Drake69

I am opening this thread in the hopes that modellers and resin makers can work together to resolve difficulties in such topics as quality, ordering status, and manufacturing delays. Since resin is becoming more widespread in the modeller's toolbox, many vendors have cropped up selling excellent pieces for our kits. Some though have shown less-than-proper-business etiquette and have actually bilked many hobbyists for their money, folded up business, only to come back and do it again. Or, even worse, shoveled sub-par product to modellers and pass it off as "design flaws", "shipping damage", or "customer skill level" work. These problems/issues need to be addressed in a proper format, so in order to meet with the standards of this forum... 1: RESPECT THE RULES OF THE FORUM. NO SWEARING, RANTING, ETC. KEEP IT CIVIL. 2: NO BASHING OF ANYONE (MODELLER/VENDOR) IS ALLOWED. PERIOD. 3: RESPECT THE ART. DO NOT DISRESPECT THE TIME, SKILL, AND EFFORT THE HONEST HARD-WORKING VENDORS PUT FORTH TO PROVIDE THESE RARE PIECES. 4: DEFECTS IN PRODUCT SHOULD HAVE ACCOMPANYING PICTURES IF AT ALL POSSIBLE. IT GOES A LONG WAY TO PROVING A CASE. 5: COMPREHEND THE TIMETABLES THAT A VENDOR ASKS FOR. IF THE VENDOR REQUIRES A MINIMUM OF 4 TO 6 WEEKS FOR PROPER PRODUCT, THEN DO SO BEFORE REPORTING IT. 6: THIS IS STRICTLY FOR RESIN PRODUCTS ONLY. DEFECTS OR INACCURACIES FROM MODELLING COMPANIES HAVE NO PLACE HERE. THIRD-PARTY DECAL MAKING COMPLAINTS SHOULD NOT BE ADDRESSED HERE. MAGAZINE, ADMINISTRATION, OR MODDING CUSTOMER COMPLAINTS NEED LOOK ELSEWHERE. 7: THINK BEFORE YOU POST. HOSTILITY AND ANGER TRANSLATE INTO DRAMA THAT THIS THREAD (AND THE FORUM IN TOTAL) DOES NOT NEED. I really hope this topic serves the purpose for which it was intended. So long as these guidelines are followed this thread should be allowed to stay open, and we will have an honest and open forum to work out our differences. It may be a lofty goal, but for the sake of the hobby, I think it's worth it.

So long as the reason for the threadlock is mentioned, then I have absolutely no problem with it. It's when it magically disappears from the forum that brings into question why it was done. Even a PM from a mod (I know they have lots to do as well, so it's not like they can always do it...) would be enough to explain, if the bashing isn't as apparent. Unfortunately, like the situation with resins, I have been victim of mod-biased supporter before, not with model kits, but with automotive (read: Jeep) forums where the higher the dollar-value of support given by the vendor, the more blatant the deletions. Of course, they make thousands of dollars for custom parts, they can afford to pay up for positive advertising. But yes, this is not a proper topic as it pertains to resin products. I agree I was out of line on that tangent, and I hope for the sake of accuracy we can return to norm. If necessary, I can change the name of the topic to something like "Resin Order Difficulties" in an effort to steer away from the direct "DENCON" issue for a time so that it will encourage others to chime in. Would that be acceptable, or do you think a new thread would be more appropriate? EDIT: NEW THREAD!!!! --> http://www.modelcarsmag.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=44660

And THAT'S why this thread almost didn't get started in the first place. When a vendor pays a support fee to a forum or magazine for advertising purposes, they have CARTE BLANCHE to force the mods and admins to delete anything negative being said about them. Don't let any mod or admin tell you different, apparently it happens here too. It's as bad as the caster's issues themselves, and a great disservice to us consumers that even buy the forum's magazines. Kind of takes the wind out of the sails of "unbiased reporting", doesn't it? Of course, we don't pay for our forum privileges, and only some of us buy the magazine. Money talks.

My grandfather had the exact same setup in powder blue. Since I've been building my family's cars, I think I'll be stealing an idea or two from here (and give you credit for originating it!!!). Beautiful build!

Great suggestion! If I had known that before I painted and dipped it in Future... Ohh well. At least I'm still learning. That trick will really help with another model I have coming up in a while though. And glad you recovered from that decal error. I'm seeing more and more decals like that. I know Revell, MPC, etc... probably doesn't have the time or resources to correct it, but at least they could mention it in the instructions. And I'm also seeing more kits with decals for the engine bay and NOTHING printed in the instructions on placement. I'm now hitting the net prior to building any car just to get reference pix. Imagine how many reference books it would take if there was no internet....

I agree, wholeheartedly. I think that it would be a credit to both customers and resin casters to have something like this done. Then it would hopefully avoid bad situations and sore feelings.

Back up a minute here. If you carefully reread my initial post, you will see that I didn't START to contact him about his delay until March. I placed the order in January, giving him a full two months (4 to 6 weeks???) to work on the item. When I sent the first email, I was courteous and polite about it, and only asked for a possible timeframe, nothing else. 1: Please, by ALL MEANS, provide quotes in this very thread where we have bashed, publicly humiliated, or otherwise demeaned him or his work. I would like to read them, seriously. 2: If threads like this didn't exist, then people wouldn't know the state of his company. If people continue to try and funnel money to him demanding product, he would NEVER be able to dig himself out of the hole he is currently residing in. 3: Hey guys, answering emails and the phone takes time away from resin casting. Hmm.... in the business world this is usually the final straw that breaks a company. Right before that, a flood of reports to the BBB. Maybe enlisting the help of a non-paid family-member to correspond to customers MIGHT be an idea??? Here is a hint, it's already been stated before... COMMUNICATION IS A CRUCIAL ELEMENT TO THE SURVIVAL OF ANY GOOD BUSINESS. Communication is how customers get reassurance that the money, NOT MATTER THE AMOUNT, they shelled out to someone they never met face-to-face is well invested, pure and simple. If a company cannot effectively communicate to its customers? They need to call it quits. Pay the money back to each customer and fold the business. Yes, they ARE providing extremely rare pieces, but it's NOT LIKE SOMEONE ELSE CAN'T DECIDE TO EITHER REPRODUCE THE SAME PIECE OR DESIGN A BETTER ONE. Not a sleight on his talents, but there are other resin casters out there that are just as good as him that can do it, and make a tidy profit. So, please illustrate you point on our "bashing". I'm absolutely rife with curiosity over this.

There are two tricks in using Keith Marks decals... 1: They are VERY thin. Make sure to dip the decal in water for no more than 2 to 3 seconds. This will be more than enough time to slide it off for placement. Fingers should be damp, not soaked, when handling the decal for placement. Any excess water can tear the decal. 2: Being done on laserjet paper, they have no defined borders. Unlike Revell, MPC, and others, Keith's decals have no clear definable border to show where the decal ends. This means you need to cut the decal close for a clean fit, OR you can leave enough space for the tweezers to grip the decal, slide it off from the paper, and then trim off what is not used. Everything else applies with the exception of Micro Sol and Micro Set (if you happen to use these...). Micro Set can be used SPARINGLY without trouble but be very careful with Micro Sol. The thin decals can tear apart easy enough, using Micro Sol can weaken them further if over used. Other than that, they're a cinch to use and make a muscle car look awesome!

From another website, a written mail from Tamiya America...

Nope, you CAN see it, especially if you look how it's sitting on the table with the left rear jacked up. I wouldn't even know where to begin with this one.

That makes me cry. The WORK that would have to go through... just to be usable. If I had hair before, I wouldn't have any after that.

I should have corrected myself. Yes, they ARE BEING RELABELED and WILL BE RE-RELEASED, but they are definitely not following any particular timetable, and this comes from Tamiya America. DIRECTLY. They were to have the primers back into the market by mid-May, but the last email I received from them has no listing of a date. When I went to my local hobby shop for Semi-Gloss Black (figures...), I was told that there was no more black product until they get relabeled, and other colors to follow based on popularity (like whites, metals, chromatics, etc...).

I've had a lot of correspondence, all good, from many of you regarding this situation in particular, and greater issues as a whole. I have also had correspondence with other resin dealers that actually do understand where I and others are coming from. It has really opened up my eyes on the resin business and made me see that it isn't the first 2, 3, or 4 times that defines the industry, but the overall long-term experience that does it. In addition, I now see that an editor has experienced the same levels of frustration I have as a lowly modeller, and in an odd way it makes me feel better about my own. As I've stated in my very first post, I have the upmost respect for those guys that take their time and resources to create a product that otherwise would not be available on the open market, or at the very least be more cost prohibitive than it should be. In the best of views, all resin companies should be able to enjoy the wealth of their labors without worrying about tight times, all decal companies should do the same, and all modellers should have access to the fruits of that labor to produce works of art, but it doesn't always work that way. But stepping back and looking at this from all angles does help a lot. Now, to the business at hand. As far a DENCON goes, since I'm only down a small amount of money, I am content to let it ride, almost until the cows come home, just to see how far this goes for Matt Conte. For other modellers that have paid their hard-earned sums of cash, it is completely up to you how long you feel the need to wait before you pull your funds. I DO RECOMMEND that you do eventually reclaim your money for non-delivery of product, or how else will Matt get the message that we as a community are not pleased with his service? I would also ask, and this is completely up to you, to spread by word of mouth the current situation with DENCON. I know it's visually apparent on his website that he is struggling, but to continue to hawk wares on eBay when so many people have paid him good money is pretty callous. And if someone mentions DENCON as a reference for a specific part, make sure to point out Matt's status so that others don't fall in the same pit. Third, don't do what I do. DO YOUR RESEARCH. If there is any NEGATIVE TALK about a particular resin dealer, research the situation, get in touch with that individual if possible, then talk to the resin dealer. Get both sides of the story before making any purchases, especially if it is an extensive amount of money. If $5.00 to $20.00 is an acceptable loss for you, go ahead and test it out if you like, but be sure to spread the word if things go south, or the community will never know who to trust. I think that's all I can offer at this point. Really, someone needs to write an in-depth article in MCM on proper dealings with resin makers so that people understand the issues on both sides and not just from a no-money-no-product standpoint. The potential customer needs to respect the resin dealer's delays as much as the dealer needs to keep to his timetables. Communication is always key in business transactions, which will go a long way it assuaging a customer's concerns. If a dealer is too busy to convey reasons for long delays, or if he does not answer at all, red flags need to go up immediately. And if the quality of the work is sub-par, the dealer either makes it right or make other compromises with the customer, again by keeping the lines of communication open. And only after the customer has exhausted all avenues with getting the dealer to respond, only then does he "go public". This will avoid embarrassing situations on both sides of the fence and give each a voice to be heard. I think that about covers it. I'll be watching this thread for awhile for responses from everybody so please voice your cares, concerns, gripes, etc. And definitely correct me on anything wrong, I can take it.

For those that know, Tamiya primers were removed from the market in January this year (some say earlier...) supposedly over warning labels not consistant with California State laws. Now, the black paints are getting WAY scarce, starting with the Semi-Gloss Black. Just an FYI. Expect other commonly used colors to follow suit in the near future.

I can agree to this, but when it happens to be the FIRST TWO (AND ONLY TWO) RESIN COMPANIES I've ever dealt with, it is a natural knee-jerk reaction. But like I said, I did retract some of my statement as it pertains to Time Machine Resin, especially when he went out of his way to call me direct and explain his situation. That shows real effort and dedication on his part. The real issue here is forum members still recommend DENCON for parts, so people who DON'T KNOW what's happening get put in these situations. As for the money? It's $15.00 TOTAL. I think I can afford to let that ride to the fall/winter before I act on getting it back. Why? Because it keeps him on the hook for making good on his promises. If he continually fails to deliver, or if I see my part listed on fleaBay (the part is a grille for a 1970 Hemi Barracuda, the original "two-headlight" one and not the one with the added vents in the "teeth", in case anyone knows how I can get this piece WITHOUT wrestling it from DENCON...), then it will go a long way to discredit his particular operation and serve as a warning to others. The other concern I have is when a forum (NOT THIS PARTICULAR FORUM, NOT YET ANYWAY... THE INITIALS FOR THAT ONE ARE S. A. E. !!!) deletes threads that speak out about particular resin companies and their lack of product. It's as if the forum or magazine (and they ARE affiliated...) is trying to sweep the problem under the rug so that people are kept in the dark about that particular resin company. Obviously, it adds to the aggravation and makes the forum moderators and admins look as dirty and underhanded as the resin dealer. So, add up everything I just typed in, couple that with viewing websites of product you can never get your hands on, PLUS seeing other "more important" people (like the builders IN the magazines that magically get their product from these dealers so that they can perform works of art for their respective magazines...) getting what they want and when they want for their modelling deadlines, PLUS seeing the names of the resin companies flaunted about all over these magazines especially in the vendor area, and you've have ONLY A TENTH of what some of us go through. So rather than just defending all the other resin companies that I haven't tried, why not show an INKLING of sympathy for those of us that go through this? Maybe, MAYBE, if I happen to grace your resin company (an ASSUMPTION here, since the way you worded your statement shows undeniable support for someone...) and get to meet you, I won't feel like you're just as deceitful. Agreed? This I can definitely agree on.

Well... apparently I have my answer. This is direct from their website and really should be stickied.....

Anyone had any success with Dencon this year??? I have an order I placed back on January 23rd and have not received it yet. I sent through and got an email back from Matt Conte back in late March saying he had lost the order, but nothing on when or if it would be shipped (after I sent him a picture copy of the invoice). I sent another email at the beginning of May, have heard nothing back from him, and it's rapidly closing in on June at this point. This is my second attempt at dealing with resin makers. The first was with Time Machine Resin which took a while, but with direct communication I was able to understand his situation and got a nice piece to boot (AGAIN TMR, thanks!!!!). Although I can't and won't hold anything against him now, I'm reaching the "fed-up point" to where I don't even want to waste my time and/or money with any of them. Let me preface ALL THIS by saying I have patience and understanding for the time, work, and detail these guys put into these pieces. It is a DEFINITE SERVICE to the modelling community that these guys offer these rare or non-existant items for our kits. AND, I know I'm not the ONLY ONE to wait a long period of time for a resin part, some people have had to wait a year or more, and for bigger orders than mine. But why have a freaking website and show off a bunch of nice pretty pictures of parts you CAN NEVER TOUCH, or EVER BUILD?!?!?!?!?! EDIT: COUNTDOWN TO WHEN A MOD OR ADMIN DELETES THIS THREAD IN ...5 ...4 ...3 .......

Yeah... I've got a Nova that's SCREAMING for some "Death Proof"... /thread hyjack...

Thank you... just bookmarked them!

Almost brings a tear to your eye, especially if you found this neglected beauty in weed-overgrown backyard. Definitely sweet weathering!!!

I'm going to be watching this topic like a hawk. I have three different Charger kits and am planning on a similar build, but it probably won't have as much of the PE detail as this one. It WILL start with the '68 body with the MPC and Revell '69 kits as needed to flesh it out, so I'll be leaning heavily on this one. Haven't read all the way through the thread yet, are you using Keith Marks decals for this one?

Let me clarify the above post. I bought the "Duster Street Machine" when I already had the Dodge Demon resin kit, but there were Viper wheels in the kit. I liked the form of the Duster/Demon body so much that I bought another "340" kit to work on (which I'm doing now...), and robbed that kit of its factory wheels/tires for a more accurate Demon. So, basically all I have left is the "340" kit, currently being built, the Viper wheels/tires from the "Street Machine" kit, and these wheels/tires from Revell. Again, if anyone has a set of the factory wheels and tires, PM me!

Thanks for the comments!! Ok. Decals are on the body and I'm prepping it for a dip in Future... NOTE: I've already cut out the "clear" decal windows from the taillight area, glad I spotted that and put the decals on BEFORE final build!! The instructions really need to make that known... And a shot of the Duster with my Sublime Green Demon, which is waiting for decals... Now I have the Viper wheels that came in the "Duster Street Machine" kit, but those look terrible compared to the factory wheels that came in the "340" kit. I had to use the normal wheels/tires in the Demon build along with the engine, chassis, glass, and other parts (which was why I bought that kit in the first place...), so I pulled out my parts box and found these wheels/tires from one of the Revell MotorCity kits... If I use them, this would be more like a restomod car (have already set up the rear axle with riser blocks for proper fitment, can remove them if need-be...), but what I really want are those factory wheels. Anyone have a spare set for trade?

I've gotten pretty far along with this project so I decided to take a few WIP pics. Color is Black on Tor Red (Hemi Orange to Dodge owners...), and also includes a vinyl top courtesy of Model Master paints and BMF. After the car was hit multiple times with Tor (Red, or Hemi Orange, for now just saying "Tor"...) and setting for 48 hours, I masked off the fenders and trunk then hit the top with alternating Tamiya Flat Black/Semi-Gloss Black for a darker look than what flat black alone could provide. After I had that cleanly down,I masked the top hood and window sills area and sprayed 2 coats of Model Master Black Vinyl paint on it, but couldn't get it to look "vinyl" enough. I then grabbed the MM Fabric Gray paint (Fabric Tan can also be used...) and sprayed a single coat on the top, let it dry 2 hours, then hit it with Vinyl paint again. MUCH better...... And a quick shot of the engine. A shot of the undercarriage with a fast pass of flat black spray for a dirtier look... And a better shot of the engine... And before I could pull up the masking tape, I laid down a silver trim line where the vinyl would meet the metal... And last set of shots for now. I used BMF to cover the small thin silver line and give it a straighter edge look to it. The last picture was taken by my Blackberry because it was easier to see the vinyl look in that pic than in the others... Next: Working on a "Halloween" interior!!!!