Harry P. Posted July 20, 2015 Author Posted July 20, 2015 Hmmm.... in your photo above, it looks like the radiator shutter mechanism is to the right of the center support rod, which is where you would expect it to be, as the firewall mounting for that rod is to the right of the engine.Yet the kit has this detail molded onto the radiator to the left of center.I looked through your RR thread, and saw that your radiator also has this mechanism to the left of center... but your photo above seems to appear to have it right of center. Did you move it?As is, the control rod would have to cross over the engine from right side to left side, which can't be right.Do you understand my question? I'm confused...
Cato Posted July 20, 2015 Posted July 20, 2015 (edited) I sure did move it, per Marvin's kind instruction. Dunno why Pocher put it there unless for a left hand drive car. Huh? Why would they do that??. Anyway, Egon's '29 reference shot shows it the way I have it. I think mine does not align with what I assume is the control knob in dash center. But who's gonna pick that nit? Knob could have been under dash too.I closed the left side, drilled and cobbled links on the right. So it is aligned correctly with the firewall linkage.At some later point in P II production, RR went to thermostatic shutters so none of this. Confusicating ain't it?? Edited July 21, 2015 by Cato
Harry P. Posted July 21, 2015 Author Posted July 21, 2015 Ok, knowing you moved it explains things. I'll do the same.
sjordan2 Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 Is the kit shutter control manual or the later automatic? Or does that have anything to do with the position?
Harry P. Posted July 21, 2015 Author Posted July 21, 2015 Photos I have show a rod running from the firewall to the radiator (not the center support rod, but a second rod)... so my guess is it's manual.
sjordan2 Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 According to the PII owner manual, "On chassis series previous to JS-1 (built July 25, 1931), the radiator shutters are hand-operated by means of a lever on the left-hand side of the instrument board. A thermometer arranged on the instrument board indicates the coolant temperature of the engine, a small red lamp warns the driver when the temperature conditions of the engine require adjustment. "So any dashboard reference with manual indicators and lever would be from a car built before July 1931. The automatic version will have a thermometer on the dash and not the red lamp and lever.Whatever the year, the shutters should be closed when starting the engine.
Cato Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 It's important to remember the Pocher car is an amalgamation of features seen at various times in production. You can't pin it to one year, series number, chassis number or anything.The carb, gas tank and shutters are other examples. Plus the 'mystery' Sedanca fenders. We can only hope to build 'representative' models. That's why we're both not 'wrong' in interpreting our cars to our ideals.
sjordan2 Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 (edited) The only real substance of my post was to point out that there would be different elements on the dash between automatic and manual shutter control versions. The rest is just high-falutin' stuff to back up my observations. Just to be anal, Harry is basing his on the 1934 Star of India, so that would have an automatic shutter control. But we all know that Pocher used a lot of parts over on different models. If the chassis, etc., are all the same, that would explain why I've seen a complaint about the Star of India kit that the doors don't match the 1:1. Edited July 21, 2015 by sjordan2
Harry P. Posted July 21, 2015 Author Posted July 21, 2015 I'm pretty sure the engine/chassis on Cato's "1931" and my "1934" are identical. Like Cato said, Pocher RR kits are a mashup of various model years, and are not 100% accurate. So I'm adding the manual control rod and then will just say my model represents a pre-July 1931 car!
Cato Posted July 21, 2015 Posted July 21, 2015 The only real substance of my post was to point out that there would be different elements on the dash between automatic and manual shutter control versions.But we all know that Pocher used a lot of parts over on different models. If the chassis, etc., are all the same, that would explain why I've seen a complaint about the Star of India kit that the doors don't match the 1:1. Your observations about reference and and equipment are always welcomed.The Pocher India's rear doors are too high and distorted and bear no resemblance to 1:1. Must have been an engineering difficulty that forced that. Also the door posts. Face it; it could not have been easy to kit design for accuracy in the late '70's compared to today.
Harry P. Posted July 21, 2015 Author Posted July 21, 2015 Hmmm... just as soon as I moved the radiator shutter mechanism over to right of center, I looked through Cato's RR thread and saw where Skip shows that the mechanism was located to the left of center, on both LHD and RHD cars. Oh well, too late now. No way am I moving it back to the left side. And if it is supposed to be on the left side in all cases, and the car had the manual shutter control system, how did the control rod on the right side of the car control the mechanism on the left side of the radiator? I'm so confused...
Cato Posted July 22, 2015 Posted July 22, 2015 Hmmm... just as soon as I moved the radiator shutter mechanism over to right of center, I looked through Cato's RR thread and saw where Skip shows that the mechanism was located to the left of center, on both LHD and RHD cars. Oh well, too late now. No way am I moving it back to the left side. And if it is supposed to be on the left side in all cases, and the car had the manual shutter control system, how did the control rod on the right side of the car control the mechanism on the left side of the radiator? I'm so confused... Rest easy Harry. As I said, virtually anything we do will be something that was done by RR sometime. Here's your proof:
sjordan2 Posted July 22, 2015 Posted July 22, 2015 I suspect that both images show the auto thermostat.
sjordan2 Posted July 23, 2015 Posted July 23, 2015 (edited) I suspect that both images show the auto thermostat. I went back to both the RHD and LHD manuals and the caption shows that both are indeed the automatic version. I don't have any reference on the manual version, but I did find a couple of dash shots that have a chrome T-pull on the left side. Edited July 23, 2015 by sjordan2
Lovefordgalaxie Posted July 25, 2015 Posted July 25, 2015 Yep, this is the best Pocher build I've seen.
Harry P. Posted July 27, 2015 Author Posted July 27, 2015 (edited) I added a wooden frame around the cowl and windshield. On the inside, I used stain to paint the "burled wood" detail on the dash. I also added the upholstered kick panels... Edited July 27, 2015 by Harry P.
Harry P. Posted July 27, 2015 Author Posted July 27, 2015 Now that I have the front fenders, running boards, and cowl/firewall permanently installed, I can go ahead and build the doors. The hard part (fitting the floorboard to the chassis, fitting the fenders and cowl, and building the rear structure to replace the kit "sheet metal") is finished. Now I have solid reference points on which to base the doors. Now that the rear side walls of the body are in place, and the cowl has been permanently mounted, and the position of the front seat bulkhead and door posts has been established, I know exactly where my door openings are, and can proceed accordingly.
cobraman Posted July 28, 2015 Posted July 28, 2015 Great progress. Maybe you will get used to building every summer. Perhaps not. : )
cobraman Posted July 28, 2015 Posted July 28, 2015 Have you ever featured any of your builds in the magazine ? I have had a subscription forever and don't recall ever seeing one. If not you should think about doing some. Maybe you have and I just don't recall.
Kit Basher Posted July 28, 2015 Posted July 28, 2015 This is coming along great, Harry. I love the way you did the "burl" on the dash. If you ever want to play with some real wood veneer, just let me know. I have literally a ton of the stuff, and I would be happy to send some to you. Carry on! I'm looking forward to some more woodwork.
sjordan2 Posted July 28, 2015 Posted July 28, 2015 This just gets better and better, and may be your masterpiece.
Harry P. Posted July 28, 2015 Author Posted July 28, 2015 Have you ever featured any of your builds in the magazine ? I have had a subscription forever and don't recall ever seeing one. If not you should think about doing some. Maybe you have and I just don't recall. No, never have had anything of mine in the magazine. Seems sort of a "conflict of interest" to me. This is coming along great, Harry. I love the way you did the "burl" on the dash. If you ever want to play with some real wood veneer, just let me know. I have literally a ton of the stuff, and I would be happy to send some to you. Carry on! I'm looking forward to some more woodwork.Thanks. I am using real veneer on the body, but I faked it on the dash because real burl veneer would be hopelessly out of scale. I can get away with using real birch veneer and basswood on the body because the grain isn't very obvious, so I can stain it and get away with it looking "in scale."
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