curt raitz Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 Using the article in the 1st Motor Racing Replica News (Jan/Feb 1991) as a guide, I finally have got the gumption to build a model of the Bugatti Type 32, the "Tank Car". Yes Raul, I've gone totally nuts...it's verifiable. As ya see, there's a bunch of louvers... I'm using .020 plastic for the body panels, was thinkin' about printers plate...but decided plastic was a better medium. Biggest problem I'm encountering is the louvers for this car... I've never done louvers before, does anyone out there have any tips or suggestions on how to make'em? gratefull for any help ya can bring my way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadhawg Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 The club I'm in has a tutorial on our website on making louvers. I've never tried it, but maybe this will help.... http://mountainmodelers.org/tutorials/louvers.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt raitz Posted September 23, 2009 Author Share Posted September 23, 2009 The club I'm in has a tutorial on our website on making louvers. I've never tried it, but maybe this will help.... http://mountainmodelers.org/tutorials/louvers.html thanx i can see this working... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Kron Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 (edited) First off, to Curt, what a fabulous subject to model. Can't wait to see you build it. Secondly, to Tommy, what a clear and workable tutorial. I asked about louvers last year and wish I had seen something this well done. If there's a builder who can get great results from this method I think it might be you, Curt. Go for it! Edited September 23, 2009 by gbk1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raul_Perez Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 Using the article in the 1st Motor Racing Replica News (Jan/Feb 1991) as a guide, I finally have got the gumption to build a model of the Bugatti Type 32, the "Tank Car". Yes Raul, I've gone totally nuts...it's verifiable. As ya see, there's a bunch of louvers... I'm using .020 plastic for the body panels, was thinkin' about printers plate...but decided plastic was a better medium. Biggest problem I'm encountering is the louvers for this car... I've never done louvers before, does anyone out there have any tips or suggestions on how to make'em? gratefull for any help ya can bring my way But the real question should be: "how you're going to attach those really nicely built louvers to the hunk of Pine that you'll be using to craft that stylized body?!!" You are too much!! Good luck, my old friend!! Later, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadkill2525 Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 I'm using .020 plastic for the body panels, was thinkin' about printers plate...but decided plastic was a better medium. If you still want printers plates, let me know. I've got a source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt raitz Posted September 23, 2009 Author Share Posted September 23, 2009 But the real question should be: "how you're going to attach those really nicely built louvers to the hunk of Pine that you'll be using to craft that stylized body?!!" silly putty or maybe that stuff Billy Mays was pitching... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raul_Perez Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 silly putty or maybe that stuff Billy Mays was pitching... For obvious reasons, my vote is for Silly Putty!! Later, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest arni Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 I would love to see a 'Tank' come together,a very interesting subject to model.And that tutorial has been bookmarked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E St. Kruiser50 Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 Hey Curt WHAT A WAY-COOL PROJECT . I LOVE WHAT PEOPLE DO HERE . O.K., if it were me, and I'm the "Massive-Methodical whatever it takes kinda builder", the old AMT 3in1 kits came with strips of louvers as accessories, in white plastic. I would cut singles loose, for the singles on the hood, with a little flange left on each one, make a rectangular hole in the car body hood for each louver the same size as the louver flange, and recess the louver flange to be flush with the panel, so only the louver is raised. Looks like most of the rest are in strips so should be pretty easy to recess those flush in the body so only the louvers stick up. Lotsa work, but so will be the rest of the project - 'sides - YOU ASKED . My 2cts - dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Cole Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Curt- I have only five pics of the 1923 Bugatti T-32 Tank. Hope this helps. If not for the louvers, then perhaps for the build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxer Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 (edited) This looks like an aerodynamic brick. but so cool! The louvers are all inside out.. interesting. That louver tutorial is amazing. I've never seen any better looking louvers on anything plastic! Edited September 24, 2009 by Foxer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ddms Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Terrific subject! My favorite era, scale and type of car. Only Ettore's mama could love the "styling" of his tanks, but they certainly had character. Hope you'll do a WIP. Do you have a source for those tall skinny wire wheels? Recently, I spent quite a bit of time searching for some early wires with no success. The only solution I could find was to cannibalize a diecast. The car looks like it has about 50 lbs. of rivets. I've just finished riveting up my Finescale 1/24 BRM P57, and learned a lot in the process. Here's everything I found out; hope you find it useful: I looked everywhere for rivets. There are some amazingly expensive metal ones out there. There are even decals that are supposed to look like rivets. Don't know how you would hide the film, though. I ended up using styrene Tichy Train Group rivets with .030" heads and .015" shafts. They come on a sprue and are intended for HO train applications. They are cheap - only $2.50 for 200 rivets. The Tichy rivets themselves are fine, but I'm not very happy about the size I chose. They scaled out too big. I think something like an .008" head would be correct. The smallest you can get from Tichy is .020". Scale Hardware has even smaller ones. They sell 100 brass .016" rivets for about $10. They're expensive and harder to handle, but they would look a lot more realistic, especially since there are so many on your Bug. For spacing the rivet holes and punching starters, a good pair of drafting dividers with pin-points on both legs is indispensable! Dividers would also be very useful for spacing those louvers. To look right, a straight line of rivets has to be very, very straight. The tricky part is not so much spacing the holes - that's easy with the dividers - but in drilling the holes in a straight line. I scratched a line in the primer, then, wearing an Opti-visor, I used the dividers to punch pilot holes along the line. Well, I thought I was punching them on the line. The pinholes even looked like they were lined up pretty straight. But then I drilled them (#74) and inserted rivets in the holes. Aaargh! As it turns out, any deviation from the line looks awful. If I were to do it again, I'd use a scribing tool to cut a fairly deep groove - not merely a scratch! - along the entire planned rivet line. (Dymo Tape works well as a cutting guide. Softer tape allows the scribing tool to wander.) Then it's just a matter of stepping the divider down the groove and making a pilot hole at each step. Once the holes are fully drilled, you can sand away the groove. Or fill it with putty. Or both. Obviously, the groove has to be totally "disappeared" before you insert the rivets! Inserting each rivet individually sounds tedious, but it's surprising how fast it goes once you get the hang of it. I use a wet finger to pick them up and needle-nose pliers to insert them. For some reason, the pliers worked better for me than tweezers; I was surprised that they were so gentle with the rivets. I was also surprised at how sturdy Tichy's styrene rivets are. I inserted more than 100 and ruined all of three. So there's no durability advantage to the more expensive metal ones. Instead of dipping each rivet post in glue, I inserted about ten rivets and then applied glue to the backside of the panel - Hurray, no glue on the surface of the car! I used CA, but just about any glue would work. After the glue dries, the rivet shafts inside the panel can be sanded off. Keep in mind that it's very hard to sand or polish an area after it's been louvered or riveted. That will make sequencing your build a bit of a challenge. Best of luck with that Bug! I'll be especially interested in how you end up doing the rivets. Ddms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roadhawg Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 (edited) Best of luck with that Bug! I'll be especially interested in how you end up doing the rivets..... The rivets are the easy part. Archer Transfers makes dry transfer rivets. The armor guys love these things. http://www.archertransfers.com/ Edited September 24, 2009 by roadhawg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbwelda Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 wow thats cool. any progress pics or are the in the workbench section? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt raitz Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 Curt- I have only five pics of the 1923 Bugatti T-32 Tank. Hope this helps. If not for the louvers, then perhaps for the build. thanx for the pictures...I have quite a few already, in fact found a lot of photos online your picture of the interior/distributor, etc is the best i've seen so far Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt raitz Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share Posted September 25, 2009 The rivets are the easy part. Archer Transfers makes dry transfer rivets. The armor guys love these things. http://www.archertransfers.com/ Holy Cow!!! These are fantastic...I was gonna use a "ponce wheel" for the rivets now just gotta figure what size i'm gonna need thanx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ddms Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Holy Cow!!! These are fantastic...I was gonna use a "ponce wheel" for the rivets now just gotta figure what size i'm gonna need thanx Dry transfer rivets may be easy, but it seems like there would be problems. Wouldn't the film border be visible as a raised surface on the car? On that Bugatti, you'd have film borders running all over the place. And if the rivet line is curved, how would you bend the film to follow the curve? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt raitz Posted September 26, 2009 Author Share Posted September 26, 2009 Dry transfer rivets may be easy, but it seems like there would be problems. Wouldn't the film border be visible as a raised surface on the car? On that Bugatti, you'd have film borders running all over the place. And if the rivet line is curved, how would you bend the film to follow the curve? I just ordered a set of these, per the web page...they are a 3-D decal that applies just like regular wet decals. So moving around curves and the film edges should not be a problem. These decals are designed for the railroad and armor modelers and they are a pretty fussy about detail I have the chassis and body panels done, so when I get the louvers and rivet stuff figured out, I will be doin' a thread for the forum on the Bugatti Tank...stay tuned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ddms Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 I just ordered a set of these, per the web page...they are a 3-D decal that applies just like regular wet decals. So moving around curves and the film edges should not be a problem. I hope the dry transfer method works out for you, because it's got to be easier than placing, drilling and inserting individual rivets. But with the dry transfers, you'll have to cut each row of rivets from the sheet. Since you can't trim right up to each rivet individually, each row of rivets will sit on a raised "platform" of film. I can't figure out how all that will not be a problem, especially on your car, which will have many, many rivet rows laid out on flat surfaces. Every row of rivets will be on a raised strip of film. You can see what this looks like on a submarine at http://www.travel-net.com/~gcauley/U673/. The boat was built by the guy who worked with Archer to develop their rivet system. The dark line of film is clearly visible between the rivets. I realize that the rivets on my car are too big, but, as I said in my post, smaller ones are available. Regardless of what aircraft modelers do, I still think the 1:1 method - one rivet at a time - is more realistic. And more faithful to 1:1 practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curt raitz Posted September 26, 2009 Author Share Posted September 26, 2009 I hope the dry transfer method works out for you, because it's got to be easier than placing, drilling and inserting individual rivets. But with the dry transfers, you'll have to cut each row of rivets from the sheet. Since you can't trim right up to each rivet individually, each row of rivets will sit on a raised "platform" of film. I can't figure out how all that will not be a problem, especially on your car, which will have many, many rivet rows laid out on flat surfaces. Every row of rivets will be on a raised strip of film. You can see what this looks like on a submarine at http://www.travel-net.com/~gcauley/U673/. The boat was built by the guy who worked with Archer to develop their rivet system. The dark line of film is clearly visible between the rivets. I realize that the rivets on my car are too big, but, as I said in my post, smaller ones are available. Regardless of what aircraft modelers do, I still think the 1:1 method - one rivet at a time - is more realistic. And more faithful to 1:1 practice. At this point I'm gonna give the rivet decals from Archer a chance, if they don't work out - I'll use my "ponce wheel", if that doesn't work...the model will be built without rivet detail...I will not be doin' individual rivets. I like detailing the models I build, but gotta draw the line somewhere...I'd go nuts doin' a kazillion rivets I'll have to see how much of an edge the strip produces, besides from all the photos I have of this car the body is really rough and nasty...not your typical Bugatti thanx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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