Peking to Paris Rally CBP

[Pete J.]

5 hours ago, Jhedir6 said:

I'm using Pirelli's from a Subaru WRC car (gravel version) They're a bit smaller and a tiny bit wider then I'd like but havent found anything else I like. I was looking at SpotModel too for some tires, which ones did you order? I may wait to see what the ones you ordered look like. I was going to get a set from Indaycals Shapeways store and he even split the F1 set and made a file with just the front tires so I could order multiples of the fronts so I could have 2 sets for the car and a set of spares, but the new prices has made the "fronts" file almost as much as the full set of 4.....meaning with shipping I'd have to spend almost $90 CDN for 6 tires.

Please let me know what tires you ordered Pete or post a pic when they arrive please.

I just ordered these.  It takes a couple of weeks for them to get here from Spain but when I do get them I  will let you know what I think. 

The first set I ordered were these.  This was back when I was going to do a Porsche.  I'm not sure I would use them on the Alfa.   The tread pattern is a little light for rally tires.  We will see the the others look like. 

[Foxer]

I  got much cleaned up and stripped on the '21 LaFrance Speedster. I cut the rear metal body down with small bed sides for stowing gear. The hood side will be cut thru the louvers to allow the exhaust pipes to pass, very similar to the blue one I'm using for inspiration. The running boards all around have been removed and the pump under the seat removed and replaced with a wood box ... might metal finish this with access door.

The front cowl needs to be made completely. Hopefully hand formed plastic will work.

[MeatMan]

1 hour ago, Foxer said:

I  got much cleaned up and stripped on the '21 LaFrance Speedster. I cut the rear metal body down with small bed sides for stowing gear. The hood side will be cut thru the louvers to allow the exhaust pipes to pass, very similar to the blue one I'm using for inspiration. The running boards all around have been removed and the pump under the seat removed and replaced with a wood box ... might metal finish this with access door.

The front cowl needs to be made completely. Hopefully hand formed plastic will work.

 

Oh yeah, that's a sweet looking project!!

[Harpo]

I'm in.  Is a 1931 Rolls Royce Phantom okay?  If so, #31.

[Jantrix]

22 hours ago, Foxer said:

I  got much cleaned up and stripped on the '21 LaFrance Speedster. I cut the rear metal body down with small bed sides for stowing gear. The hood side will be cut thru the louvers to allow the exhaust pipes to pass, very similar to the blue one I'm using for inspiration. The running boards all around have been removed and the pump under the seat removed and replaced with a wood box ... might metal finish this with access door.

The front cowl needs to be made completely. Hopefully hand formed plastic will work.

 

Mike, I'd no idea that you were starting from a metal model. Very impressive.

9 hours ago, Harpo said:

I'm in.  Is a 1931 Rolls Royce Phantom okay?  If so, #31.

Yer in!

[Aaronw]

On 11/18/2018 at 8:27 AM, Foxer said:

I  got much cleaned up and stripped on the '21 LaFrance Speedster. I cut the rear metal body down with small bed sides for stowing gear. The hood side will be cut thru the louvers to allow the exhaust pipes to pass, very similar to the blue one I'm using for inspiration. The running boards all around have been removed and the pump under the seat removed and replaced with a wood box ... might metal finish this with access door.

 

The front cowl needs to be made completely. Hopefully hand formed plastic will work.

 

 

That quite a car. Are you basing it on a Yatming diecast?

 

 

Edited November 19, 2018 by Aaronw

[Foxer]

3 hours ago, Aaronw said:

 

That quite a car. Are you basing it on a Yatming diecast?

It's a 1/32 Signature Models - 1921 American LaFrance Fire Pumper Engine. Being a 1/24 addict I probably should have used the yat-ming but I found it too late.

 

 

[da_ashman]

Heres a few pics from the kit im building - 71 Nissan GTR 2000

A really really good kit from Tamiya, (which I believe was designed & first released in the late 90s...), This is the more recent re-release "Street Custom" version.

Comes with a nice photoetched fret & some turned metal intake trumpets for the carbs!

 

This is the additional "street customs" parts that are new to this kit, really nice Watanabe wheels + oil cooler & lip.

Also comes with a driver figure which I really like.

 

Body is nice & crisp

Great detail in the kit too!

More soon!

 

Ash

[stavanzer]

Dang, Ash! Thanks for the preview of the kit. I might have to look this up and get one. Looking forward to seeing what you do with it.

[Jantrix]

Okay guys. Here's hoping we all get some bench time this weekend. I plan to. 

I don't get online much on weekends from home so if anyone has any questions for me, postem up today. 

To date, assuming Oldcarfan pics a subject, we have 18 people signed up. And many are folks that aren't among our usual suspects from the Cannonball CBP. New talent is always good and I'm glad to see it. 

Nothing inspires your fellow builders like your own progress and that is the difference between a successful CBP and ones that fade away in three months. So post up photos as you go. I expect we'll see a lot of innovation and that will also keep people fired up. 

[Pete J.]

Ok, last chance for decals!  I have 4 slots left and I am going to run them this weekend.  I need a PM with your number Before Friday please.  This is my project while the rest of the Fam is out Black Fridaying!  

Edited November 21, 2018 by Pete J.

[Pete J.]

1 hour ago, Jantrix said:

Okay guys. Here's hoping we all get some bench time this weekend. I plan to. 

I don't get online much on weekends from home so if anyone has any questions for me, postem up today. 

To date, assuming Oldcarfan pics a subject, we have 18 people signed up. And many are folks that aren't among our usual suspects from the Cannonball CBP. New talent is always good and I'm glad to see it. 

Nothing inspires your fellow builders like your own progress and that is the difference between a successful CBP and ones that fade away in three months. So post up photos as you go. I expect we'll see a lot of innovation and that will also keep people fired up. 

Rob, I may be setting myself up for failure but would it be OK to run a dual entry?  I found my Porsche from a friend, but would still like to run the Alfa.  If that is ok  I would like to run the Porsche as #49

[Jantrix]

On 11/21/2018 at 9:39 AM, Pete J. said:

Rob, I may be setting myself up for failure but would it be OK to run a dual entry?  I found my Porsche from a friend, but would still like to run the Alfa.  If that is ok  I would like to run the Porsche as #49

Sure. There is no limit on entries for this CBP. 

[Aaronw]

I'm building an OOB stock Model T roadster as a warm up to re-familiarize myself with the kit while I plan the official entry.

I've been going through my copy of Henry's Wonderful Model T by Floyd Clymer published in the late 1950s which is a great resource for the Model T. Also nosing around Model T forums.

 

Tentative plan is to add a Livingood 4x4 conversion with a 3 speed Warford auxilliary transmission. That gives 6 speeds forward, 3 in reverse. Will add rear wheel drum brakes (a stock T just has a single driveline brake). Contemplating front brakes, but there are apparently some structural issues related to that.

 

I'm still looking at my options for warming up the engine, there seems to be a fair amount of speed equipment in kit form between the Model T and A kits. Most of these parts were first made for the T and continued in use with the later Model A and B 4 cylinders.

 

I found a youtube video of a mildly hotroded T, and simply adding a high compression head (still a flat head, not OHV) and 3 speed aux transmission allows him to cruise long distances at 65mph, so I should have no trouble meeting the 50mph minimum speed. 

 

 

I haven't done any of the Cannonball builds, is there any rule or etiquette against seeking help from the general populace of this site for information? I'm not a hot rod guy, I have some ideas but I know we have a lot of guys on the site who live, eat and breathe hot rod stuff. Unless that is frowned on, I will probably start a post in General to get some help building an appropriate vintage T engine suitable for an endurance racer.

  

 

On 11/19/2018 at 2:56 PM, Foxer said:

 

 

Even in 1/32 it should be a respectable size model. 

 

Edited November 23, 2018 by Aaronw

[Foxer]

I doubt there's any problem asking for help here, we all just love to talk cars ... just try and stop us!  I'm not much help with a Model T but just wait ...  !

[MeatMan]

14 hours ago, Aaronw said:

I'm building an OOB stock Model T roadster as a warm up to re-familiarize myself with the kit while I plan the official entry.

I've been going through my copy of Henry's Wonderful Model T by Floyd Clymer published in the late 1950s which is a great resource for the Model T. Also nosing around Model T forums.

 

Tentative plan is to add a Livingood 4x4 conversion with a 3 speed Warford auxilliary transmission. That gives 6 speeds forward, 3 in reverse. Will add rear wheel drum brakes (a stock T just has a single driveline brake). Contemplating front brakes, but there are apparently some structural issues related to that.

 

I'm still looking at my options for warming up the engine, there seems to be a fair amount of speed equipment in kit form between the Model T and A kits. Most of these parts were first made for the T and continued in use with the later Model A and B 4 cylinders.

 

I found a youtube video of a mildly hotroded T, and simply adding a high compression head (still a flat head, not OHV) and 3 speed aux transmission allows him to cruise long distances at 65mph, so I should have no trouble meeting the 50mph minimum speed. 

 

 

I haven't done any of the Cannonball builds, is there any rule or etiquette against seeking help from the general populace of this site for information? I'm not a hot rod guy, I have some ideas but I know we have a lot of guys on the site who live, eat and breathe hot rod stuff. Unless that is frowned on, I will probably start a post in General to get some help building an appropriate vintage T engine suitable for an endurance racer.

  

 

 

Even in 1/32 it should be a respectable size model. 

 

Hey Aaron, I don't believe 4x4 is allowed in the P to P. Your other mods seem okay.

[Aaronw]

3 hours ago, MeatMan said:

Hey Aaron, I don't believe 4x4 is allowed in the P to P. Your other mods seem okay.

 

 4x4 utility vehicles are specifically not allowed, but there is nothing stated in the rules about 4x4 conversions. I mentioned that possibility in my initial post and it wasn't shot down, although it is possible Rob missed the question. 4x4 conversions have been available for the T since 1917, and they use a modified rear axle for the powered front axle.

 

Not a huge deal if it turns out to be against the rules, I'll just go with a 2 speed rear axle in that case. The T is still quite capable in 2WD, but 4x4 would add some visible flair up front.

 

 

Oh, and anyone interested in adding to the engine discussion I've made a post here. 

 

Edited November 24, 2018 by Aaronw

[Jantrix]

I've no problem with the 4x4 mods if it was an available option back then and it fits the rules.

A note though.  The P2P is a 5500 mile rally. Was the period 4x4 equipment robust enough for that level of use?

 

[Aaronw]

Unfortunately I can't find any kind of serious torture testing, as it was years before the military was interested in a jeep like vehicle and of course who today is going to do that to a vintage vehicle. It appears it was a pretty advanced system and built as tough as the rest of the car. I haven't been able to find anything warning current owners to baby them and there are some videos of them playing pretty hard. There were only a few hundred made, and a fair number are still on the road which is a pretty good sign of their durability.

Unusual for an early 4x4 it could be set up as a full time or part time unit. I'd think a part time system would save a lot of wear and tear when not needed. Since it used a modified rear axle on the front, that part should be as tough as the rear. The T is a fairly light vehicle, running skinny tires and I expect only 35-40hp, so stresses are relatively light.

 

Short answer I don't know, but I'm assuming yes.   

[MeatMan]

8 hours ago, Jantrix said:

I've no problem with the 4x4 mods if it was an available option back then and it fits the rules.

A note though.  The P2P is a 5500 mile rally. Was the period 4x4 equipment robust enough for that level of use?

 

Okay, so what is meant by this in the rules? Not trying to muddy the waters, just clarification for myself.

"Commercial or military
vehicles such as light trucks, vans, ambulances, pick-ups
and utility 4x4 vehicles are not eligible."

[Jantrix]

I believe that rule is more concerned with the utility aspect of the vehicle than the fact that it has four wheel drive. I'm going to allow this as long as the Model T is a passenger vehicle. 

[Aaronw]

4 hours ago, MeatMan said:

Okay, so what is meant by this in the rules? Not trying to muddy the waters, just clarification for myself.

"Commercial or military
vehicles such as light trucks, vans, ambulances, pick-ups
and utility 4x4 vehicles are not eligible."

 

I took the underlined as referring mainly to Jeeps, early Broncos etc which some might argue are passenger vehicles rather than light trucks. While definitely a fringe case I'd think one could probably make a decent argument for a Willys Jeepster. Way more passenger than utility vehicle.    

 

[MeatMan]

2 minutes ago, Aaronw said:

 

I took the underlined as referring mainly to Jeeps, early Broncos etc which some might argue are passenger vehicles rather than light trucks. While definitely a fringe case I'd think one could probably make a decent argument for a Willys Jeepster. Way more passenger than utility vehicle.    

 

Got it!

[Harpo]

4 hours ago, Aaronw said:

 

I took the underlined as referring mainly to Jeeps, early Broncos etc which some might argue are passenger vehicles rather than light trucks. While definitely a fringe case I'd think one could probably make a decent argument for a Willys Jeepster. Way more passenger than utility vehicle.    

 

I'm pretty sure the Willys Jeepster was only available in rear wheel drive, no 4x4.

[Pete J.]

If you go to the real  P2P web site I think it is very clear that anything with a large cargo space is excluded.  There are no station wagons, SUV or other vehicles that can carry prodigious amounts of stuff!  Even hatchbacks seem to be excluded.  You may argue that a 240Z is a hatchback but if you are familiar with the vehicle, the hatch is really limited in space.  You can put more in the rear of a four door 41 Ford than you can get in that car.  No utility trailers or caravans.  Just what you can stuff in a trunk, passenger compartment or roof rack.   That is why pickups seem to be excluded with one exception in one year.  The intent seems to me to be a endurance test of a "standard" passenger car, two or four seats and a trunk.