Harry P. Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 I saw a Pinto FC posted "Under Glass" and was surprised to see the model had a standard looking automotive-type battery onboard. I thought no FC had a battery or starter; I thought they connected a remote starter to the blower pulley (isn't that what that "cage" around the pulley is for? To attach the remote starter?) I'm not exactly the world's foremost FC expert. Actually, not even in the top 10... So am I wrong? Did funny cars have batteries and starters at one time?
Nitrozilla Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 If it has a magneto, that's what supplies power once it's started with the hand held starter. As it was explained to me, only F/C's with onboard computers need a battery. That's not my final answer. There may be other reasons I'm not aware of that would require a battery.
ScaleDale Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 Funny cars got their start with match racers who weren't happy with the Super Stock stuff they could get from the factory, so they jacked the c**p out of their stockers. Fiberglass hood and fenders, rear wheels moved foreword to improve traction and injected engines with big stacks sticking out of the hoods. Resin on the track and wheel stand burnouts with no wheelie bars. I saw Don Nicholson put one of these cars on it's back bumper, and I think he did it on purpose. I digress.. These cars were door slammers and had batteries and were self starters. Blowers and remote starters came later. You can buy the original Pinto FC here on Racing Junk: http://www.racingjunk.com/Nostalgia/181880811/1971-COX-PINTO-FUNNYCAR.html Watch it run! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZvNSupZ68s Dale
Harry P. Posted August 12, 2013 Author Posted August 12, 2013 Funny cars got their start with match racers who weren't happy with the Super Stock stuff they could get from the factory, so they jacked the c**p out of their stockers. Fiberglass hood and fenders, rear wheels moved foreword to improve traction and injected engines with big stacks sticking out of the hoods. Resin on the track and wheel stand burnouts with no wheelie bars. Yeah, I know how they evolved, and what they evolved from... but I assumed that once they had evolved to the tubular chassis, flip-top fiberglass body stage of development (the typical "funny car" as most of us define it), they had long ago dropped the battery and could only be started by a remote starter. I had never seen a "modern era" ('70s and newer) FC with a battery (or a starter motor).
Burnout Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 In the beginning they did use onboard batteries. Don't forget, that in the early years (late '60's) racing was closer to "Run what ya brung" and there was a lot of variety. The Polar Lights funny car kits also include batteries but they are meant to be mounted behind the rear wheels.
gtx6970 Posted August 12, 2013 Posted August 12, 2013 (edited) ps, I don't think the remote hand held starter that attaches to the upper blower pulley arrived till mid - late 70's Edited August 12, 2013 by gtx6970
ScaleDale Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 They STILL use on board batteries. They have to have power for the gauges (lights) etc. The mags are self energizing so once the motor is running it's running. The on board Computer systems need battery power also. All the timers are electric/pneumatic requiring power. With out an alternator to have on board power, without a battery these things just wouldn't run the way they do. Paul All of the current crop of funny cars have a large black box just ahead of the engine that holds all of the electronics. It probably has a battery to run everything except the motor. Dale
AZ Boy Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 This is what's in the black box Dale. No battery there.
Harry P. Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 Usually the battery is located behind the driver. The altered we built at Lenco was basically a funncy car 125" chassis with a streamlined Bantam body. Car ran in Comp Eliminator. Esentially a alcohol fc but a smaller motor for weight breaks. Battery was on a tray at the rear of the chassis on top of the rear body pivot/stay behind the seat. Batteries they use these days are a 12v motorcycle battery to save weight. Originally they used 12v most likely group 24 batteries.(that was the common battery in the 60s and made an excellent balast.) Paul But the battery you're talking about is the battery that powers the electronics, not used to start the engine, right? Aren't funny cars started with a remote starter that spins the blower pulley?
DrKerry Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 All top fuel funny cars and top fuel rails of today (from 1970 ish) don't carry a battery. The remote battery or starter that you see in the golf carts, cars etc that pull to the line are the only battery source until the car is fired. Then the magnetos kick in and supply the power to the car until in the shutdown area. Behind the driver is usually a vent system to release the crankcase pressure from the engine and that's usually about it. The remote starting systems locks onto the upper blower belt drive and turns the blower and drive to start the cars of today, then it's unlocked and released from the blower drive. Hope this helps Harry.
ScaleDale Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 (edited) Johnny Gray/Pitch Energy Funny Car butt. The light was bad that day so it's hard to tell what's all in there. Ill check it out at the strip this weekend and report back. A similar car, that is, Johnny will be elswhere. PS: Yes, I was talking about a battery to run the electronics in the box. I don't know about the fuel stuff, but the data logger and clutch timer probably would have internal batteries. Dale Edited August 13, 2013 by ScaleDale
Harry P. Posted August 13, 2013 Author Posted August 13, 2013 All top fuel funny cars and top fuel rails of today (from 1970 ish) don't carry a battery. The remote battery or starter that you see in the golf carts, cars etc that pull to the line are the only battery source until the car is fired. Then the magnetos kick in and supply the power to the car until in the shutdown area. Behind the driver is usually a vent system to release the crankcase pressure from the engine and that's usually about it. The remote starting systems locks onto the upper blower belt drive and turns the blower and drive to start the cars of today, then it's unlocked and released from the blower drive. Hope this helps Harry. Yes, that's what I thought. And that's why I was asking, since the FC model I saw posted (a Pinto, BTW) had a regular old automotive battery mounted right next to the engine, which is what struck me as odd. Your answer confirms what I thought... that all funny cars are started by a remote starter that spins the blower drive pulley.
DrKerry Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 The photo you posted Dale shows the crankcase vent on top, right in front of the fire bottles. Not sure what they have mounted below. I see a wire or two coming out of it.
slantasaurus Posted August 13, 2013 Posted August 13, 2013 The batteries used on modern T/F and F/Cs are only used to power the on board data logging systems. The clutch management systems are required to be pneumatic, not electronic.
tim boyd Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) I saw a Pinto FC posted "Under Glass" and was surprised to see the model had a standard looking automotive-type battery onboard. I thought no FC had a battery or starter; I thought they connected a remote starter to the blower pulley (isn't that what that "cage" around the pulley is for? To attach the remote starter?) I'm not exactly the world's foremost FC expert. Actually, not even in the top 10... So am I wrong? Did funny cars have batteries and starters at one time? Harry...starting around 1970/71, some funny cars retained their on-board starter motors, but had a dual-prong plug setup (usually on the frame near the starter) when a remote battery cart setup could be "plugged in" to run the starter. Shortly after that (within 2 or 3 years), the more common blower drive pulley cage and remote starter motor became the more prevalent setup. I included this "plug" feature in my completely scratchbuilt chassis in in 1970 Charger "Tommy Ivo" funny car set completed early in 1972. I need to check my Fotki folder to see if it is visible in any of the photos I posted. Best regards....TIM UPDATE...OK...you can just see it here....look along the driver's side lower frame tube (top of picture here), halfway between the front axle and the exhaust headers...you can see the two battery "plugs" recessed inside the lower frame tube, just to the right of the remote (in bright red). This was patterned right after 1/1 scale funny cars back then. For more photos, see http://public.fotki.com/funman1712/tim-boyds-124th--12/boyd-scale-funny-cars-/boyd-funny-cars-models/ Edited August 14, 2013 by tim boyd
ScaleDale Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 (edited) The batteries used on modern T/F and F/Cs are only used to power the on board data logging systems. The clutch management systems are required to be pneumatic, not electronic. Not according to the revised 2013 NHRA Rule book Funny car section: "ELECTRICAL COMPONENTS Electrical and electronic components are restricted to ignition systems, data recorders, electrical gauges or indicators, automated fire extinguisher, fuel system, clutch control, and engine-shutoff system components only. The use of electrical/electronic timers to control pneumatic fuel-system valves, and/or electric fuel control solenoid valves, and/or clutch control valves is permitted. Functions of fuel timers, clutch timers, and ignition system must be initiated by wide-open throttle switch only." Tim: Some of the Altereds and dragsters I saw at the Nostalgia Drags a while ago had internal starters with plug-me-in batteries like you mentioned. Dale Edited August 14, 2013 by ScaleDale
Harry P. Posted August 14, 2013 Author Posted August 14, 2013 Harry...starting around 1970/71, some funny cars retained their on-board starter motors, but had a dual-prong plug setup (usually on the frame near the starter) when a remote battery cart setup could be "plugged in" to run the starter. Shortly after that (within 2 or 3 years), the more common blower drive pulley cage and remote starter motor became the more common setup. I included this"plug" feature in my completely scratchbuilt chassis in in 1970 Charger "Tommy Ivo" funny car set. I need to check my Fotki folder to see if it is visible in any of the photos I posted. Best regards....TIM Thanks, Tim. So what I'm getting from these various comments is that funny cars from roughly the early '70s on didn't carry onboard batteries and were remote-started, either via the plug-in that Tim described or the remote starter that spun the blower pulley.
JunkPile Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 I don't really see what is such a BIG deal about this matter of FC batteries
ScaleDale Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 I don't really see what is such a BIG deal about this matter of FC batteries Racers and race fans are a chatty bunch. Give us a battery and we just take charge... Dale
DrKerry Posted August 14, 2013 Posted August 14, 2013 Racers and race fans are a chatty bunch. Give us a battery and we just take charge... Dale LMAO, well said!!!
Harry P. Posted August 14, 2013 Author Posted August 14, 2013 So you could say my question sparked a debate?
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