fear of criticism my the general populace? if each modeler is pursuing the hobby in the manner which makes him happy, isn't that the whole point? Two things you seem to choose to overlook. One: The point of entering a model car show, to MOST of the entrants, is to compete head-to-head with other competitive modelers...not to redefine what model building SHOULD be in Joe Smythe's philosophy.Two: In order for a modeler to "present my efforts in order to not be embarrassed" there is one overriding consideration. Quality craftsmanship. You don't show up at Bonneville with a showroom-stock Geo Metro and be disappointed because the rules don't allow you to "win", and you don't show up at a model show with a conglomeration of string and snot and expect to "win" either. At least, if you're at all rational.If you're building models PURELY for your own pleasure, and things like scale-fidelity, good workmanship, and an understanding of how vehicles actually function don't matter to you, that's fine and dandy, but keep your stuff for yourself and don't expect to be competitive with people who show their work for the reason the show exists.I think you'll find the consensus definition of "show quality" means above average, significantly, judged on some rather objective ideas of what "quality craftsmanship" means. Until model shows have a class called "craftsmanship doesn't matter, nor does scale, realism or anything else that could remotely be defined as limiting the undisciplined creative urge", you're going to be out in the cold. Edited August 23, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy
Pete J. Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 (edited) The later posts made me go back to the beginning as look at the question being asked. "but what are some of the things that make a car great and will be able to hold up at a model show?" This modeler is not looking at other modelers and their motivation but looking for what makes a model stand out at a show. I think we have covered that rather well, but the main thing in my mind is to do the best you can do, on every part of the model and realize that no one has yet to build the "perfect" model. Everyone has skills that can be improved, techniques unused and creativity yet to be tapped. Every time I go to a show, I try to walk away with at least one or two things I didn't know before and then apply them to the next model. Like most I started with some paint brushes and little bottles of paint, and hobby knife, a tube of glue and a cheap kit. Over time that has evolved into a garage full of parts, tools, compressors, mills, lathes, airbrushes and boxes of very expensive models. The point is, I have evolved in the hobby and every new skill brings me happiness. I love building and creating. I love the challenge of building a model better than the last one. Going to competitions and looking at what others are doing facilitates that. Yea, I have my share of trophies, but they are in a box in the corner. What is out front is the next model along with it's challenges and unfulfilled promise of fun and creativity. That is were the fun happens. Contests are the school room that lets you know what you need to learn. Edited August 23, 2016 by Pete J. .
Ace-Garageguy Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 ...Every time I go to a show, I try to walk away with at lease one or two things I didn't know before and then apply them to the next model. Like most I started with some paint brushes and little bottles of paint, and hobby knife, a tube of glue and a cheap kit. Over time that has evolved into a garage full of parts, tools, compressors, mills, lathes, airbrushes and boxes of very expensive models. The point is, I have evolved in the hobby and every new skill brings me happiness. I love building and creating. I love the challenge of building a model better than the last one. Going to competitions an looking at what others are doing facilitates that. Yea, I have my share of trophies, but they are in a box in the corner. What is out front is the next model along with it's challenges and unfulfilled promise of fun and creativity. That is were the fun happens. Contests are the school room that lets you know what you need to learn. Perfectly stated, at least from my own perspective.
Lunajammer Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 I too, agree the answers here pretty much sum it up. That said, I enter shows with some confidence I'll not be a winner. I build to my comfort and pleasure level and believe they stand up well on the show table. But I'll bring whatever I've got just to be supportive of the host club by adding numbers to the tables. Strive for "show quality" but don't let that inhibit you from participating in shows. Most entrants and visitors still just like seeing models.
High octane Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 LOTS of detail, as there are several builders whose work is photographed and it looks REAL! I also believe that there is NO perfect model, and if the builder doesn't point out the flaw(s), most of the viewers will not find it.
BigTallDad Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 I also believe that there is NO perfect model... Christie Brinkley is very close
Jantrix Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 LOTS of detail, as there are several builders whose work is photographed and it looks REAL! I'll respectfully disagree with this. I've seen box stock models win Best of Show. In my opinion it comes down to, 1. Is it built cleanly? 2. Is the finish outstanding?And by finish I mean the paint and decals on every single part. Those are the keys to winning at contest in a nutshell.
crazyjim Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 I just try the best I can. If I win something, great. If not, oh well. I enjoy talking with the other builders and just seeing what can be done to a piece of plastic.
Tom Geiger Posted August 23, 2016 Posted August 23, 2016 as others have said... do as best as you can. Ask a lot of questions, learn what you can. A lot of what we do isn't magic or high talent, it's just simple things you haven't discovered on your own. Make each model a little bit better than the last one. Listen to the voices in your head. Build the model like you would want to build it in 1:1. This is an art. Develop your own style and devil be damned if others just don't get it.Go to shows to "PARTICIPATE" and don't worry about competing or winning awards. Put your models on the table to share your work with other participants. When someone engages you in a conversation about one of your models, you may have met a new friend. More important than trophies. Have lunch with people you meet there!Early in my modeling hobby, I focused on contests and winning awards. I built what I thought judges would like, rather than what I would like. I was on edge at shows and left either ticked off or elated, depending on how the judging went. I wasn't having fun.When I finally decided it all didn't matter was when I started having fun. Today at shows I display my models and shop a bit. I spend most of my day talking with people and looking at the models. And a funny thing, I still win an award occasionally.
SamBred Posted August 24, 2016 Author Posted August 24, 2016 Thanks for all the great responses, tips, and opinions. It seems like experience is one of the main things just like anything else. Another would be learning from others, talking with builders, asking questions, reading on this forum and watching YouTube. I am new to the hobby and I have a few other hobbies I do but model cars is my newest indoor spare time hobby. Basically I need to get some more builds or a hundred under my belt first and see where it takes me. What made me get into this hobby was I had been wanting to build one for fun so I got on YouTube and then discovered how big the model car community on there was. It got me really interested and the more I watched, the more I got hooked. So maybe one day I could take a car to a show and compete but for now I will continue building and trying to improve and challenge my self.As far as answers I got for things to make a car show quality was: Paint, fitment, making things the right scale, mold lines, detail, and making it look as real as possible!
Ace-Garageguy Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 That's about it. And welcome to the forum and the hobby. It can be a whole load of fun, it can be frustrating at times, it's certainly challenging, it keeps your mind in gear learning new effects and techniques, it improves eye-hand coordination, and it can open doors to learning a vast amount about the history and operation of internal-combustion-powered vehicles.
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