'51 Studebaker, Peking to Paris Rally (community build project)

[mikemodeler]

Is this what you are going for? Those look like 5 lug wheels?

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

2 hours ago, mikemodeler said:

Is this what you are going for? Those look like 5 lug wheels?

 

That's about it, but I mentioned early in the thread "Six bolt wheels required because of the GM truck rear end swap, in the spirit of how it might have been built in the pre-Ford 9" days. Front hubs would be drilled to match so as to only carry one type of spare wheel".

Just FYI, GM truck rear ends were used in lotsa stuff pre-'57 when the Ford 9" and the equally tough new Olds and Pontiac rear ends were introduced, where ultimate strength was more important than unsprung weight. The original SWC Willys coupe is the first example that comes to mind.

While unsprung weight would be an important consideration for running on rough roads at 50MPH+, the ultimate strength of the axles themselves, and the wheels, might take precedence...depending on the preparation philosophy of the particular car builder. Race-car prep is always about compromise and tradeoffs.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy
TYPO

[mikemodeler]

Any updates Bill?

[Ace-Garageguy]

13 minutes ago, mikemodeler said:

Any updates Bill?

She's moving along and getting photographed as we go, but I'm running a series of adhesive tests to verify performance I need for the real-world projects...and real-car work takes priority.

I typically load a batch of real and model photos from the same camera to the editing suite on another computer when enough has been accomplished on a real-car project to justify a billing cycle. We're not there yet.

I used to run another camera for models only, but it needs one of the battery contacts repaired, which isn't a priority.

Thanks for your interest.

[Bullybeef]

Interesting work going on here! 

[mikemodeler]

19 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

She's moving along and getting photographed as we go, but I'm running a series of adhesive tests to verify performance I need for the real-world projects...and real-car work takes priority.

I typically load a batch of real and model photos from the same camera to the editing suite on another computer when enough has been accomplished on a real-car project to justify a billing cycle. We're not there yet.

I used to run another camera for models only, but it needs one of the battery contacts repaired, which isn't a priority.

Thanks for your interest.

Thanks Bill, looking forward to seeing the updates. My great Uncle Ernie had a Stude like this one and the only racing he did was to the liquor store on Friday night to stock up for the weekend!

Do you use a photo hosting site for your pictures? I am not familiar with them as I build so slow that I rarely take pictures of my work so I didn't know if they cost money to use as you referenced "billing cycle" and am thinking they charge you every time you post pictures there.

[Ace-Garageguy]

3 hours ago, mikemodeler said:

Do you use a photo hosting site for your pictures? I am not familiar with them as I build so slow that I rarely take pictures of my work so I didn't know if they cost money to use as you referenced "billing cycle" and am thinking they charge you every time you post pictures there.

I do use a remote hosting site for some photos, I keep them all on my own drives as well, and I use this site for photo hosting for this site only.

But my reference to "billing cycle" was to ME billing MY real-car clients when sufficient work on either current project has been accomplished on one or the other to justify ME billing MY CLIENT. My billings include highly detailed written documentation of the work performed, with supporting photographs.

I currently use the same camera to document my real-car work and my model work, and I only load batches of photos from the camera to my in-house computer storage and photo-editing suite when there's enough work completed on the billable real-car work to justify all the additional work it requires to prepare billing documentation, including photographs. A real-car billing cycle typically represents two hundred or so photos, and there'll typically be 10 to another hundred model photos sprinkled among them.

Therefore, I don't load small batches of model work as I do it, but wait until there's enough photo-documented real-car work in the camera memory to justify ME billing MY client.

So...I'll upload more photos to this site after I've completed enough real-car work to justify loading the camera storage into the computer at my home.

 

[mikemodeler]

Thanks Bill.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Blobular chassis trimming and cleanup almost complete.

First new rear axle test fit. Unit is for 6-bolt wheels mentioned earlier, from Revell '41 Chevy pickup. Spring spacing is spot-on. Interior underside with trans tunnel is now visible.

Interior opened up and disassembled. Interesting design, as door cards are molded flat, integral with floor, then folded up and glued in place.

I'll be opening the rear deck, and as the casting is quite thick, there's no easy way to save the decklid, so I made a fiberglass mold of the area. When the mold is cured, I'll make a copy of the original deck. Those familiar with my earlier work will have seen something like this many times.

To get acceptable strength in a part that's only about .020" thick when finished (the mold is about twice that), I use a very high strength aircraft epoxy that HAS to be mixed on a gram scale.

[Bullybeef]

It’s good to see you spending time at the bench Bill

[Ace-Garageguy]

11 hours ago, Bullybeef said:

It’s good to see you spending time at the bench Bill

Thanks. It keeps me a little saner than I'd be otherwise.   

[mikemodeler]

Nothing like making things harder Bill! That should be interesting to see the marriage of the two materials, not to mention detailing the trunk area. You are a far braver person than I am for undertaking such a project. Will this complicate the build and keep you from meeting the deadline?

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

5 hours ago, mikemodeler said:

...Will this complicate the build and keep you from meeting the deadline?

I'd planned to open the decklld almost from the beginning, so it won't slow things unless there's an unforeseen problem. I've made a lot of f'glass parts for models in the past, so I'm not expecting any issues this time.

The group build runs to the end of the year, I believe, and even if she's not 100% done, I'll have something to show for my effort, and I'll have enjoyed it.

This is becoming typical of me, however. The initial plan was just to do a decent curbside with nice paint and decals, roof and deck racks, brush-guards, raised suspension, and some tarped camping gear and spares on the racks. But lately I've been researching full flow oil-filter rigs for the Stude V8, swapping in a Borg Warner T10 with a steel hydroformed-style bellhousing, big Lincoln drum brakes up front, etc. etc. etc. 

Nuts.   

[mikemodeler]

Wow. I am happy with a few add ons, have never considered full on custom stuff like you are, would be too worried about getting bogged down in the details and never finishing it. I already have a pile of WIPs that are 90% done and most of them are box stock.

[Ace-Garageguy]

With the blobules removed from the frame, I could go ahead with reconstruction of a reasonable facsimile of the stock rails, using styrene blocks fitted in place.

 

Screw holes on chassis plate are being filled too.

 

Chassis reference from owner's manual tells me the model designers did a pretty good job, all things considered:

 

Decklid mold popped easily off of rear of body shell. PVA mold release works every time.

 

Edited October 15, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy

[mikemodeler]

13 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

I'd planned to open the decklld almost from the beginning, so it won't slow things unless there's an unforeseen problem. I've made a lot of f'glass parts for models in the past, so I'm not expecting any issues this time.

The group build runs to the end of the year, I believe, and even if she's not 100% done, I'll have something to show for my effort, and I'll have enjoyed it.

This is becoming typical of me, however. The initial plan was just to do a decent curbside with nice paint and decals, roof and deck racks, brush-guards, raised suspension, and some tarped camping gear and spares on the racks. But lately I've been researching full flow oil-filter rigs for the Stude V8, swapping in a Borg Warner T10 with a steel hydroformed-style bellhousing, big Lincoln drum brakes up front, etc. etc. etc. 

Nuts.   

Not familiar with the term Steel Hydroformed-style bell housing, is it a special kind of bell housing? Aren't they all steel?

[Ace-Garageguy]

2 hours ago, mikemodeler said:

Not familiar with the term Steel Hydroformed-style bell housing, is it a special kind of bell housing? Aren't they all steel?

Lotta OEM and aftermarket bellhousings are cast iron or cast aluminum.

They don't do much to contain an exploding flywheel, a very real possibility in drag racing.

The steel hydroformed bellhousings were introduced as safety scattershields a long time ago by Lakewood, others.

Of course they function as trans adapters too...so since I might have to run an adapter to mate the 4-speed Borg Warner to the Stude V8 anyway (though Stude did use 3-spd and 3+OD BW gearboxes, so maybe not), might as well use the toughest one available.

https://www.shoppok.com/ventura/a,43,304570,Hydroformed-Bellhousing----200--Thousand-Oaks-.htm

"Hydroformed" was the name given to a special deep-drawing process used to form them from one single piece of steel plate.

Edited October 15, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy

[mikemodeler]

Makes sense now. I remember a friend in high school ( 40 years ago!) was talking about a motor he was building and how it had a scattershield. Until you mentioned it I forgot all about it. I'm guessing you would consider using one on this type of car because it is considered a race car and it is a piece of safety equipment?

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

10 minutes ago, mikemodeler said:

...I'm guessing you would consider using one on this type of car because it is considered a race car and it is a piece of safety equipment?

Total overkill for this kind of "racing", which is really a kinda slow rally...but what I wrote above: "Of course they function as trans adapters too...so since I might have to run an adapter to mate the 4-speed Borg Warner to the Stude V8 anyway (though Stude did use 3-spd and 3+OD BW gearboxes, so maybe not), might as well use the toughest one available."     

[Joe Handley]

5 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

Total overkill for this kind of "racing", which is really a kinda slow rally...but what I wrote above: "Of course they function as trans adapters too...so since I might have to run an adapter to mate the 4-speed Borg Warner to the Stude V8 anyway (though Stude did use 3-spd and 3+OD BW gearboxes, so maybe not), might as well use the toughest one available."     

Considering the kinds of abuse these cars take, it probably wouldn’t be a bad idea to have on a car like this. 

[Ace-Garageguy]

21 minutes ago, Joe Handley said:

Considering the kinds of abuse these cars take, it probably wouldn’t be a bad idea to have on a car like this. 

Yup. 7000 miles of bad road could certainly crack a cast bellhousing...

[Joe Handley]

2 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

Yup. 7000 miles of bad road could certainly crack a cast bellhousing...

Yup, that’s why if I ever do that ‘70 Charger kit like this, it will have a Dana 60 out back and looking at fabbing something like that for it too would be a good idea!

[Ace-Garageguy]

Shaping of the frame rails progressing. Roughing work done with a barrel sander in the Dremel. Final shaping is done with hand-files, sandpaper.

After the shape is right, a cardstock transfer template is used to trace the outline on the other side, insuring symmetry.

Taa daaa...both sides match.

Axle fitting again, to check available clearance at new up-and-over section of frame rails.

Mocked up in the body shell, with interior in place. Side clearance of tire in wheelhouse is adjusted. Axle needed to be narrowed slightly, just as you'd do on a real car. Inner fenders will be shaved a little, to allow me to move tires about 1/32 inch outboard on each side when the brake backing plates go in.

Initial ride height is checked, by comparing relationship of wheel to fender opening in early mockup. We're pretty close already.

Edited October 16, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy

[Bullybeef]

Productive day! 

[Ace-Garageguy]

De-bloburization of chassis continues. Screw holes 'bout done. This basic technique will make a decent chassis from just about any early blobular screwbottom.

Decklid mold edges taped and coated with PVA release agent. Blob of brown clay in the corner is a Q&D repair of a void where I missed stippling the first layer of glass for the mold down real nice on the body. We'll see if it's salvageable.

2 layers of .010" glass layup in mold

Decklid popped out, rough trimmed.

Same rough-trimmed f'glass deck with a coat of self-etching primer to show up flaws. Divots where trunk handle / license lamp mounts will be drilled, emblem will be sanded off, pinholes filled. Repair area in LH corner will be fine with a little work, so I won't have to make another mold.

Initial layout of parts for engine / gearbox. Engine is from AMT '53 Stude kit, bellhousing, Borg-Warner T10 trans, and shifter are AMT parts-pack. I believe the trans is a little overscale, but I've never measured and don't really care at this point.