I don't get it!

[mistermodel]

I see no problem with lots of categories, as long as they are clearly defined. Imagine how awful it would be if there were no categories and just one forum with page after page of uncategorized posts and threads...

people would cry about that too

[Harry P.]

It would definitely put MCM in the spotlight!

[mistermodel]

Adding an FAQ section would be a mess. First of all we would need someone to constantly edit it and remove redundant questions.

yep.yep.yep

The #1 question would be where do I post my large scale drag race ranchero

redundancy DEPARTMENT of redundancy

[Brett Barrow]

The "General" section, whether you personally like it or not, is the single most popular section here. If you don't like the "hot mess" that it is, you already know the very simple solution.

That's the reason why we separate stuff into sections here! So that people who are interested in that sort of thing can easily find it, and so those who are NOT interested in that sort of thing can easily AVOID it.

Makes perfect sense to me, Brett. Don't know why it doesn't make sense to you.

Set it up however you want it, I'm just busting chops a little. My 2 cents is that there should be a totally "off-the-reservation" off-topic board (that I personally would avoid like the plaque) where people can post about their private lives and favorite songs and movies, what Hollywood actor just croaked, etc... and there should be a board that is all modeling related all the time. You go to General and see a header like "Bad news" and I think "Woah, what did some model company file Chapter 11, some kit get cancelled, somebody's LHS is closing, etc..." you know modeling related stuff, and then you open it and it's about how somebody's relative died or somebody's girlfriend broke up with them, or their car needs fixing, or they need to have some operation, etc... you know some real-life stuff. I build models and come to places like this to get away from real-life stuff. Put that into its own board, that's all I'm saying, leave it at the top of the page, let it be the most popular part of the forum, I don't care, I just don't see the point of having all of these little hyper-focused sub-boards and then this one big anything-goes fustercluck of a board for everything else. You're on the inside looking out, we're on the outside looking in. Perspectives are different. I know from my job that I get stuck seeing things from the inside looking out and constantly have to rethink my perspective and think about how it seems from the other side.

Anyway my advice, take it or leave it for what it's worth (which is absolutely nothing).

[Harry P.]

I just don't see the point of having all of these little hyper-focused sub-boards and then this one big anything-goes fustercluck of a board for everything else.

Because, like I told you, that big "General" section is the single most popular section of all! And we keep it apart from the "real modeling" stuff so that people like you who don't like it can easily avoid it.

[DrKerry]

It's a funny thing. One of my favorite shows lately is Bar Rescue, a reality show where bar expert John Taffer goes in and tries to save a failing business. In one episode the bar owner is yelling at the customers for talking too loud and they leave. He says he doesn't need customers like those! And then the camera scans around the empty bar. Moral of the story is that you don't chase away the customers.

At NNL East this past weekend, someone pointed out to me that a small diorama was on the race car table. I looked and it had two race cars in it., so the fit was close enough. The show is non-competitive so I told the complainer that there was nothing to gain by grabbing some guy and ticking him off by moving his model. When people asked me where to put their model and it came down to a judgement call I told them to put it where it would make them happy. We could have spent the yelling at people and moving around models. But there was no profit to be gained and we'd just be upsetting the customers. Absolutely totally contrary to our goal of providing a great day for everyone.

Each and every year we make improvements to our show by listening to the suggestions of our customers. Last year someone said it would be nice if we had directions from the hotel to the show hall. This year a stack of them was on the hotel main desk. Last year a vendor complained that he didn't get goodies like the attendees. This year the same goodies went into every vendor pack. This year we had several young guys ask for a Tuner Class, next year there will be one. The whole idea is that we focus on what's important.. making our customers happy. And some folks wonder why we are successful.

Amen, I didn't want to poke my nose into this but you're right Tom. And Harry I'm sorry if I say this and step on your toes by doing so, but for an administer of a strong model car site and magazine such as this. Coming onto the forum and spouting off like you did just makes the magazine, the name and this site look like a crying brawl on a school yard. If you are tired of moving posts everyday there are nicer more grown up approaches to getting the task done. As Tom pointed out the perverbial P#@&*ing off the customers is why I don't frequent as many model forums. I got tired of hearing and seeing the bickering going on between everyone and said enough is enough. I know you try your damdest to make this what it is but you need to rethink how you go about it, because if the opening comment was leaning towards me entering in the wrong place, I wouldn't appreciate it!!!

Again sorry if I stepped on anyones toes by saying this, but we are grown ups!!!!

[Eshaver]

Set it up however you want it, I'm just busting chops a little. My 2 cents is that there should be a totally "off-the-reservation" off-topic board (that I personally would avoid like the plaque) where people can post about their private lives and favorite songs and movies, what Hollywood actor just croaked, etc... and there should be a board that is all modeling related all the time. You go to General and see a header like "Bad news" and I think "Woah, what did some model company file Chapter 11, some kit get cancelled, somebody's LHS is closing, etc..." you know modeling related stuff, and then you open it and it's about how somebody's relative died or somebody's girlfriend broke up with them, or their car needs fixing, or they need to have some operation, etc... you know some real-life stuff. I build models and come to places like this to get away from real-life stuff. Put that into its own board, that's all I'm saying, leave it at the top of the page, let it be the most popular part of the forum, I don't care, I just don't see the point of having all of these little hyper-focused sub-boards and then this one big anything-goes fustercluck of a board for everything else. You're on the inside looking out, we're on the outside looking in. Perspectives are different. I know from my job that I get stuck seeing things from the inside looking out and constantly have to rethink my perspective and think about how it seems from the other side.

Anyway my advice, take it or leave it for what it's worth (which is absolutely nothing).

I think the "Gentleman is onto something bigg !

[sjordan2]

I have no problem with off-topic stuff in General, since I think it adds an extra dimension to our knowledge of other forum members.

As for FAQs, I think we're pretty close already with the pinned subjects at the beginning of "Tips, Tricks & Tutorials." Those topics address by far the most-asked questions and provide links to other related tutorials, etc. around the Internet. If you need any more than that, you'll find plenty of good books with answers, not to mention asking Google. I can't see the forum admins having to deal with such a thing.

Edited April 26, 2013 by sjordan2

[Harry P.]

Amen, I didn't want to poke my nose into this but you're right Tom. And Harry I'm sorry if I say this and step on your toes by doing so, but for an administer of a strong model car site and magazine such as this. Coming onto the forum and spouting off like you did just makes the magazine, the name and this site look like a crying brawl on a school yard. If you are tired of moving posts everyday there are nicer more grown up approaches to getting the task done. As Tom pointed out the perverbial P#@&*ing off the customers is why I don't frequent as many model forums. I got tired of hearing and seeing the bickering going on between everyone and said enough is enough. I know you try your damdest to make this what it is but you need to rethink how you go about it, because if the opening comment was leaning towards me entering in the wrong place, I wouldn't appreciate it!!!

Again sorry if I stepped on anyones toes by saying this, but we are grown ups!!!!

I haven't said anything about this for a long time. Just kept my mouth shut and kept moving posts every single day, time after time after time. I even rewrote the descriptions under the "Q&A" and "Tips" headers to make it absolutely clear what goes where. But even that didn't work. People just kept on posting in the wrong place, and I just kept on moving them without saying a word or complaining about it. Over and over and over and over and over again. Just like I have so far sent out well over 500 PMs to people who don't have their full name in their posts, to many people not once but twice and even three times, explaining something that is clearly spelled out in the rules everyone is supposed to read and agree to before they sign up.

Well, I'm getting a little tired of being not only the mod, but also a babysitter. I'm tired of spending time sending notes to people about their full names, tired of arguing with them when they refuse to post their full names for all sorts of stupid reasons, and tired of moving posts because people can't be bothered with paying attention. And I'm tired of then getting slammed when I ask you guys to just do what you're supposed to do!

[Deano]

I see no problem with lots of categories, as long as they are clearly defined. Imagine how awful it would be if there were no categories and just one forum with page after page of uncategorized posts and threads...

Not like THAT would happen!

[Deano]

Because, like I told you, that big "General" section is the single most popular section of all! And we keep it apart from the "real modeling" stuff so that people like you who don't like it can easily avoid it.

Avoid it?! Why would I do that? It's where I can just about count on getting my "Daily Dose of Drama" !

[Chief Joseph]

Well, I'm getting a little tired of being not only the mod, but also a babysitter. I'm tired of spending time sending notes to people about their full names, tired of arguing with them when they refuse to post their full names for all sorts of stupid reasons, and tired of moving posts because people can't be bothered with paying attention. And I'm tired of then getting slammed when I ask you guys to just do what you're supposed to do!

Maybe take a break? For your own sanity?

[Casey]

I got tired of hearing and seeing the bickering going on between everyone and said enough is enough.

I think that's the #1 thing the vast majority of members here don't want to come here and read-- drama. Be it complaining about how this or that is done or handled, nit-picking someone's build to personally challenge and prove them wrong, saying how his forum isn't as good as another forum, and so on. I don't want to come here and read it, and from replies I've seen, PMs I've received, and what Gregg himself has stated more than once, (almost) nobody else does either. All those types of posts add nothing positive to the forum, and while it shouldn't always be rainbows and sunshine around here, the dramatic posts are going to be frowned upon every time.

[Harry P.]

Maybe take a break? For your own sanity?

Nah. An occasional venting is all I need.

[johnbuzzed]

is the glass half empty, or half full?

neither; it's too big

Nah, there's just not enough water in the glass.

[Brett Barrow]

Because, like I told you, that big "General" section is the single most popular section of all! And we keep it apart from the "real modeling" stuff so that people like you who don't like it can easily avoid it.

But there's modeling stuff in there!!! I'd say it's 50/50. Right now on the first couple pages there are threads on AccMin's ill-fated Cobras, Tamiya Pink Primer, what reissues we'd like to see from Round 2, favorite wheels and tires, photo setups, modeling tools, paint racks, favorite paint brands, etc... those are modeling related topics. As it stands I skim the General and look at headers, if the headers aren't specific, I don't read them. I'd avoid it altogether if it were all totally off-topic, but it's not. Sorry, but a post about Ritchie Havens and a post about model paints shouldn't be grouped together on a modeling board. That's my opinion. One is totally off-topic, and the other is on-topic. I don't care if you make a totally off-topic board and it's still the most popular board on the forum. I would love to have a board that I know to avoid. Leave it at the top of the page for all I care.

Heck, give it a shot, what can it hurt? Do you have to kill a kitten or something to open up a new board on here? I know I'm not the only one who thinks this, maybe I'm just the only one willing to say it? Being on the inside looking out is a different view than the outside looking in...

Or maybe we're just the idiots who can't figure out how to post on a modeling board. Like I said, I'm no rocket surgeon...

[Kaleb]

I'm just wondering, if some of you guys make Harry quit being a mod(in which he dies not get paid). Who or what would get after him? I doubt he would quit, but hypothetically speaking. The next guy in line might just tell you to keep your trap shut and let him do what he needs to do.

[Ace-Garageguy]

......... but we are grown ups!!!!

And as grown ups, shouldn't we be able to take being reminded to observe the rules and pay attention to where we post? Otherwise, we're just like the idiot who gets mad at the cops because he gets a ticket for parking in front of a fire hydrant.

Grown ups should ACT like grown ups, and not a bunch of unruly, self-absorbed babies.

[Harry P.]

But there's modeling stuff in there!!! I'd say it's 50/50. Right now on the first couple pages there are threads on AccMin's ill-fated Cobras, Tamiya Pink Primer, what reissues we'd like to see from Round 2, favorite wheels and tires, photo setups, modeling tools, paint racks, favorite paint brands, etc... those are modeling related topics. As it stands I skim the General and look at headers, if the headers aren't specific, I don't read them. I'd avoid it altogether if it were all totally off-topic, but it's not. Sorry, but a post about Ritchie Havens and a post about model paints shouldn't be grouped together on a modeling board. That's my opinion. One is totally off-topic, and the other is on-topic. I don't care if you make a totally off-topic board and it's still the most popular board on the forum. I would love to have a board that I know to avoid. Leave it at the top of the page for all I care.

Heck, give it a shot, what can it hurt? Do you have to kill a kitten or something to open up a new board on here? I know I'm not the only one who thinks this, maybe I'm just the only one willing to say it? Being on the inside looking out is a different view than the outside looking in...

Or maybe we're just the idiots who can't figure out how to post on a modeling board. Like I said, I'm no rocket surgeon...

How would you do it? A "general" topic for "general" model-related stuff and also a "general" topic for all else? Maybe call one "General Modeling/Automotive Topics" and the other "All the rest?" Is that what you're thinking?

[Harry P.]

And then how do I deal with all the people who will undoubtedly get upset if I add another category because they think there are already too many!

Please Brett... and upset the other guy. Please the other guy... and upset Brett.

See my point?

[sportandmiah]

Harry, I have one suggestion, and this is in all seriousness: Retire from moderating. As you know I was a mod here, and looking back it was the worst job I've ever had. I had no time devoted to modeling. Rather, I spent my modeling time reading and arguing and editing posts and threads. I gained more enemies and headaches than ever. Nowadays I spend more time building and I am a lot more happy. The amount of cars I've built over the past 12 months totals more than I've built in my lifetime.

Pass the torch on to others who will be good as Mods. Let someone else do the dirty work. Doing this will allow you to relax and build.

Merely my two cents.

[Longbox55]

How would you do it? A "general" topic for "general" model-related stuff and also a "general" topic for all else? Maybe call one "General Modeling/Automotive Topics" and the other "All the rest?" Is that what you're thinking?

There's a 1:1 truck site I'm on (http://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthreads/) that has a setup similar to that, with a "General Truck Talk" section (Pre-1973 Chevrolet/GMC Trucks) and a section called 'The Greasy Spoon" for off topic discussion, as well as any automotive/Post-'73 and non GM truck discussion. Otherwise, it's setup very similar to what is being used here. There's virtually no complaining about where different things should be posted, though sometimes posts do get moved if they're in the wrong place.

[sjordan2]

Maybe add a pinned "Off-Topic" subject at the top of "General?" Other boards have that. Nahhh...that would be as carefully observed as the rest of the topics.

Maybe take the pinned threads in Q&A/Tips Tricks, and put them into a third topic called "FAQs?" Nahhh...that would be as carefully observed as the rest of the topics.

If dealing with what we have is too much for some members, imagine what happens when something is changed.

[Ace-Garageguy]

I don't get why Harry's getting slammed for asking adults to observe a set of very simple rules. It's not like he's asking anyone to interpret the d*** tax code and abide by some Machiavellian set of twists and turns. It's simple. SIM-PLE.

Edited April 26, 2013 by Ace-Garageguy

[Harry P.]

"Pinned" topics don't work. Most people ignore them.

I'm kind of liking Brett's idea... keep "General" limited to model-related topics, and maybe have the actual off-topic (my dog died, my wife left me, etc.) stuff down at the bottom of the page... maybe simply call it "Off Topic."