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Fire investigation unit


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Dom: that is going to be a nice unit.  Can I make a suggestion to you?  I notice you are going to have to fill and sand the cab corners quite a bit.  If you can get a piece of PVC pipe (3/4" diameter) you can slice it length wise into quarters and it will make a nice round corner that will be the same on both sides and you won't have to fill and sand to get smooth.  Will be watching your progress!  Looks like a lot of fun! 

If you check out the Pierce Tower in the WIP section you will see what I mean about using the pipe.

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Thank you for the advice, I am going to try  the pvc pipe out. I was not satisfied with the curve of the cab corners. Hopefully the 3/4 pipe will give me more of what I am looking for.  I am also wondering if I can modify the trumpeter eagle grill and headlight assembly to fit this cab, any thoughts on that would be appreciated.

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4 hours ago, Firebuilder said:

Thank you for the advice, I am going to try  the pvc pipe out. I was not satisfied with the curve of the cab corners. Hopefully the 3/4 pipe will give me more of what I am looking for.  I am also wondering if I can modify the trumpeter eagle grill and headlight assembly to fit this cab, any thoughts on that would be appreciated.

Any particular cab that you are making?  Replicas and Miniatures makes a lot of photoetch truck grill stock that you might use.  I think it would be difficult to modify the Eagle grill and headlight assembly because of the curvature.  The AMT LaFrance kit has separate headlight surrounds you might use.  They are not square but still might work.  

Charlie

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Nice start. I am always happy to see fire apparatus being made.

 

I have an E-One cab that has been on my stalled project list for so long that it has ended up being used as a bench top storage bin... Anyway a tip that I was given back then (mid 2000s) that I used on it, was to back up the corners to be curved with square stock so I had enough meat to sand out the shape of the corners. The interior corners are mostly under the dash and above flooring so will not be visible once complete.

 

I have used Charlie's PVC pipe idea on another build to provide rounded top corners on a body. The ends were going to be left open for draft hose storage so I needed them to be of a set thickness. That also worked out quite well. I used smaller diameter styrene tube, rather than PVC pipe simply because that matched the curve and thickness I needed.

 

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1 hour ago, Chariots of Fire said:

Any particular cab that you are making?  Replicas and Miniatures makes a lot of photoetch truck grill stock that you might use.  I think it would be difficult to modify the Eagle grill and headlight assembly because of the curvature.  The AMT LaFrance kit has separate headlight surrounds you might use.  They are not square but still might work.  

Charlie

Here's the Pierce cab with the PVC corners

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This is the cab which I am trying to copy as. Lose as I can get it .  Still a long way to go, picked up the 3/4 pvc pipe, and will also be using a few other ideas from Charlie. Never thought to use solder for window trim.   Thank you all for the positive comments and suggestions.  

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Dom:  I checked out the Trumpeter ALF grill.  It looks like the ALF headlight cluster would work for you.  Difference is that the grill is not right.  I'd cut the headlight cluster free and look for a new grill that would resemble the Ferrara.  They would have to match the PVC radius so some adjustment might have to be made.

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Thank you Charlie , I pulled out one of my trumpeter kits and will start working on the cutting the headlight bezels off and trying to figure out a grill.  Work on the cab has been slow, did not get much done this weekend, except for sanding off the excess putty on the seams and cutting off the corners. Have to cut the PVC pipe today and rebuild the front. Will post pictures when I get all the completed

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I took Charlie’s advice and replaced the front cab corners with the 3/4 pvc pipe. The corners are much cleaner now, just slight sanding and filling. The Top of the cab at roof line also worked out much better. Just a little more filing to refine the curves. I am thinking of attempting to resin cast the trumpeter grill, so I can make multiple headlight bezels and won’t ruin the grill to the kit, which I can still use on that cab. Trying the resin casting will be another first for me.

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Progress continues, very slowly. A lot of trial and error, mostly error on the  cab interior.  I am Trying to figure out a dashboard , but  so far I have scrapped most of what I have come up with. It’s More complicated than I thought it would be.  

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Good morning Charlie,

I am working off photos only, no actual measurements.  The interior is  completely different than the Trumpeter interior. The other problem with that is , I didn’t even think of using that as a base until you suggested it and I looked at your photos of modifying it. The cab was already built  and is about 1/4 inch narrower in width than the Trumpeter and the  wheel well openings are also off.  I found some better photos last night and see a few other spots I need to correct on the floor and dash area.  How do you make  all of the light switches and other detail items in the   Control panels?  Thank you for your help. It is greatly appreciated!

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Look in your stash for old truck dashboards that might have some butterfly switches.  I also use common pins for push/pull switches.  I drill holes for them wherever they are to go, paint the panel and then insert the pins. The monogram 1/32 scale CF Mack dashboard has a line of switches.  They are small but if put in the right place would be ok.  The speedometer and tach dials along with oil, temp, fuel, water, etc I do with decals and then surround them with photoetch bezels.  Use clear lacquer to secure the bezels.  The clear will look like a glass face.  A lot of it is getting it to look right and not necessarily with every switch and dial there is.  Once you enclose the interior bucket there are only so many things you can see, unless you intend to open the doors.  That's another story.

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Charlie ,

Thank you  again for the great advice. My dashboard stash is limited, but I will see what I have . As for the  rest of the dash, I am not  looking to make  it exact, I just want the proportions to look  right. There  are a lot of compound angles and curves from what I can see in the photos . So far what I have built either looks to big, or just does not look right. The angles seem  off. I agree  with you ,once enclosed,  Not much will be seen,  so  I  won’t go  to far with details.  Lol, and no, I am definitely not having opening cab doors. Maybe on future cabs once my cab building skills have improved! It sure would be nice if a new kit, maybe with an aerial device was produced, there is only so  many models you can build with the amt and trumpeter kits before  getting bored with them. The  few resin kits  out there are expensive,  and trying to find just a resin fire cab is nearly impossible. I have seen some  1/25 scale 3D printed cabs,  but the  cost of  the cab at  $400.00 plus, is what led me down this road trying to scratch build my own.

Dom

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2 hours ago, Firebuilder said:

Charlie ,

Thank you  again for the great advice. My dashboard stash is limited, but I will see what I have . As for the  rest of the dash, I am not  looking to make  it exact, I just want the proportions to look  right. There  are a lot of compound angles and curves from what I can see in the photos . So far what I have built either looks to big, or just does not look right. The angles seem  off. I agree  with you ,once enclosed,  Not much will be seen,  so  I  won’t go  to far with details.  Lol, and no, I am definitely not having opening cab doors. Maybe on future cabs once my cab building skills have improved! It sure would be nice if a new kit, maybe with an aerial device was produced, there is only so  many models you can build with the amt and trumpeter kits before  getting bored with them. The  few resin kits  out there are expensive,  and trying to find just a resin fire cab is nearly impossible. I have seen some  1/25 scale 3D printed cabs,  but the  cost of  the cab at  $400.00 plus, is what led me down this road trying to scratch build my own.

Dom

I was on EBay yesterday and someone had listed a fire engine cab, not sure if that would be any help. 

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I know of no one who is making modern fire engine cabs.  Not a lot of call for them.  I've built two custom cabs from scratch, both Pierces but other builders cabs are quite similar.  Not sure if manufacturers are still putting out line drawings on their calendars or not.  They used to do one for every photo that put on the calendar face.  Great information there. 

The cost of 3D printed cabs would be a lot and I'm not convinced the quality is there yet.  Surfaces of most 3D printing still is rough and it takes a lot to smooth them out.  The amount of effort to do that on top of the initial cost makes me lean to the scratch built option.  

Keep doing what you are doing.  I think you will be surprised at the final results.  The one thing you have not commented on yet is how you are going to do the windshield pieces.  Any thoughts?

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I have no idea yet on the windshield, I  read your build thread and see you made a buck , and then vacu formed. I  can make  the buck, but not sure if I should do it in a one piece or  two piece windshield. I don’t’  have anything to vacu form with,  and I still have to research how to do that at home if possible and what would be needed.  I did see a vacu forming machine on micro mark, but it’s a big investment for maybe just a few windshields, and I am not sure that is what would work for this . If I make the buck out of a block of wood, would it be to  much grain? I  found some Ren on a website and was thinking of ordering it and using that if it would be smoother. I also saw how you used that to  make your grill, which is something  else I have to tackle. I did make the mold for the trumpeter grill and lights, just waiting for the hobby shop to get in the resin. Once that is cast, i will cut the bezels free from the grill. I hope  mold I made came out ok, it’s the first attempt at  making a mold and casting a part.  For now  I am going to wet sand the cab, ending up with 3000 grit and then Get a coat of primer on and see what needs touch up.

Dom

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Thank you Gary , I will check it out, for this build a cab won’t help, but for future projects it  may. I also keep a look out, and when I see one at a fair price I pick them up. But  most on EBay  that I find are older cabs, nothing 2010 or later. SSB resin shows up once in awhile  with a more modern  rig , but those are full kits, and  hard to buy multiples.

Dom

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3 hours ago, Firebuilder said:

I have no idea yet on the windshield, I  read your build thread and see you made a buck , and then vacu formed. I  can make  the buck, but not sure if I should do it in a one piece or  two piece windshield. I don’t’  have anything to vacu form with,  and I still have to research how to do that at home if possible and what would be needed.  I did see a vacu forming machine on micro mark, but it’s a big investment for maybe just a few windshields, and I am not sure that is what would work for this . If I make the buck out of a block of wood, would it be to  much grain? I  found some Ren on a website and was thinking of ordering it and using that if it would be smoother. I also saw how you used that to  make your grill, which is something  else I have to tackle. I did make the mold for the trumpeter grill and lights, just waiting for the hobby shop to get in the resin. Once that is cast, i will cut the bezels free from the grill. I hope  mold I made came out ok, it’s the first attempt at  making a mold and casting a part.  For now  I am going to wet sand the cab, ending up with 3000 grit and then Get a coat of primer on and see what needs touch up.

Dom

The secret with making a buck for vacu-forming is that it has to be super smooth for it not to pick up the image of the buck.  The only thing that worked for me was to glue down a piece of thin brass sheet over the buck and then polish it out really smooth.  That kept the clear plastic smooth and clear after forming. 

After the grill mold has cured well take some photos of it so we can see how it came out.

Charlie

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